Rev's 400+ Gallon Basement Inwall

[reeferfoxx]

Thanks guys! Any particular brand of peroxide?

Darn it Rev. I was hoping we could pursued you from using chemicals to combat this. Its just not necessary and does more harm than good. Oxidizers do nothing for microbial communities but drive them to low or extinct numbers.

If anything, the reoccurring words that anyone has stated and had success with is UV. Ditch the bottles and jump on the 260nm UV bandwagon. Set it and forget it.

 

[Brew12]

I have a hard time believing that the answer to dinos is in the extreme measures. I would think that it all comes down to out-competing them and balancing the diversity of the system over time.

Completely agree with this.

You can run UV and keep the dino population down.
You can use H2O2 to keep the dino population down.
You can turn off the lights and keep the dino population down.

All of these methods work on some strains of dino's.

In my opinion, the best way to deal with dino's is through bio-diversity. I used to be able to get dino's to grow in my tank by running GFO. It would go away when I pulled the GFO. I could get my tank to grow cyano by carbon dosing. My tank used to live on a very fine edge that way. I found I had 2 problems. First, somehow my system was iron limited which kept me from growing algae well. To fix this I dosed iron and improved my fuge lighting. Second, I increased the biodiversity through adding algaes and Fiji mud. Haven't seen dino's or cyano since.

One thing I often see that I don't understand is the recommendation to add nitrifying bacteria products to fight cyano/dino's. I don't understand that recommendation. I feel this doesn't hurt, but doesn't offer the same benefits that adding more typical free water ocean bacteria would.

Another thing to keep in mind is that carbon dosing and GFO will throw your tank out of balance. The only reason to use either method is if the food you are adding is also unbalanced. If you are adding natural foods, algae growing should remove those nutrients in a very similar proportion to how they are added.

 

[themcfreak]

Wow. Several hours of today spent reading this entire thread. Amazing fish room! Amazing tank! Going to follow to see what happens with the Dinos. Hoping I never get them. What introduces them, normally?

 

[Turbo's Aquatics]

I used to be able to get dino's to grow in my tank by running GFO.

I could get my tank to grow cyano by carbon dosing.

What's ironic about that is that most people's answer to those 2 issues are those 2 products (or at least one of them)

I feel this doesn't hurt, but doesn't offer the same benefits that adding more typical free water ocean bacteria would.

Where can one get their hands on free water ocean bacteria? Is that like free range chickens?

If you are adding natural foods, algae growing should remove those nutrients in a very similar proportion to how they are added.

So in other words, as close to fresh as you can possibly get. So no pellets, flakes, etc...Reef Frenzy all the way ;Smuggrin

Second, I increased the biodiversity through adding algaes and Fiji mud.

After only just hearing about the "shot o mud" technique the other day, this is now popping up in a lot of conversations. Only I heard of using Miracle Mud, not specifically "Fiji Mud". Is there a difference? I suppose I could google that but....;Brb

 

[Brew12]

Where can one get their hands on free water ocean bacteria? Is that like free range chickens?

I'd love to be able to take a large sock filter into the Florida Keys, run lots of water through it, and back rinse it into my tank. The more floaties the better. Well, as long as hypodermic needles don't float!

Since I can't do that....

After only just hearing about the "shot o mud" technique the other day, this is now popping up in a lot of conversations. Only I heard of using Miracle Mud, not specifically "Fiji Mud". Is there a difference? I suppose I could google that but....;Brb

I'm less fond of Miracle Mud, since it is dried out prior to packaging. That kills some of the life I would like to see preserved. This seems more targeted to adding trace elements which can help with microalgae.
Garf Grunge is another one that is making a resurgence. It is basically sump muck from a mature system shipped to preserve all the bacteria, worms, pods, and other critters that older systems benefit from. You get lots of life, but odds are you don't get much in the way of trace elements.
I used the Walt Smith Fiji mud because I could get it easily from BRS. I actually had ulva that started growing out of the mud when I added it to my tank so you do get some diversity in organisms. Not as much of the creepy crawlies as you get with Garf, but I'd guess the bacteria/algae is more diverse. You also get the trace element boost similar to Miracle mud.

 

[Turbo's Aquatics]

@revhtree google this and do some research but: Dr Tim's One and Only, then once the dinos are almost gone, Dr. Tim's Waste-Away, skim that out, and then follow with Hydrogen Peroxide. The Hydrogen Peroxide alone is only one piece of the puzzle. I'll try to find a link for you

 

[bubbaque]

Rev, I'm curious if you ended up giving the peroxide a try. If so, how's it going so far?

 

[revhtree]

Thanks y’all.

I did a 3 day blackout and Dinos we’re almost completely gone out of the main system. But like a dummy I left the frag tank lights on as normal and since it’s plumed in it all started collecting there. As soon as the lights came back on the dino algae started coming back in full force in the main and decreasing to almost nothing in the frag tank.

I started peroxide dosing today. How often are you guys dosing? I went with 1 ml per 10 gallons.

Rev, I'm curious if you ended up giving the peroxide a try. If so, how's it going so far?

 

[bubbaque]

Thanks y’all.

I did a 3 day blackout and Dinos we’re almost completely gone out of the main system. But like a dummy I left the frag tank lights on as normal and since it’s plumed in it all started collecting there. As soon as the lights came back on the dino algae started coming back in full force in the main and decreasing to almost nothing in the frag tank.

I started peroxide dosing today. How often are you guys dosing? I went with 1 ml per 10 gallons.

You dose 1 ml per 10 gallons once a day. I tried to do it at night when they are free swimming.

 

[Second Shot]

Did you identify which type of Dino you have? Could help better choose the treatment.

 

[revhtree]

Did you identify which type of Dino you have? Could help better choose the treatment.

 

[JonJ]

I’m no expert but those look like what I had (coolia dinoflagellates). Newer tank (5 months) and saw what I thought was diatoms on the sandbed. I had been testing zero n03 and p04 making it impossible for any algae to grow and allowing dinos to take hold. I beat them by doing the following:

-twice a week water changes sucking out the top layer of substrate and discarding it.

- ditching Fuge light and throwing out chaeto.

- feeding heavy with high quality foods twice a day (Lrs, PE mysis and other frozen)

- testing phosphates with Hanna ULR tester and nitrates daily and making sure that I stayed above zero on both (feeding even more when low)

While my results are anecdotal, I feel that dinos are opportunistic and take hold in tanks where nutrients are poor and biodiversity is low. I feel each tank has to find the balance between nutrient import, export and clean up crew. My tank with its current bio load doesn’t need chaeto and I feel that it stripped what little nutrients I had available, giving dinos a chance to take hold. You never used to see dinos “back in the day” and IMO its from starting new tanks with more export than needed. How many brand new setups do we see with pellet reactors, gfo, carbon, chaeto and all of the other gadgets and gizmos. They all have their place but we need to add them as necessary and not on new tanks. Good luck- I hate those dang things!

 

[Turbo's Aquatics]

@jason2459 check Rev's images in the post a few above, any insight?

I still say this:

@revhtree google this and do some research but: Dr Tim's One and Only, then once the dinos are almost gone, Dr. Tim's Waste-Away, skim that out, and then follow with Hydrogen Peroxide. The Hydrogen Peroxide alone is only one piece of the puzzle. I'll try to find a link for you

 

[jason2459]

Would be interesting to see movement and higher contrast images. See how many flagela there are and try and get any eye spots.

Initial impression Prorocentrum sp. comes to mind.

 

[A+Aquatics]

Many moons ago, @Davesgt hooked me up with a microscope. I've wanted one since I was around the age of 8. We used to have a cheap one with prepped slides already composed for viewing, such as threads, grass, cricket wings, etc.

You convinced me to get the microscope out and see if I could understand how to work it.

This is what I found...

 

[Teknik777]

Revtree need some more pictures of the fish room, gem tang, display etc. Come on man!

 

[KenJ]

Use the Peroxide 2 times a day once first light then 12 hours later just before dark. Worked for me. It takes a while but it works!

 

[JBKReef]

Burned through the 118 pages, what a ride... Hope the dinos are going extinct! The page/tank needs to get back on track so all the trash talk can resume. Most I've laughed at a build thread yet.

Best of luck!

 

[najer]

Burned through the 118 pages, what a ride... Hope the dinos are going extinct! The page/tank needs to get back on track so all the trash talk can resume. Most I've laughed at a build thread yet.

Best of luck!

Great post, @revhtree we do the good with the bad, mostly, on our journals, let us help, that is kind of what the forum does!?
You can post pristine pics of it when you are ready, warts and all!?

 

[bubbaque]

Rev, I know it's only been a few days but have you notice any difference in the dino since dosing peroxide?