Puffer got ich! What to do!

[Plzpizza]

Hello,

I found out yesterday my puffer has developed ich. Picture below. I have a total of 4 fish in my tank including my puffer. How do I go about treating it in a QT. I just set one up today. Can I put all of them inside with out cycling my QT tank. When I hit the therapeutic levels of copper do I stop adding copper in? How long do I treat them?

My DT has corals and iverts inside so I cannot treat in DT. It will be fallow for 76 days. Do I stop dosing NOPOX during this period since there won’t be much fish?

 

[Big G]

Copper can be very rough on puffers. Better to use CP.
But if using copper, a chelated copper like Copper Power or Coppersafe is preferred. Small regular doses (AM, lunch, PM) over 3-5 days are best. This way you can watch for signs of copper sensitivity. I've held puffers in copper for 30 days. Had some slow down on activity and eating. But they adjusted. An alternative would be to hold at therapeutic for 14 days and then transfer to a clean, sterile QT to observe for another 14 days.

 

[ScottR]

Copper can be very rough on puffers. Better to use CP.
But if using copper, a chelated copper like Copper Power or Coppersafe is preferred. Small regular doses (AM, lunch, PM) over 3-5 days are best. This way you can watch for signs of copper sensitivity. I've held puffers in copper for 30 days. Had some slow down on activity and eating. But they adjusted. An alternative would be to hold at therapeutic for 14 days and then transfer to a clean, sterile QT to observe for another 14 days.

Thanks for helping out my friend @Big G You and @Humblefish are heroes. Humblefish, if you have anything else to add, she’ll be thankful.

 

[01xp]

That's how I treat ich 14 day qt with copper then clean tank until the 76 day is up

 

[Plzpizza]

Copper can be very rough on puffers. Better to use CP.
But if using copper, a chelated copper like Copper Power or Coppersafe is preferred. Small regular doses (AM, lunch, PM) over 3-5 days are best. This way you can watch for signs of copper sensitivity. I've held puffers in copper for 30 days. Had some slow down on activity and eating. But they adjusted. An alternative would be to hold at therapeutic for 14 days and then transfer to a clean, sterile QT to observe for another 14 days.

Thanks big G I was only able to find cupramine in my area would that be ok to use slowly?

 

[Big G]

Do you have a Hanna Copper Checker? I'd hold the copper levels as low as possible. Therapeutic starts at 1.5 ppm. I've done 1.75 with them. But I'd avoid going higher.
Remember S-L-O-W is good. Feeding high quality foods with vitamins mixed in to support the fish's immune system is highly recommended. I like to add Beta Glucan. It tremendously boosts the immune system. This is the one I use as it is algae based:

 

[01xp]

Cupramine says therapeutic levels are .5 that's what I keep mine at using cupramine

 

[Big G]

Thanks big G I was only able to find cupramine in my area would that be ok to use slowly?

Cupramine is a bit tricky. Do not use their recommend 2 big doses. It can be really, really hard on some fish, even lethal.
I calculate the total number of drops needed for the tank size. Remember tanks are seldom their "call" size. They usually are smaller in gallons.
Once you have the total number of drops calculated. Spread the dosing of the drops out over 5 days: AM, lunch, PM.
Make sure to add a small powerhead aimed up at the surface where it is actively rippling the water's surface to increase O2 in the water column.

 

[Plzpizza]

Cupramine is a bit tricky. Do not use their recommend 2 big doses. It can be really, really hard on some fish, even lethal.
I calculate the total number of drops needed for the tank size. Remember tanks are seldom their "call" size. They usually are smaller in gallons.
Once you have the total number of drops calculated. Spread the dosing of the drops out over 5 days: AM, lunch, PM.
Make sure to add a small powerhead aimed up at the surface where it is actively rippling the water's surface to increase O2 in the water column.

Hi Big G I don’t have a hanna checker but I have the salifert copper test kit. Yes I will definitely take it very slow. I’ll measure the water that goes in the tank. My pork is doing ok right now he lost some white spots but I guess that’s just the life cycle of the ich. He’s still eatting and swimming around but now he piggy backs my cleaner shrimp

 

[Big G]

Hi Big G I don’t have a hanna checker but I have the salifert copper test kit. Yes I will definitely take it very slow. I’ll measure the water that goes in the tank. My pork is doing ok right now he lost some white spots but I guess that’s just the life cycle of the ich. He’s still eatting and swimming around but now he piggy backs my cleaner shrimp

That is a great looking fish.
Highly, highly recommend getting a Hanna while slowly ramping up the copper. And then, and this is the best part, you can slowly creep up on therapeutic without going over and hurting or worse you beautiful fish. The Hanna not only lowers stress on your fish, but it will lower your stress too.
Cupramine can be tricky because of its lower dosage and lower therapeutic range. And I think its one of the reasons so many people have lost fish while using it. Those test kits from Seachem, API, Salifert just don't help very much. I found out I was over dosing by 25-30% when I first started using the Hanna on a tank that I thought was "at" therapeutic when my Hanna arrived. Yikes!

 

[Plzpizza]

That is a great looking fish.
Highly, highly recommend getting a Hanna while slowly ramping up the copper. And then, and this is the best part, you can slowly creep up on therapeutic without going over and hurting or worse you beautiful fish. The Hanna not only lowers stress on your fish, but it will lower your stress too.
Cupramine can be tricky because of its lower dosage and lower therapeutic range. And I think its one of the reasons so many people have lost fish while using it. Those test kits from Seachem, API, Salifert just don't help very much. I found out I was over dosing by 25-30% when I first started using the Hanna on a tank that I thought was "at" therapeutic when my Hanna arrived. Yikes!

I will try to get one big G. It’s a good thing porky is still doing ok so I got time

 

[Big G]

I will try to get one big G. It’s a good thing porky is still doing ok so I got time

I forgot to mention, you could also use TTM to treat Ich. No chemicals. Just extra handling, and with puffers can't use a net. So it's a bit tougher to catch them. But no chemicals is a big plus.

What It Treats – Marine Ich (Cryptocaryon irritans) only.

How To Treat – Tank transfer (TTM) is my favorite method for clearing a fish of Marine Ich, but the prevalence (and similarities) of Marine Velvet Disease can make TTM a risky gamble nowadays. To properly execute TTM you need two tanks (or buckets), with dedicated equipment for each tank (not to be shared between the two). I personally use 2 of the 10 gallon tanks to do TTM, each with its own heater, thermometer, air stone, airline tubing and PVC elbows for hiding places. This is how TTM is implemented:

Day 1 – Fish is placed in initial QT.

Day 4 – Roughly 72 hours later transfer the fish to new tank. The time of day you do the transfer is unimportant, but never exceed 72 hours from the last transfer. The temperature and SG of the new tank should match the old one perfectly, so you can just catch & release (no acclimation). Transfer as little water as possible with the fish.

Day 7 – Repeat.

Day 10 – Repeat.

Day 13 – Repeat and done (fish should now be ich free).

After transferring, immediately sanitize the “old tank” and all equipment using bleach or vinegar. Rinse well. Let air dry thoroughly before next use. The air drying is the sterilization process when using vinegar, or detoxification process when using bleach.

Simply put, this process works because you are literally outrunning the parasite’s known life cycle. If a fish is infected with ich, trophonts will leave the fish at some point during the TTM process, and the encysted stage doesn’t have enough time to release theronts (i.e. free swimmers that re-infect the fish) before the fish exits the tank. Ammonia isn’t much of a concern with TTM, because every 3 days the fish is placed in a new tank with new water; or you always have the option of using ammonia reducers, such as Amquel or Prime, in conjunction with TTM since there is no risk of negative interaction because no medications are present. However, you do have the option of dosing Praziquantel (if you need to deworm) at the tail end of transfers 2 & 4 (or 1 & 3). The fish only needs 24 hours of exposure time to Praziquantel, so dose 24 hours before you are set to make the next transfer. A second round of Praziquantel is required 5-7 days after the first, but again dose the medication 24 hours before you are set to transfer the fish out. Just remember if you do this that you can’t use any ammonia reducers while Prazi is present in the water.

One of the cons to tank transfer is the amount/cost of saltwater needed to do it. For example, using my 2-10 gallons I go through 50 gallons of saltwater before the TTM process is complete. However, a thrifty hobbyist can use water stored from a recent display tank water change to implement TTM. Obviously, this only works if you are 100% confident that your display tank is disease-free and don’t siphon anything off the bottom. The other problem with TTM is netting the fish every 3 days. That concern can be somewhat alleviated by using a plastic colander in lieu of a net to catch the fish (square ones work better than round ones):

Pros – Chemical free solution to Marine Ich, highly effective when performed properly, can be combined with deworming via Praziquantel.

Cons/Side Effects – Cost (if using all new saltwater), time/effort expended, probably somewhat stressful on the fish being caught every 3 days, does not treat other diseases such as Marine Velvet Disease, Brooklynella, Uronema, etc.

 

[Plzpizza]

I forgot to mention, you could also use TTM to treat Ich. No chemicals. Just extra handling, and with puffers can't use a net. So it's a bit tougher to catch them. But no chemicals is a big plus.

What It Treats – Marine Ich (Cryptocaryon irritans) only.

How To Treat – Tank transfer (TTM) is my favorite method for clearing a fish of Marine Ich, but the prevalence (and similarities) of Marine Velvet Disease can make TTM a risky gamble nowadays. To properly execute TTM you need two tanks (or buckets), with dedicated equipment for each tank (not to be shared between the two). I personally use 2 of the 10 gallon tanks to do TTM, each with its own heater, thermometer, air stone, airline tubing and PVC elbows for hiding places. This is how TTM is implemented:

Day 1 – Fish is placed in initial QT.

Day 4 – Roughly 72 hours later transfer the fish to new tank. The time of day you do the transfer is unimportant, but never exceed 72 hours from the last transfer. The temperature and SG of the new tank should match the old one perfectly, so you can just catch & release (no acclimation). Transfer as little water as possible with the fish.

Day 7 – Repeat.

Day 10 – Repeat.

Day 13 – Repeat and done (fish should now be ich free).

After transferring, immediately sanitize the “old tank” and all equipment using bleach or vinegar. Rinse well. Let air dry thoroughly before next use. The air drying is the sterilization process when using vinegar, or detoxification process when using bleach.

Simply put, this process works because you are literally outrunning the parasite’s known life cycle. If a fish is infected with ich, trophonts will leave the fish at some point during the TTM process, and the encysted stage doesn’t have enough time to release theronts (i.e. free swimmers that re-infect the fish) before the fish exits the tank. Ammonia isn’t much of a concern with TTM, because every 3 days the fish is placed in a new tank with new water; or you always have the option of using ammonia reducers, such as Amquel or Prime, in conjunction with TTM since there is no risk of negative interaction because no medications are present. However, you do have the option of dosing Praziquantel (if you need to deworm) at the tail end of transfers 2 & 4 (or 1 & 3). The fish only needs 24 hours of exposure time to Praziquantel, so dose 24 hours before you are set to make the next transfer. A second round of Praziquantel is required 5-7 days after the first, but again dose the medication 24 hours before you are set to transfer the fish out. Just remember if you do this that you can’t use any ammonia reducers while Prazi is present in the water.

One of the cons to tank transfer is the amount/cost of saltwater needed to do it. For example, using my 2-10 gallons I go through 50 gallons of saltwater before the TTM process is complete. However, a thrifty hobbyist can use water stored from a recent display tank water change to implement TTM. Obviously, this only works if you are 100% confident that your display tank is disease-free and don’t siphon anything off the bottom. The other problem with TTM is netting the fish every 3 days. That concern can be somewhat alleviated by using a plastic colander in lieu of a net to catch the fish (square ones work better than round ones):

Pros – Chemical free solution to Marine Ich, highly effective when performed properly, can be combined with deworming via Praziquantel.

Cons/Side Effects – Cost (if using all new saltwater), time/effort expended, probably somewhat stressful on the fish being caught every 3 days, does not treat other diseases such as Marine Velvet Disease, Brooklynella, Uronema, etc.

Hi big G after reading your instructions like About TTM it’s more clear how to go about doing it. I thought it takes a lot of time but I ever only need to change it every 3 days and the air stone I could always use the same unit just unplug the tubing and plug it to another one. I would be using 2 redsea big blue buckets.

Catching porky isn’t a problem for me he is very calm with my hand I scoop him out barehanded a lot of times.