New DIY Two Part Recipes with Higher pH Boost

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I've done 4x concentration, the issue I ran into was it would settle in my sump like a gel. So I had to add powerhead to get some turbulence to properly mix.

Thanks for the info. That makes sense as it is very dense when highly concentrated.

 

[ReeferMadness01]

Sorry if this has been answered. When dosing the ca/mg which should I base my calculations on?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Sorry if this has been answered. When dosing the ca/mg which should I base my calculations on?

Base the initial doses of the calcium part and my DIY part 3 (if you are using that) on the alk dose.

Only adjust the calcium dosing over time up or down to stay within your target range. Do not stop using it just becuase you are at your target. Only stop dosing it if calcium keeps rising too high.

The third DIY part (if you use it as opposed to Balling Part C, which is better), base it too off the alk or calcium dose. 610 mL per gallon of one of the other two.

The third part (if you use it as opposed to Balling Part C, which is better), which is not just a magnesium supplement, but also balances the chloride and sulfate, is designed to be dosed at a fixed rate to the other parts. 610 mL of it per gallon of the alk or calcium part. The fact that you can adjust it does not mean that you should. Most high end commercial two parts have the functionality of this third part built into the other two and cannot be adjusted.

I do not recommend dosing the third part based on magnesium.

If you need corrective doses to fix low magnesium, do it.

If there is a problem with high magnesim, it might be worth checking why, and test error is msot common, but if magnesium is already higher than your target, stop using the third part, and test your salt mix for excessive magnesium.

 

[ReeferMadness01]

I mixed this up last night and did 1.5x on mag/ca.

 

[Asthix]

My provider runs out of Calcium chloride anhydrous, bought the Dihydrate(food grade) as below without paying attention:

Would that be appropriate to dose in a tank? What would be the weight i should use considering the higher content of water? I've seen +25% but wanted to make sure.

Thanks

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

My provider runs out of Calcium chloride anhydrous, bought the Dihydrate(food grade) as below without paying attention:

Would that be appropriate to dose in a tank? What would be the weight i should use considering the higher content of water? I've seen +25% but wanted to make sure.

Thanks

The recipe in this thread is designed around the dihydrate.

 

[Asthix]

The recipe in this thread is designed around the dihydrate.

Yes i (now shortly) know, but about the contaminant specified in the table, would see any danger to dose that?

By the way, i was dosing since 3 years with anhydrous using the dosage for dihydrate, CA was always on the lower side, considering it was supposed to be +25%?
About 2.5dKH per day for 2 years at least, SPS dominated.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Yes i (now shortly) know, but about the contaminant specified in the table, would see any danger to dose that?

By the way, i was dosing since 3 years with anhydrous using the dosage for dihydrate, CA was always on the lower side, considering it was supposed to be +25%?
About 2.5dKH per day for 2 years at least, SPS dominated.

Everything in the table, except the water, is a less than specification and is fine.

The moisture differences may be part of the reason some reefers say they do not dose 1:1 to maintain alk and calcium.

 

[Asthix]

Everything in the table, except the water, is a less than specification and is fine.

The moisture differences may be part of the reason some reefers say they do not dose 1:1 to maintain alk and calcium.

Thanks a lot for your detailed answer as usual, you help the community a lot, and I dug more and more in the DIY chemistry because of cost, I do prefer to invest in better material or animal if possible.

 

[WhatCouldGoWrong71]

@Randy Holmes-Farley good morning!

I am going to follow your recipe titled “

Second New DIY Two Part Recipe with Higher pH Boost”​

Using sodium hydroxide. I currently use BRS standard 2/3 part with TM balling medium dose. Couple quick questions:
1) is a BRS mixing jug adequate for the rodi+sodium hydroxide? (I read some of the threads and I have small dogs that I am concerned about, screw the hardwood floors )
2) Can I ease into each part, meaning. As I run out of a BRS part switch to your recipe so that would mean as I transition I would have some parts the BRS (yours) standard recipe and some parts this new recipe?
3) Can part A from TM balling be mixed in with sodium Hydroxide?

I searched for some of this and did readily see it, I apologize if I am asking redundancy. As always, I really appreciate your continued help, we all do.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

@Randy Holmes-Farley good morning!

I am going to follow your recipe titled “

Second New DIY Two Part Recipe with Higher pH Boost”​

Using sodium hydroxide. I currently use BRS standard 2/3 part with TM balling medium dose. Couple quick questions:
1) is a BRS mixing jug adequate for the rodi+sodium hydroxide? (I read some of the threads and I have small dogs that I am concerned about, screw the hardwood floors )
2) Can I ease into each part, meaning. As I run out of a BRS part switch to your recipe so that would mean as I transition I would have some parts the BRS (yours) standard recipe and some parts this new recipe?
3) Can part A from TM balling be mixed in with sodium Hydroxide?

I searched for some of this and did readily see it, I apologize if I am asking redundancy. As always, I really appreciate your continued help, we all do.

Balling Part A is calcium. It cannot be mixed with hydroxide, bicarbonate, or carbonate additives.

Yes on (2). That will work fine.

If you mean this jug,

Mr. Chili Mixing Jug - 1 Gallon Jug

The perfect 1-gallon jug for mixing and storing 2-part or any other liquid solutions. There are many different methods for extracting the liquid out of the jugs from manual pump-top dispensers to drilling a hole in the cap and feeding your tubings through the hole down to the bottom of the jug...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

BRS claims the jugs are polyethylene, which chemically is OK. Just be sure to add the solid slowly to substantial water so it does not get too hot and melt the plastic.

 

[WhatCouldGoWrong71]

Balling Part A is calcium. It cannot be mixed with hydroxide, bicarbonate, or carbonate additives.

Yes on (2). That will work fine.

If you mean this jug,

Mr. Chili Mixing Jug - 1 Gallon Jug

The perfect 1-gallon jug for mixing and storing 2-part or any other liquid solutions. There are many different methods for extracting the liquid out of the jugs from manual pump-top dispensers to drilling a hole in the cap and feeding your tubings through the hole down to the bottom of the jug...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

BRS claims the jugs are polyethylene, which chemically is OK. Just be sure to add the solid slowly to substantial water so it does not get too hot and melt the plastic.

So this is what I currently do: and below is what I have been mixing together. I was thinking I could sub the Soda Ash for Sodium Hydroxide. Reading I can’t mix A with Ash has me confused, sorry, I’m better with numbers


BRS Pharma Balling Method Soda Ash Liquid Alkalinity - Fill a 1-gallon container 4/5 full of RO/DI or distilled water and then add 2 1/3 cups (381 grams) of BRS Soda Ash into the container. Secure the cap on the container and shake it for about 10 seconds to help start the dissolving process. Remove the cap and add the desired amount of Tropic Marin Pro Coral Trace A- (80ml low demand, 160ml medium demand, 330ml high demand system), fill the container the rest of the way with RO/DI or distilled water. Give the container a few more shakes and then let it sit until all the salts have fully dissolved before use.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

You can mix any normal alk supplements. Sodium bicarbonate (baking soda), carbonate (soda ash, washing soda) and sodium hydroxide.

Tropic Marin says part A is calcium, which cannot be mixed with any of these.

Balling Components | Produktinformationen

www.tropic-marin-smartinfo.com

“To use the Balling method all three components are necessary: Calcium chloride dihydrate (part A), sodium carbonate/bicarbonate (part B) and sodium chloride free sea salt (part C).”

The thing you quote is talking about their trace element supplement A-., not Balling Part A.

 

[WhatCouldGoWrong71]

OK, I figured it out…

BRS calls is balling. But then later on it’s called Hybrid Balling due to part C. But the A and K they use are only trace. So the Trace will be fine to mix with sodium hydroxide. I thought I was going cray cray for a minute. Well, I am off to mix your recipe. Need to hit the store for some safety gear’s

BRS Pharma Balling Method Bulk Total Package

Easily maintain calcium, alkalinity, trace elements, & magnesium in your reef! The BRS Pharma Hybrid Balling Method is the answer for implementing trace elements alongside the BRS two part you know and love. Easily make single or multiple gallons of each solution at a time with the bulk package...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

 

[CNDReef]

@Randy Holmes-Farley I believe I’m having a issue with the hydroxide. I’m dosing it into a medium flow area in my sump but it seams to not be mixing into the water column but settling down as large chunks of precipitation on the rock I have in the sump. I’m dosing 2ml per hour. Does it have to go into really high flow?I can snap a pic tomorrow

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

@Randy Holmes-Farley I believe I’m having a issue with the hydroxide. I’m dosing it into a medium flow area in my sump but it seams to not be mixing into the water column but settling down as large chunks of precipitation on the rock I have in the sump. I’m dosing 2ml per hour. Does it have to go into really high flow?I can snap a pic tomorrow

High pH alk supplements can do that if not mixed in quickly enough. If you can mix it faster, you can try diluting it with ro/di more before dosing.

 

[CNDReef]

High pH alk supplements can do that if not mixed in quickly enough. If you can mix it faster, you can try diluting it with ro/di more before dosing.

I’ll try the diluting it more. Thanks

 

[Kevin80]

Here's a first crack at what may end up being multiple possible recipes for a DIY two part that either has a higher pH or can be made more concentrated than traditional two part recipes. This one has about twice the pH raising effect compared to a carbonate based two part, per unit of alkalinity or calcium added. Note that I have neither made nor used this recipe. I fully expect it to work, but first adopters will be guinea pigs.

Note that the formation of some cloudiness of magnesium hydroxide is expected when the alk part hits the water (as carbonate versions also do). That is OK since it redissolves on mixing in more. But since the local pH is higher, there may be more chance for local precipitation of calcium carbonate, which is not optimal since it may waste additive (but otherwise is not a huge problem, IMO). To reduce this chance, add slowly to a very high flow area.

This first one is based on Jim Welsh's version of a DIY two part:

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/s...hould-i-expect-to-change.215171/#post-2466696

Jim's recipe (with some text added by me):

Part 1 - The Calcium and Magnesium Part​

Dissolve 500 g of calcium chloride dihydrate plus 261.2 g of magnesium chloride hexahydrate in enough water to make a total volume of one gallon.​

​

Part 2 - The Alkalinity and Sulfate Part​

Dissolve 374.7 g of sodium carbonate (594 g of baking soda that has been baked; = 3.535 moles of sodium carbonate) plus 68.7 g of sodium sulfate in enough water to make a total volume of one gallon.​

​

This recipe is the same strength as Randy's Recipe #1 (e.g., BRS). To make these two parts with the same strength as B-Ionic, then multiply the amounts of the salts by 1.5 (but note dissolving the carbonate can become challenging).​

The sodium hydroxide version:

Part 1 - The Calcium and Magnesium Part​

Dissolve 500 g of calcium chloride dihydrate plus 261.2 g of magnesium chloride hexahydrate in enough water to make a total volume of one gallon.​

​

Part 2 - The Alkalinity and Sulfate Part​

Dissolve 282.8 g of sodium hydroxide (=7.07 moles of sodium hydroxide to match the 3.535 moles of sodium carbonate in alkalinity) plus 68.7 g of sodium sulfate in enough water to make a total volume of one gallon. BE CAREFUL WITH THIS SOLUTION: IT HAS A pH ABOVE 14. Do not get it in your eyes or on your skin.​

​

This recipe is the same strength as Randy's Recipe #1 (e.g., BRS). To make these two parts with the same strength as B-Ionic, then multiply the amounts of the salts by 1.5. This version can readily be made more concentrated, if that is a goal.​

If I want to drip the naoh like kalk. How much would I have to mix per gallon to have more or less the same alkalinity as with kalkwasser? Thing is, kalk works great, but I don't need all that calcium that's being added with it.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

If I want to drip the naoh like kalk. How much would I have to mix per gallon to have more or less the same alkalinity as with kalkwasser? Thing is, kalk works great, but I don't need all that calcium that's being added with it.

Take 1 part of this hydroxide recipe and mix with 45 parts ro/di to match alk and pH effects of kalkwasser, with no calcium.

I’d have to expect that calcium will decline if you use substantial amounts for long.

 

[Kevin80]

Take 1 part of this hydroxide recipe and mix with 45 parts ro/di to match alk and pH effects of kalkwasser, with no calcium.

I’d have to expect that calcium will decline if you use substantial amounts for long.

Thanks! I'm keeping an eye on my ca.