Old Ways vs New Ways of Reefing

[minus9]

Often wondered what raising the temperature would accomplish as the BB likely survives but not sure sponges might.

Didn’t consider 40ppt but house that affect items such sponges one might want to keep?

I have plenty of sponges in my tank. But again, I’m really patient when it comes to starting a tank and will let the rock sit in the tank for a couple weeks while ghost feeding flakes and other foods at night. This draws out crabs, shrimps and other critters, then I go hunting. Once I’ve cleared the tank, everything goes in and enjoy the tank. I’ve done this since the early 90’s with a lot of success.

 

[CoastalTownLayabout]

So my question is for those who’ve done both methods, did you have similar experiences? Was your ocean live rock tank easier to maintain, faster to cycle, need less additives like pods and bacterias, have shorter or no ugly periods, and generally more rewarding? Or do you prefer the new ways over the old ways?

Ranking the methods I’ve used over 30 yrs against above criteria.

1. DSB fine grade with natural live rock. Super quick start up, early stability. Main issues seemed to be cyano, likely result of inability to employ strong flow due to the fine sand.

2. Joubert, either in tank or remote with natural live rock. Pretty close second to above, slightly more involved set up having to DIY the plenum and screens etc. Plus side, you could have a bit more flow with coarser grain size sand.

3. Berlin with natural live rock and thin sand bed. Good middle ground method. IMO the best of both worlds.

4. Berlin with natural live rock and bare bottom. Seemed to take a bit longer to get started but great for high flow SPS. These systems were synonymous with early acro dominant success.

5. Dry rock with thin sand bed. Slow but interesting process. Low energy start seems to avoid catastrophic ugly phases.

6. Dry rock bare bottom. Painfully slow but also interesting. You really need to have an appreciation for the micro level developments in these systems.

 

[BeanAnimal]

I think this is the sweet spot that most of us found. DSBS worked but could go very wrong, the same with Joubert...

So starting with all live rock or even some makes a big difference.

I threw some new Carib Sea rock into my 20 year established tank... it went through a pretty nasty period (diatoms, then brown, then green, then some gha, then more brown) and is just now 6 months later starting to look natural and healthy and take on coralline.

That said, if it sat in a sump or trash can for a few months with saltwater and a lump of live sand or rock from the system, it would likely have looked better in a week, not 6 months.

 

[RealReefHobbyist]

I think this is the sweet spot that most of us found. DSBS worked but could go very wrong, the same with Joubert...

So starting with all live rock or even some makes a big difference.

I threw some new Carib Sea rock into my 20 year established tank... it went through a pretty nasty period (diatoms, then brown, then green, then some gha, then more brown) and is just now 6 months later starting to look natural and healthy and take on coralline.

That said, if it sat in a sump or trash can for a few months with saltwater and a lump of live sand or rock from the system, it would likely have looked better in a week, not 6 months.

Do you feel something in marco rocks or any of these other rocks are fueling these phases? Very intriguing to me that just adding some rock to a healthily long term established system created issues. Are they loaded with something that is fuel for uglies?

 

[AquaLogic]

Do you feel something in marco rocks or any of these other rocks are fueling these phases? Very intriguing to me that just adding some rock to a healthily long term established system created issues. Are they loaded with something that is fuel for uglies?

Hard to say without some lab testing of these rocks, what is on them, and what is in them. That's why I suggest cleaning even Marco rocks which should be clean. Without the tools to analyze them we really can't know, so why take the chance?

 

[Cichlid Dad]

Speaking to having the same bacteria population from live rock vs bottled which often lead to the uglies first year.

I didn't have any ugly and added coral and fish pretty much right away.

 

[GARRIGA]

I didn't have any ugly and added coral and fish pretty much right away.

Understood but that’s not what all are reporting. For example, current test tank started with dry rock and bottled bacteria two plus years ago. No WC. It’s as stabile as they come. All rolling until I changed my lights six months or so ago and suddenly Dino and Cyano. Six month battle. Not sure that happens with live rock. Therefore just because it hasn’t happen guarantees it won’t happen.

Oddly, replacing top off with tap seems to have solved it along with weekly dosing of MB7 and ChaetoGow with latter intended to promote GHA and Pom Pom to outcompete the uglies along with beneficial bacterial.

 

[alabella1]

My tank was mostly marco rock (started in last June) and had nothing but issues. Decided I was going to reboot the tank with Aussie live rock and though time will tell as far as results, it's looking pretty awesome already! If anyone is looking for some amazing rock, hit up Jason @ Pristine Marine Aquariums - https://pristinemarineaquariums.com/products/australian-ultra-supreme-live-rock

 

[Reefering1]

My tank was mostly marco rock (started in last June) and had nothing but issues. Decided I was going to reboot the tank with Aussie live rock and though time will tell as far as results, it's looking pretty awesome already! If anyone is looking for some amazing rock, hit up Jason @ Pristine Marine Aquariums - https://pristinemarineaquariums.com/products/australian-ultra-supreme-live-rock

Nice. Can you share some pics in white light so we can see the rocks please

 

[Iverson]

I would ordinarily prefer the old way, but I'm concerned about harvesting life rock. It seems like it comes from poorer countries, and the most beautiful reefs left in the world. Reefing is probably very low on factors that contribute to the damage to world reefs; but it's something we can do...

Thoughts?

 

[Reefering1]

I can probably help save a few hundred pounds of the reefs... I'll keep it in a tank in my living room...

 

[RealReefHobbyist]

I would ordinarily prefer the old way, but I'm concerned about harvesting life rock. It seems like it comes from poorer countries, and the most beautiful reefs left in the world. Reefing is probably very low on factors that contribute to the damage to world reefs; but it's something we can do...

Thoughts?

Most live rock is aqua-cultured today. Its base rock dumped in the ocean for a couple years then collected and sold. No impact on the natural reefs.

 

[alabella1]

Nice. Can you share some pics in white light so we can see the rocks please

 

[Katrina71]

Extremely jealous of some of those rocks!

 

[jackson6745]

@alabella1 I started my recent 200g with 100lbs of rock from Jason. Really nice stuff.

 

[alabella1]

@alabella1 I started my recent 200g with 100lbs of rock from Jason. Really nice stuff.

How long ago did you start it and how long did your tank take to cycle?

 

[alabella1]

Extremely jealous of some of those rocks!

Go get yourself some here!!

 

[Sump Crab]

Most live rock is aqua-cultured today. Its base rock dumped in the ocean for a couple years then collected and sold. No impact on the natural reefs.

This. Liverock farming actually creates habitat. They take barren, sandy bottom deserts and dump thousands of pounds of rocks and create new reef habitat.

 

[jackson6745]

How long ago did you start it and how long did your tank take to cycle?

I cured this rock for 3 months while I was waiting for the tank. I also gave it light for the last month while I was curing it. It is already growing coraline. It’s been in the display tank since Dec 18th. There is no cycle like this. I transferred the contents of a 25g nano tank in here and a bunch of of other fish that I was quarantining. Insta- Reef . A few days shy of the first month.

 

[mfinn]

I would ordinarily prefer the old way, but I'm concerned about harvesting life rock. It seems like it comes from poorer countries, and the most beautiful reefs left in the world. Reefing is probably very low on factors that contribute to the damage to world reefs; but it's something we can do...

Thoughts?

There are only 2 places you can get real live ocean harvested rock these days ( please correct me if I'm wrong)
Caribbean and Australia. No poor countries involved.