Randy's Tank and Learn Thread

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I have spent a lot of time working on this particular set of challenges.

Before you get too far down the road, I suggest defining what largely self-sufficient means. It drives design choices, equipment choices, etc. I had to adapt my current system to this lifestyle. I would have made different choices if starting from scratch.

Key considerations:
How long will the tank be left with no human eyes checking on things?

Will the checker be a total novice or have some knowledge?

Is emergency intervention by a competent resource possible if called upon?

I could make a whole forum on this particular topic :)

Yes, those are important questions and my situation is likely different than yours.

By far the greatest time I am away, I will be at a country home that is only 2 hours by car. While I might be away for as much as 2 weeks, if something like a security camera or wi fi temp measurement shows an issue, it would not be hard to get back.

There will of course be vacations far away, but that’s not the usual situation.

So these self sufficient items are feedings (including cold foods), ATO, AWC, dosing everything needed, and tell me as much as possible about things hard to see in a web cam, such as temperatures. I also need confidence these things proceed normally and are not complicated by controllers that might not like power failures. I’m aiming for dumb dosing pumps on timers for these items.

 

[dwest]

Randy, I run the Jebao DCP 8000 on my 180 reef from my basement to the first floor. I run it about 50% as I also run a mag drive (12 or 18) for redundancy. It’s been 2 years on the jebao and I’ve been very happy with it.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

That is interesting... Gemini thinks the same, that the DEP is newer/better.

Thanks. Maybe I was barking up the whole wrong Jebao tree. The DEP 8500 is only $81, and can be delivered to me faster than the dcp.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Randy, I run the Jebao DCP 8000 on my 180 reef from my basement to the first floor. I run it about 50% as I also run a mag drive (12 or 18) for redundancy. It’s been 2 years on the jebao and I’ve been very happy with it.

Thanks. :)

 

[dwest]

Thanks. :)

Randy, I forgot to mention that my sump is elevated about 4 ft or so for easy access. I believe the DCP 8000 would still be fine if the sump were on the floor if I cranked it up a bit though.

 

[Ocypode sinensis]

I’d like to match actual surface sunlight, or tad bluer. I’ll mess around with the app until it looks as good as it’s going to, and I do realize that matching sunlight is perfection that I won’t attain.

Something around 6,000 k is appealing, but I really can’t say until I try.

My original 175 w single ended 10,000k mh were nice, but the 250 w double ended 10,000k mh that replaced those were too cold for my preference.

I have a radion xr15pro and I just can't replicate the feel of sunlight, like there's always something off. I run mine at 8000K ish with elevated UV intensity.

 

[jsmkmavity]

Hey Randy, did you finally get all your bulkheads leak free?
Hope the new system is fun and runs smoothly!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

As a relative newbie and only having seen/heard of sumps being purpose-built, specifically designed equipment, I'm curious as to the 4x44g brute "cans"... do you mean actual trash cans or maybe the tote style. I'd love to hear your thoughts! :)

Will each have something different? (e.g., #1 is a filter / #2 is a refuguim / #3 cryptic / etc.?)

Yes, actual trash cans. All of these were used in my previous setup, so are old.

The sump/refugium setup is

Can 1. Water from tank enters here, so does diversion from the return pump, if needed. Excess rock, one 32 w led for macroalgae, and vinegar dosing if I need it. AWC removes from here.

Can 2. Skimmer, water cooled plastic tubing coil for cooling (more on that later). Temp sensor for cooling system.

Can 3, refugium with 3x32 w led, rock on bottom, AWC enters here or can 4.

Can 4. Return pump. Cold foods fed here. Heaters. pH meter. Temp sensor for heating controller. ATO measured and added here.

 

[rishma]

Yes, those are important questions and my situation is likely different than yours.

By far the greatest time I am away, I will be at a country home that is only 2 hours by car. While I might be away for as much as 2 weeks, if something like a security camera or wi fi temp measurement shows an issue, it would not be hard to get back.

There will of course be vacations far away, but that’s not the usual situation.

So these self sufficient items are feedings (including cold foods), ATO, AWC, dosing everything needed, and tell me as much as possible about things hard to see in a web cam, such as temperatures. I also need confidence these things proceed normally and are not complicated by controllers that might not like power failures. I’m aiming for dumb dosing pumps on timers for these items.

Understood. Sounds like you probably have thought through it already. I’ll share just one perspective. One of my basic principles is all equipment will fail. I make design choices such as redundancy and monitoring by considering these questions:

What’s the consequence of the failure?
How long is everything ok when it does fail?
How will I know when it fails?

The answer to these questions help me decide what to do.

For example, I don’t have redundancy or monitoring of my skimmer. It’s reliable enough and if it stops working and nobody notices it’s not a disaster.

On the other hand I do have redundancy and monitoring for my tank temperature.

 

[jonelder68]

Yes! Excited for you Randy. Will be following along. Are you using your tank to help with making a dosing additive/trace elements for the macros? One can only hope :beaming-face-with-smiling-eyes:

 

[schooncw]

Following

 

[stE25wy14]

Good luck!

 

[00W]

Thanks. I used external Iwakis for 20 years, but the efficiency was poor. I’d also like to use the heat from the submersible.

Anyone know of an actual case of a tank problem from a Sicce or Jebao breaking open and releasing metals?

I do not recall seeing an example. Just more fails of Jebao pumps than Sicce, but correspondingly less expensive too.

I've never heard of one.
I've used Iwaki, Little Giant, Sicce and Eheim over the years.
I've had issues with all and all were loud.
I switched to Jebao about 7 years ago and I've had zero issues.
I've been using a dcp 4000 on my display for 6 or 7 years without a single problem.
I run a dcw 8500 on my skimmer, 2500 on my reactor.
I also run 4 powerheads, all Jebao.
Only replaced one of those in many years.
Not the Jebao spokesperson but for the price they can't be beat.
And they're silent.
If you are running from the basement I'd suggest at least the 8500.
If it were me I'd go with the 10000.
You can always turn it down.
I will say I think Jebao's head numbers claim a lot more than they actually put out but I've never tested that.
I recommend them to everyone.

 

[twentyleagues]

On any and all my tanks that have sumps I run Jebaos. I have 2 4000 running my 2-125g stacked tanks a 6000 on my reef and a 10000 on my pond. Both the 125s and the pond have overhead "sumps". The 1-125 is elevated 6"off the floor and the sump is 8' above it the pump runs at about 75% to get the same flow as the one above it set at about 30%. These pumps have surprised me with their abilities coming from previously running a sump in the basement of my old house running reefflos, they are quiet, they are pretty powerful, I have had 3 running for over 5 years with 0 issues. I agree with @00W however go larger and turn it down if its too much flow. I dont believe they add any heat to the water. I heat the room and typically ambient room temp is 76f and tanks run a degree or two cooler without heaters.

 

[CHSUB]

Read tank is covered, but read you plan on a fug? I can go collect some mangrove propagules if you would like to add some to the fug. Will of course require additional lighting…

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Current Status

RO Buddie is up and running. Just a couple of sanfu’s, such as the DI lid not being tight enough and leaking fast while I was in another room. One of the DI cartridge plugs was rather difficult to remove, but it seems to be producing well now. In a few hours I’ll estimate a rate.

My recent RO buddie thread explaining why I got one (bridging to a permanent one) and how I selected 50 gpd:

RO Buddie question

Question for folks using an RO Buddie. I may get one to use as a bridge between when I need water and when my permanent RO/DI will arrive. The question is how accurate are the 50/75/100 gallon per day ratings they have? I want to wait to almost the last day to be sure I really need it (means...

www.reef2reef.com

Jebao DEP 8500 comes tomorrow. That will allow putting salt water into the tank and testing all connections.

Here’s a pic of the empty tank and stand set up in our living room:

 

[rishma]

That

Current Status

RO Buddie is up and running. Just a couple of sanfu’s, such as the DI lid not being tight enough and leaking fast while I was in another room. One of the DI cartridge plugs was rather difficult to remove, but it seems to be producing well now. In a few hours I’ll estimate a rate.

My recent RO buddie thread explaining why I got one (bridging to a permanent one) and how I selected 50 gpd:

RO Buddie question

Question for folks using an RO Buddie. I may get one to use as a bridge between when I need water and when my permanent RO/DI will arrive. The question is how accurate are the 50/75/100 gallon per day ratings they have? I want to wait to almost the last day to be sure I really need it (means...

www.reef2reef.com

Jebao DEP 8500 comes tomorrow. That will allow putting salt water into the tank and testing all connections.

Here’s a pic of the empty tank and stand set up in our living room:

that’s a nice looking piece of furniture. New stand? Refinished?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Old Tank Rejuvenation

It's going to take me a while to catch up on what I've done to date, but let's begin at the beginning.

Last fall when I decided to start again, I figured a first need was to see if the tank was going to be OK. It had sat in the garage for 8 years, ranging in temp from below zero F to likely above 120 F in the garage. But silicone is flexible and glass doesn't expand and contract that much, so I thought it likely to be OK, assuming I didn't damage it moving it out..

Tipping it off its end and onto its bottom was my first shock. I must be old and weaker now because it seemed awfully heavy and I cannot imagine how I got it from the house, down a bunch of deck steps and into the garage without breaking it, but so be it.

I scraped out as much of the dead coralline as I could (most came off easily) and swept it out.
First test was to see if it held water, both at the glass seems and around the overflows. Filled it with water and waited two days. Woohoo, no leaks!

Next step was to add some citric acid (Mrs Wages from the local Ace Hardware) to the water and dissolve away a bunch of the deposits. Some of the parts of the weir of the overflow were clogged with calcium carbonate, so I also poured some of the dry powder citric acid into the openings. I used the whole container.

Left that running for a few days with a powerhead in it. Then I tipped it up on its end, flushed it out with more tap water, and left it in the garage over the winter waiting to be used.

Battle scarred and old, but it seems that it will work!

 

[ChrisfromBrick]

Return Pump

I’m planning to get a Sicce SDC 7 or 9 to pump water from the basement fish room up about 10 vertical feet and through several fittings and turns to get to the display.

I do not intend it to provide much flow via the return, so the turnover can be reasonably low. The 7 may be plenty. Thoughts on that choice are welcome. The fact that it can communicate over the internet is a plus. Can it tell me anything except temperature?

Before I get one of these, I’m likely to get a Jebao from Amazon to use right away, and then it can become an emergency backup. I was thinking of the DCP-6500. Thoughts on that choice?

Thanks in advance!

It can tell you its status whether there may be maintenance needed. Its a great pump. I just cleaned mine after 11 months since I got a message saying maintenance required. Wifi/app are excellent. I have the 3.0.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

That

that’s a nice looking piece of furniture. New stand? Refinished?

It was custom made for the tank years ago and has been sitting in the basement. The canopy is matching and also looks nice. I think the wood is walnut. It was made by Blue something. Cannot recall exactly. The edge in front has been sanded and is awaiting a finish coat to prevent water damage.

One concern I have is whether the fasteners may have gotten weaker over the years. I don't want to risk coming home and finding the whole setup in a heap on the floor, or worse, have my head in the under-stand cabinet when it lets go.

A 120 reef tank is very heavy, so I cut 4 tight fitting 2 x 4's and put them inside the cabinet in each corner, spanning from below the wood deck to the cabinet bottom. i actually had to put some old hard plastic parts under them to get a tight fit, then tapped them into place with a hammer. The cabinet bottom is not literally on the floor, only the ends and front/back are, so I filled out the area under the bottom board in each corner with wood (luckily, some old wood boards we just the right thickness). Thus, those 2x4's can take up any slack in supporting the tank.