Planning Fish for a 90-gallon Reef

[Soren]

I know this is an age-old discussion with no specific answer, but how do I narrow down a list of fish for a specific size of aquarium?

Currently, I am in the planning phase for a 90-gallon reef tank intended mostly for hardy, easy beginner fishes and corals. I know that research and patience are the best considerations to make, and I am in no hurry. Like is probably common as a beginner, I would like as many fish as possible, especially as multiples of the same type when possible. I am just researching now, so I am looking for suggestions to help avoid failures. My intentions are to have a peaceful reef with mostly fish in the 2-4 inch length range. I would like to also include anemones, hardy corals, hermit crabs, shrimp, snails, starfish, and/or urchins in reasonable combinations and amounts for a reef of this size. More questions on the invertebrates later...

On the linked build thread, I have a list of possible fish as follows in order of preference:
2 of Black and White Ocellaris Clownfish (Amphiprion ocellaris)
1 of Purple Tang (Zebrasoma xanthurum) [I already have this ~4-inch fish that will be transferred over from my 75-gallon]
1 of Kole Yellow Eye Tang (Ctenochaetus strigosus) or 1 of Bristletooth Tomini Tang (Ctenochaetus tominiensis)
1 of Foxface Lo (Siganus vulpinus) or 1 of Bicolor Foxface (Siganus uspi) or 1 of One Spot Foxface (Siganus unimaculatus)
1-2 of Engineer Goby (Pholidichthys leucotaenia)
2-3 of Chalk Bass (Serranus tortugarum)
2-3 of Neon Goby (Elcatinus oceanops)
2-4 of Yellowstriped Cardinalfish (Ostorhincus cyanosoma)
2 of Blue/Green Black-axil Chromis (Chromis sp.) or 2 of Yellowtail Damselfish (Chrysiptera parasema) or 2 of Blue Sapphire Damselfish (Chrysiptera cf. springeri)

Is this an overload for a 90-gallon reef tank with an intended (30-55)-gallon sump with refugium? Is it possible to add more small fish to the list? What would you recommend adding, subtracting, or changing out?

Also, what sequence is recommended to add the fish? Should some be added together (beyond any multiples of the same type which will be added together)? Are any of these fish likely to do better in a group or should I reduce any multiples to a single fish to avoid problems?

I am doing research online and reading books about these questions and know there are only suggestions until I try it and succeed or fail, but any advice to help me get started in the right direction is appreciated.

Thanks,
Soren

 

[Reefer5640]

That’s a pretty good load for that tank. I wouldn’t go more than that if it were mine. This is what I’d do if it were my tank

I’d add in this order
1- engineer gobys
2- neon gobys
3- cardnals
4- clowns
5- foxface
6- chalk bass
7- Kole tang
8- purple tang
9- I’d ditch the damsels personally but if your set on em then add them last

 

[Soren]

That’s a pretty good load for that tank. I wouldn’t go more than that if it were mine. This is what I’d do if it were my tank

I’d add in this order
1- engineer gobys
2- neon gobys
3- cardnals
4- clowns
5- foxface
6- chalk bass
7- Kole tang
8- purple tang
9- I’d ditch the damsels personally but if your set on em then add them last

Thanks for the recommendation. The damselfish are the lowest on the list, so are my lower priority and only as space allows. I may just eliminate them from the list. Thanks for suggestions on the add order, also. It matches very closely to what I had planned from prior research.

When you say a pretty good load for this tank, just to be clear, are you saying these should be compatible and an appropriate load for a 90-gallon reef aquarium without being too much?

Also, can you recommend how long to wait between additions in general? I may be adding some at the same time if I can take advantage on larger-order free shipping on an online order. Otherwise, I will talk with my somewhat-local fish store about them ordering for me to limit shipping costs.

 

[Reefer5640]

I’d wait 4 weeks between additions. If you go too fast you may cause problems like high phosphates and nitrates. You want to give your tank time to adjust. Also I would make one adjustment to my recommendation in the order that you add the fish. For the tangs I’d add them at the same time. And as far as your question about the size of load for the tank, what I meant was that’s a lot of fish and I myself wouldn’t go more than that. you’ve got a good selection and they all should stick to their specific territories. Not too many swimmers, perchers, burrowers, dwellers. Good mix. I’m sure you could fit more in there but it’d start to make your maintenance and nutrient levels Hard to keep in check.

 

[Soren]

I’d wait 4 weeks between additions. If you go too fast you may cause problems like high phosphates and nitrates. You want to give your tank time to adjust. Also I would make one adjustment to my recommendation in the order that you add the fish. For the tangs I’d add them at the same time. And as far as your question about the size of load for the tank, what I meant was that’s a lot of fish and I myself wouldn’t go more than that. you’ve got a good selection and they all should stick to their specific territories. Not too many swimmers, perchers, burrowers, dwellers. Good mix. I’m sure you could fit more in there but it’d start to make your maintenance and nutrient levels Hard to keep in check.

Thanks for your recommendations, Reefer5640.
I wondered about adding the tangs at the same time to help prevent territory disputes.
I do not want to run the tank too near the limit as to be unstable for bioload, so that is why I am trying to determine a list ahead of time that I can stick to when I start to purchase fish. No impulse buys for me, as I know that usually causes problems, unnecessary death, and wasted money.

If 4 weeks is a good recommendation between additions, I will either need to order through a LFS or set up multiple quarantine tanks to allow for a bulk order online to avoid the high shipping costs and then add the fish slowly to the main display tank. I should have the room and plenty of 10-gallon tanks to set up multiple quarantine tanks, but some of the fish would be in these tanks for a long time if they are later additions which may make this a bad idea for an online purchase. I will also have to watch for availability on the specific species I want.

 

[Reefer5640]

You can go faster. I stocked a 120 waiting two weeks between additions And adding 2-3 fish at a time but that was when I upgraded from my 75 which had been established for a long time. I wasn’t as concerned because I had previously cycled the extra rock I put in. I still had a hair algae break out though. So depending on how well established the tank is and if youre willing to battle the consequences after it’s up to you. I went into it knowing I was going to have an algae bloom. I was more concerned about fighting fish than I was an algae break out I had a pretty aggressive line up. I didn’t want anyone to become too territorial before I could get all the fish added. the algae breakout wasn’t terrible because I was anticipating it and was able to stay on top of it. Just figured I’d let you know it is doable under the right conditions and understanding the consequences. You don’t really have an aggressive line up. So with all that being said I’d still recommend waiting the full month.

 

[Soren]

You can go faster. I stocked a 120 waiting two weeks between additions And adding 2-3 fish at a time but that was when I upgraded from my 75 which had been established for a long time. I wasn’t as concerned because I had previously cycled the extra rock I put in. I still had a hair algae break out though. So depending on how well established the tank is and if youre willing to battle the consequences after it’s up to you. I went into it knowing I was going to have an algae bloom. I was more concerned about fighting fish than I was an algae break out I had a pretty aggressive line up. I didn’t want anyone to become too territorial before I could get all the fish added. the algae breakout wasn’t terrible because I was anticipating it and was able to stay on top of it. Just figured I’d let you know it is doable under the right conditions and understanding the consequences. You don’t really have an aggressive line up. So with all that being said I’d still recommend waiting the full month.

Thanks for more advice from your experiences, Reefer5640. If I order online, I will probably need to add fish more quickly to avoid extensive quarantines with many different QT tanks. I expect the possibility of algae blooms, so I will do what I can also to stay ahead of it if I go the faster route. I may be adding a UV filter which might help in limiting algae or bacterial blooms. Since I have not set up the tank yet and will likely have plenty of time for setup and cycling before I would be able to have fish shipped next spring, I can research and prepare a more specific plan over the next few months.

I have a couple more questions if you have more time to answer:
Are there effective clean-up crews to have in place in case of a hair algae breakout, or are there not many creatures that eat the brown hair algae? The previous owner of my recently acquired 75-gallon FOWLR had an outbreak a few years ago. He solved it by removing all of the rock and sand and pressure washing and scrubbing it thoroughly. This is surely not the only method?

My nearest LFS has plenty of corals to offer (but limited fish selection) that I could pick up anytime after cycling the tank. Is it possible to start with only corals/anemones/invertebrates and add the fish later since they cannot be shipped in winter, or is this a bad idea? Will it present unique challenges that could be avoided by adding fish first?

Can ammonia and/or fish food be fed to the new setup over a longer cycle time to mature the live rock and sand closer to full bioload to allow for more rapid addition of the fish? I am in no rush, but I may not have as open of options if I order fish online in larger quantities at a time to take advantage of free shipping on larger orders. I still hope to be able to source at least some of these fish locally to be able to add them more slowly. My LFS's are both not too local, though, with one about a 45-minute drive away (mostly corals, few fish, likely source of RBTA later) and the other about a 1-hour 20-minute drive away (much larger store with many fish).

Thanks again for your input, Reefer5640. I really appreciate it.

Thanks,
Soren

 

[msujohn]

I have a 90 reef myself. I personally wouldn’t put 2 tangs and a fox face in it. They all get very big and that could create issues down the road.

 

[Soren]

I have a 90 reef myself. I personally wouldn’t put 2 tangs and a fox face in it. They all get very big and that could create issues down the road.

Thanks for your input, msujohn. It is nice to hear from someone with a reef of the same size.
I will continue to think about the number and size of fish, since it is important to me not to overdo either the fish size for swimming space or the amount of bioload. All 3 may be included, but this will drive me toward a more open, less full reef structure. I plan to include a large sump (now possibly a 75-gallon sump in conjunction with a 20-gallon long tank for initial filter and for mangroves), so my total water system should have significant ability to handle bioload. This should allow for the more open design in the 90-gallon display tank swimming face, since I tend to prefer the fish more than the corals.
The other back-up I may have is a second 75-gallon FOWLR that could house one of the tangs or foxface if they grow collectively too large for the 90-gallon tank. Since I prefer to start moderately small to be able to watch them grow, I should have time to decide what works for me.

I appreciate your recommendation and will take it into consideration.

 

[TriggerFinger]

That seems like quite a stocking list for a 90g. I currently have a starry blenny, lightning maroon and ruby head wrasse in mine. I had a fairy wrasse as well but the ruby head was territorial and caused the flasher to carpet surf. What I’m saying is my 90g wasn’t large enough for two different wrasse. You will run into a lot of aggression with two tangs and a Fox face in a 90g, there just isn’t the space they require.

 

[Soren]

That seems like quite a stocking list for a 90g. I currently have a starry blenny, lightning maroon and ruby head wrasse in mine. I had a fairy wrasse as well but the ruby head was territorial and caused the flasher to carpet surf. What I’m saying is my 90g wasn’t large enough for two different wrasse. You will run into a lot of aggression with two tangs and a Fox face in a 90g, there just isn’t the space they require.

Thanks for your advice, TriggerFinger.
I have a few questions, since I am trying to do thorough research before starting on a path towards failure. Of course, I dream of having everything, but I also want to be conscientious to the success of the system for the sake of all included life and will eliminate fish from my list if they will cause problems for each other and/or for the whole system.

Does sump size or total gallons in system affect your response, or not really? My sump system might add a 75-gallon for filtration/skimming and refugium and a 20-gallon for mangroves. I assume this makes no difference, since your advice relates to 3 fish that need swimming area and will compete for food (maybe trainable for more peacefulness with nori sheets?). The only reason I ask is that I may run a system with less live rock and coral space than average to allow for swimming room in the display 90-gallon tank with additional live rock/refugium filtration in the large sump and auxiliary mangrove sump and want to know if this makes any difference or has no noticeable effect.
I may only include one of the tangs or leave out the foxface. It is also likely that I will keep up my current 75-gallon FOWLR that a tang or foxface could be moved to if I have any issues in the 90-gallon reef (assuming the issues that could arise are likely to only affect these three fish and not cause catastrophe to the other fish or invertebrates). I also may choose a one-spot foxface (Siganus unimaculatus) instead of the foxface lo (Siganus vulpinus) since they do not grow as large.

Also, are wrasses more aggressive and territorial to similar species than the tangs and foxface, or is it still just as likely between these three? From the research I have done, it seems that wrasses are known for same-species aggression, while a Zebrasoma tang, Ctenochaetus tang, and Siganus foxface may be fine together (though not sure for the limited space of a 90-gallon?). I am asking to learn before making a decision toward failure, so any advice is appreciated.

 

[TriggerFinger]

Thanks for your advice, TriggerFinger.
I have a few questions, since I am trying to do thorough research before starting on a path towards failure. Of course, I dream of having everything, but I also want to be conscientious to the success of the system for the sake of all included life and will eliminate fish from my list if they will cause problems for each other and/or for the whole system.

Does sump size or total gallons in system affect your response, or not really? My sump system might add a 75-gallon for filtration/skimming and refugium and a 20-gallon for mangroves. I assume this makes no difference, since your advice relates to 3 fish that need swimming area and will compete for food (maybe trainable for more peacefulness with nori sheets?). The only reason I ask is that I may run a system with less live rock and coral space than average to allow for swimming room in the display 90-gallon tank with additional live rock/refugium filtration in the large sump and auxiliary mangrove sump and want to know if this makes any difference or has no noticeable effect.
I may only include one of the tangs or leave out the foxface. It is also likely that I will keep up my current 75-gallon FOWLR that a tang or foxface could be moved to if I have any issues in the 90-gallon reef (assuming the issues that could arise are likely to only affect these three fish and not cause catastrophe to the other fish or invertebrates). I also may choose a one-spot foxface (Siganus unimaculatus) instead of the foxface lo (Siganus vulpinus) since they do not grow as large.

Also, are wrasses more aggressive and territorial to similar species than the tangs and foxface, or is it still just as likely between these three? From the research I have done, it seems that wrasses are known for same-species aggression, while a Zebrasoma tang, Ctenochaetus tang, and Siganus foxface may be fine together (though not sure for the limited space of a 90-gallon?). I am asking to learn before making a decision toward failure, so any advice is appreciated.

I understand the need for all the fish. I really do, I still want them even though I know it’s not best for the fish. I love the coris wrasse and regal angelfish but my tank is way too small to house their adult size. Let ask you this, have you ever caught a fish out of a fully stocked tank? If you do end up with them all and end up having to remove someone for aggression or disease flaring up; think about trying to catch them in your tank stocked full of rocks and coral. I decided long ago that I would never get a fish I couldn’t keep for life because I had such a hard time getting my current fish from the quarantine tank to the display. I had to completely empty the QT tank to move them. Not fun, very stressful for me and the fish.
The bio filter isn’t so much as issue as the space. I assume you have a traditional 48 x 18 footprint 90g (mine is as well). Both tangs and the foxface get too large (in my opinion) for a 48x18 tank. They occupy the same territory and eat the same thing so they will all see each other as competition. Giving extra food may or may not work, but those fish are likely going to be stressed out which will cause problems. The purple tang alone is an aggressive fish and honestly should have a larger tank than a 90g.
My wrasse were two different kinds; cirrhilabrus cf cyanopleura and paracheilinus carpenteri. Both considered peaceful fish and should have been able to coexist without issue. Maybe I have an exceptional jerk of a fairy and an exceptionally wimpy flasher? I’m not sure. I don’t think my tank is large enough though I have plenty of rock for everyone to have their own territory.

 

[Soren]

I understand the need for all the fish. I really do, I still want them even though I know it’s not best for the fish. I love the coris wrasse and regal angelfish but my tank is way too small to house their adult size. Let ask you this, have you ever caught a fish out of a fully stocked tank? If you do end up with them all and end up having to remove someone for aggression or disease flaring up; think about trying to catch them in your tank stocked full of rocks and coral. I decided long ago that I would never get a fish I couldn’t keep for life because I had such a hard time getting my current fish from the quarantine tank to the display. I had to completely empty the QT tank to move them. Not fun, very stressful for me and the fish.
The bio filter isn’t so much as issue as the space. I assume you have a traditional 48 x 18 footprint 90g (mine is as well). Both tangs and the foxface get too large (in my opinion) for a 48x18 tank. They occupy the same territory and eat the same thing so they will all see each other as competition. Giving extra food may or may not work, but those fish are likely going to be stressed out which will cause problems. The purple tang alone is an aggressive fish and honestly should have a larger tank than a 90g.
My wrasse were two different kinds; cirrhilabrus cf cyanopleura and paracheilinus carpenteri. Both considered peaceful fish and should have been able to coexist without issue. Maybe I have an exceptional jerk of a fairy and an exceptionally wimpy flasher? I’m not sure. I don’t think my tank is large enough though I have plenty of rock for everyone to have their own territory.

Thanks for advice, TriggerFinger. You brought up a point I had not yet considered in catching a fish from a fully-stocked tank when issues arise. I also am trying to only get fish that I can keep for life, so I am doing my research and asking questions to hopefully avoid making mistakes.
I am very new to marine aquariums, so am trying to do complete research before making decisions.
I guessed that the space is the issue, not the filtration. My 90-gallon is indeed a 48x18 footprint 25 tall.
When considering the fish for this reef, I have been leaning more towards the Ctenochaetus Tangs (either Kole Goldenring Bristletooth or Bristletooth Tomini tang) since they are smaller overall than the purple tang and less aggressive. The problem I have here is somewhat unique, though. I already acquired a 75-gallon FOWLR setup from a coworker (that introduced me to keeping marine aquariums) that contains a ~4" purple tang. I have read from some sources that a 90-gallon may be big enough for a purple tang, though the feedback I have gotten in responses leans towards a 90-gallon being still too small for this tang. That would mean selling the purple tang and eliminating him from the list, which is certainly an option I am considering, especially since it would help fund the other fish. I really like the purple tang, though, and am not too interested in trying to resell fish...

Thanks for your account with the wrasses. I am researching to include only peaceful fish, but it seems that sometimes there can still be problems even with these fish. This relates to one of my highest initial concerns with my list, which was the inclusion of both the purple tang and Ctenochaetus tang even though the purple tang could still be aggressive. I may just leave the purple tang in the FOWLR tank for now since I already have him and deal with the size issue later when he grows more.

I am trying to do research to avoid problems similar to those the previous owner had due to lack of research. He went through a number of different types of fish that did not make it, and most of the issues he mentioned are probably directly linked to common issues with incompatibility that I am finding in my research. As it stands right now, my 75-gallon FOWLR contains an 11" Snowflake Eel (Echidna nebulosa), a 3-4" Rectangle Triggerfish (Rhinecanthus rectangularus), a 3-4" Picasso Triggerfish (Rhinecanthus aculeatus), a 3-4" Orange-lined Triggerfish (Balistapus undulatus), a 3-4" Green Chromis (Chromis viridis), and the 4-5" Purple Tang (Zebrasoma xanthurum). All of the triggerfish are expected to outgrow the tank (possibly not for the Picasso, but may still not be recommended in only 75-gallon), the purple tang is expected to outgrow the tank, the triggerfish are expected to become aggressive (especially the orange-lined), and most all of these are not reef-safe. I love the eel, but it is likely it would not be compatible with smaller fish in a reef, so it happens to be one of the main reasons I am considering keeping both the FOWLR as a semi-aggressive or predator tank and the 90-gallon reef, though that might be too much maintenance and result in the elimination of the 75-gallon FOWLR.

 

[TriggerFinger]

There are a lot of options for this size tank. Unfortunately, a lot of fish that don’t fit in our tanks either. I am attracted to the large fish also, a Niger trigger is my absolute first fish if I ever get a big (220 gallon) tank.
It sounds like you have a very full fowlr already. If you have a local saltwater store, you may be able to trade them in for credit. That is where you will find out how difficult it is to catch fish
Keep on your research. Look at peoples reports for specific fish. A lot of aggression with the purple tang and triggers being reported; especially in tanks too small for them.
In the end; each fish has their own personality and it’s possible to get a “good” fish though it is not likely they stray too far from their typical personality.