Official My Tank Needs Help Thread

[sundog101]

My 93g cube has been struggling for some time. I've asked a lot different questions in different threads, so for simplicity I thought I would just make one thread and admit that I need some help.

Basically, here the problems
- corals not growing (a few sps have died)
- more algae than normal in the tank (struggled to control a brownish, maybe bacteria, buildup
- general unhealthy look

Basic Facts
- Tank: 93g cube with 40 breeder sump
- Lighting: 2 kessil a360 + 1 a160 to help with coverage
- Flow: 1 maxspect gyre and 1 ecotech mp10
- Filtration: Reef octopus classic 150 skimmer, filter socks replaced weekly
- Parameters: Ca- 450
Alk- 7.8
Mag- 1350
N- 0
P-0

The only stand out problem that I see is 0 N and P. I've tried to address that by slowly feeding more, adding more fish, and finally I removed my ATS after dialing it back and back. Unfortunately this has only seemed to feed algae and a brownish slime (don't think its dino) and nutrient tests always have shown 0. So right now I'm not sure what to do. Directly dose N or P? Continue feeding more? Add more filtration to help with algae? Do nothing? I'm at a loss.

Here are some photos:

Here's a close up of the brownish buildup on the rocks and pumps

And here's some photos of the back side where I'm unable to reach (and see for the most part)

Thank you for the help!

 

[Leslie Tabor]

You are def in the right place. I am wondering what tests you are using for nitrate/phosphate? And just at a quick glance you may need to adjust/increase water flow. I am just taking a guess, but it seems that especially in the corners, you may have some dead spots.

 

[Mal11224]

Sorry you are having troubles. Are you using ro/di? Do you have a refugium in your sump? How high are your lights off the surface, lighting schedule? The algae is likely the reason your nitrates and phos are low. Filtration may be an issue. A fuge with some macro algae can help with the nutrient export, which will in turn starve the GHA in your tank. Will need to do some water changes to get on top of it.

 

[ncaldwell]

I had the same problem. I started dosing peroxide for about a month to kill off the hair algea along with starting a fuge. Then started dosing spectracide stump remover to up my nitrates. That's the rought I took but there are many others. You could also look into n0p0-x to get rid of the n0 and p0 before the algea can get to it along with a couple 3 day blackouts

 

[Scott.h]

Having zero N and P is a problem. But it's being absorbed by the algae in the tank too, causing it to be undetectable. Rising that may increase the undesirable in the tank. Tell me more about your fuge and fuge lighting.

 

[Donovan Joannes]

How long have you been having hair algae?. How long have you been having zero nutrients?. IME, GHA start growing once my nutrients reaching zero, as the rocks start leaching out nutrients it has. It takes some good months before they start receding and eventually dying. If you don't mind looking at the ugliness, just keep doing WC with RODI (important as my previous top-off was tap water), stop adding corals, run the ATS until the DT clears up. I did wait patiently and it paid off handsomely.

 

[sundog101]

Sorry you are having troubles. Are you using ro/di? Do you have a refugium in your sump? How high are your lights off the surface, lighting schedule? The algae is likely the reason your nitrates and phos are low. Filtration may be an issue. A fuge with some macro algae can help with the nutrient export, which will in turn starve the GHA in your tank. Will need to do some water changes to get on top of it.

Yes I use ro/di.
I have a lit fuge, but no macros in it.
I'd say lights are 12 in off the surface.
I'll check my on my schedule. I think around 65% from 12-4 and slowly ramping up and down from that.

So do you think the algae is stripping the water of nutrients? How would I stop that other than peroxide dosing or some other growth inhibitor. Most tanks don't h202 dose so how do they function?

It's a frustrating problem to have haha. I need nutrients but that feeds algae. Then algae takes up nutrients and the process starts over.

 

[tdileo]

Okay I'm no expert but here is what I would do. Get in there with a siphon and your hand. Get the water level down to 50% if possible. Get in there with your hand and pull out all the algae you can. Then refill with new heated saltwater (RODI of course). Then add chaeto to your refugium. Get a some trochus snails and if you like them a tuxedo urchin for the main tank. They will help mow down the algae. Now with all the algae you pulled out, there will be room for nutrients to go to your chaeto. Do a 25% water change once a week for a month or so if possible and keep pulling out algae. At this point you should be way better! Probably not 100% but much closer

 

[Mal11224]

Yes I use ro/di.
I have a lot fuge, but no macros in it.
I'd say lights are 12 in off the surface.
I'll check my on my schedule. I think around 65% from 12-4 and slowly ramping up and down from that.

So do you think the algae is stripping the water of nutrients? How would I stop that other than peroxide dosing or some other growth inhibitor. Most tanks don't h202 dose so how do they function?

It's a frustrating problem to have haha. I need nutrients but that feeds algae. Then algae takes up nutrients and the process starts over.

I feel your frustration. It's a common problem especially with new tanks. If you have a fuge, then some chaeto will help absorb a lot of the nitrates keeping the GHA from getting it all. You definitely need some nitrates but not a lot. Mine are around 15ppm but my phos is always zero. This is a result of my fuge. May need to do frequent water changes to remove nutrients from the tank gradually. I've used NOPOX but stopped because my corals did better without it and I guess it wasn't really necessary. Chemi clean, which is used for cyano might help. Water changes can assist with controlling the GHA. If you can remove some manually, it helps. Gradually, you will get control of it. Starving it helps. Algae feeds off of the red and yellow spectrum of lights. Try using more blues or reduce your lighting time and reduce feeding somewhat.

 

[sundog101]

Good ideas!
If I add macros to the fuge or any other method of nutrient reduction what would keep the algae from absorbing the rest?

 

[Robink]

You want the macros in the fuge to outcompete the undesirable algae for nutrients. You will have to manually remove as much of the hair algae as possible and then the macro should take over and starve out the other algae.

 

[Mal11224]

Good ideas!
If I add macros to the fuge or any other method of nutrient reduction what would keep the algae from absorbing the rest?

It will help keep some away. Not all of it though. Get as much out manually and do water changes. It won't happen over night but you should see improvements. Cut the lights down a little and starve it if you can. You should be good soon enough.

 

[sundog101]

I'll have to look into some of the suggested ideas .
Here's what I still don't understand, with all tanks, not just mine in particular:

(Sorry if I sound like a broken record here)

If the algae is always taking N and P down to zero, how is it possible for any tank to have nutrients?

 

[Scott.h]

I'll have to look into some of the suggested ideas .
Here's what I still don't understand, with all tanks, not just mine in particular:

(Sorry if I sound like a broken record here)

If the algae is always taking N and P down to zero, how is it possible for any tank to have nutrients?

Because you are feeding the tank and the fish are pooping. Whatever is available gets used up. It's not that the algae can't survive, it just doesn't thrive like it would at higher levels. It could depend on other things such as iron from your salt mix too.

Having a fuge allows a place for the algae of all sorts to go nuts so it doesn't have to in the display. I have a mature system with 40ish nitrates and .18 phosphate. I clean the glass once a week. The fuge is packed. On the other hand I have a tank, less then a year old that I daily DOSE N and P to keep it detectable. If I don't clean the glass 2x a week it looks terrible. The macro amount is small because the more macro, the more I'd have to add N and P. But there isn't enough algae to out compete the display per say.

 

[Scott.h]

A few other things to consider - you could scrub off some of that algae with something like a new paint brush. Let it go into the filter socks, then change them. Adding a tang would help too. You might looking at adding some flow as well.

 

[Maacc]

How new is the tank? I second the manual removal with some vacuuming of the sand bed. Also consider blowing off the rock. If you get a bunch of clouds of detritus, it's time to look at your flow.
You may also want to look at biodiversity, adding some copepods and amphipods along with a multi-prong clean up crew, but don't go overboard, 3-5 of each species to start. You don't want them to starve on you.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

It appears to me that you need a lot more CUC and a tooth brush.

Try to estimate you par as well and the photo period. I don't belive the light is the problem save that some corralines don't do well at higher intensities.

Did I miss the age of the tank?

My honest observation of the tank makes me question the rodi water quality.

 

[sundog101]

The tank is right at 1 year old.

My rodi water reads 0 tds. I have an in line meter and hand held.

I don't have a par meter and I'm not very good at guessing, but I can tell you that lights at 75% for five hours and 15 in above the water.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

The tank is right at 1 year old.

My rodi water reads 0 tds. I have an in line meter and hand held.

I don't have a par meter and I'm not very good at guessing, but I can tell you that lights at 75% for five hours and 15 in above the water.

Baffling. I dont see a single spec of corraline in the tank. It there an we can't see?
IME a bad water sign.

I also see no worms in sand. Concerning if you don't frequently clean it.

I also see no snails in the pictures. Is there a reason for this?

Were you not having problembs I would say you need a longer time for light. This is not how you normally run it is it?

Do you by chance bleach your filter socks?

 

[sundog101]

Baffling. I dont see a single spec of corraline in the tank. It there an we can't see?
IME a bad water sign.

I also see no worms in sand. Concerning if you don't frequently clean it.

I also see no snails in the pictures. Is there a reason for this?

Were you not having problembs I would say you need a longer time for light. This is not how you normally run it is it?

Do you by chance bleach your filter socks?

I know. There is zero coralline.

I do lightly stir up the sand during weekly water changes.

There are 12 cerith snails and a tuxedo urchin.

I've cut back with the lighting schedule due to the algae, but I think I'll start extending it. Also the total photoperiod is 8 am to 10 pm. Just 5 hrs are at 75%, the rest are ramping up and down.

I wash the filter socks in the washer. No bleach