Ron Reefman's Rock Flower experience

[Ron Reefman]

Here is kind of a synopsis of what happened last night:

Elaine noticed the RFA stretched up while she was in the kitchen. She called my attention to it and we both went for a closer look. As we did, we could see the nem was spawning.

From the time we noticed the spawn, and the tank was already a tiny bit cloudy, I turned off the HOB filter and the in-tank skimmer. The big nem spawned for about 45 minutes and I'm going to guess that in total it was probably about an hour (could have been more). The smaller RFA started after we had started paying attention and it only spawned for about 20 minutes. The spawning came in 'waves'. The nem released a long string and then stopped for a 2 to 5 minutes and then started again. It did that over and over for the entire 45 minutes. As time was passing the big nem which had been stretched up did settle down a bit lower. But it was still obviously raised up even at the end, but then it quickly settled back down into it's end cap.

After the spawning stopped, I let the small (low flow) powerheads run for about 10 minutes. Then I shut them down as well and left the tank totally still for 20 minutes. My hope being that some of the spawn might 'settle' onto the other nems, or that the others would have an easier time collecting spawn. I'm not sure that was helpful, but that's what I did. I also collected some spawn with a turkey baster as it was being released and tried to deliver it to a few of the bigger and prize RFAs.

Some of you may have seen that I posted an issue we had the day before (or the middle of the night before) with the RFA breeding tank. The HOB filter got clogged (due to my cleaning an algae film off the glass. It pushe up the sponge and overflowed water out the back side of the case onto the top of the stand. When I got to it, it had sucked the tank to about half full. But that meant the ATO had delivered about 5 to 7 gallons of fresh water to the tank. I added new salt water to the tank and was surprised to see the SG was just about on the money. I expected it to be well below normal???

Then yesterday, 10 sexy shrimp and 5 porcelain crabs arrived and I added them to the tank. Yesterday about midday I shut off all the flow and fed small brine shrimp to the RFAs. Flow was restarted about 10 minutes later, once the RFAs had opened back up.

So all that change and commotion in the tank and then 2 nems spawn that night from about 7pm to 8pm.

I seriously doubt the time of year, phase of the moon or change in the length of the day had anything to do with the spawning. We're a week past the equinox, we're 4 days past a new moon (coral in the South Pacific spawn on a full moon) and the real length of day in the tank doesn't vary as the lights are on a timer and it hasn't changed since I started the tank.

So now Elaine and I will try to pay close attention and see if we can't catch the females when they deliver babies (assuming that happens at all). I think at least a couple of people have said that they thought the time was about 10 to 14 days, but one other reefer thought more like a month. Any thoughts on that point?

I can't tell you how excited I am by all this. But given my obsessive rambling post, you probably get the idea!;Wideyed;Wideyed;Wideyed;Woot;Woot;Woot

 

[crusso1993]

Very exciting and cool that you and Elaine were home and got to witness the spawning! Thanks for sharing, Ron.

 

[rcmike]

Really cool! Hope you have lots of babies from it.

i have noticed I’d there is a drastic change in water parameters that my snails will spawn so maybe RFAs do that too.

 

[Ron Reefman]

Really cool! Hope you have lots of babies from it.

i have noticed I’d there is a drastic change in water parameters that my snails will spawn so maybe RFAs do that too.

I've heard that idea expressed before and I've seen the same kind of response in some plants. Stress them and they flower and create seeds to propagate the species.

Now we'll see if we get babies. BTW, I have tanks of 5g, 10g, 20g and 40g (2 actually) if I should need more room for babies!

 

[Schnizzle]

My big one was standing up once this weekend and the crab was surfing on it but I did not notice a spawn. I could have missed it... That would be interesting if some tanks starting syncing up.

 

[Ron Reefman]

Well, the spawning in my RFA breeding tank happened on Friday the 27th of March, 10 days ago. So Elaine, my wife, and I have decided that starting at 9 days we should start observing the tank more, especially in the evening, to watch for babies being released. The common wisdom here has been that the gestation period was either 10 to 15 days or about 30 days. We figured at 9 days we'd pay closer attention. Last night was day 9 and instead of seeing babies being released, we had 2 different RFAs spawn!

Unlike last time, we caught it after it had been going for a while as the water was hazy even though the HOB filter and in-tank skimmer were both running. So I shut off everything and we got this video of the last release of spawn with almost no water movement. Notice the cloud of spawn on the oral disk of the nem from previous releases. We didn't do stop watch timing, but our best guess is the release takes about 10 seconds and then the nem takes a 1 minute break, then does another 10 second release. This happens over and over. We think this process can take anywhere from 30 to 60 minutes.

Now we have had 2 spawning events 9 days apart. The first one at 7pm and the second one at 5:30pm. I guess that makes early evening the time we'll watch most closely for future spawning events. Now we watch for the release of babies and hopefully get a better idea of the gestation period. And in a tank with no fish, only filter feeding porcelain crabs and tiny sexy shrimp, just one small rock and black sand, we should get a good count of how many babies get released. I also hope we get a good video!

 

[Ron Reefman]

Well, we have been watching the new RFA breeding tank pretty closely since day 9, when 2 additional RFAs spawned. That was quite a surprise for us, a second spawn by 2 additional RFAs just 9 days after the first two spawned. Now we are 18 days from the first spawn and 9 days from the second spawn and last night yet another RFA spawned! It was the biggest RFA in tank! That makes 5 identified males.

I left the filtration, skimmer and powerheads on through the entire process this time. And this one made the most spawn we have seen to date. The tank was so foggy with spawn that it was difficult to see through just 10" of water! And when it was done the nem was about 1/4th it's normal size and sucked down into the PVC end cap it is attached to. That was at 8pm last night and at 7am this morning the water was clear and the RFA that spawned looked perfectly normal and back up to being the biggest nem in the tank.

 

[bsn_rn_cen]

I found my first rfa baby last night. I was probably a little overly excited... I wish I would have caught the spawn but I'm happy to have a baby.

 

[Ron Reefman]

After 3 good spawns in a small tank with almost nothing but RFAs and my ability to turn off filtration during the spawn, I expected a lot of babies. I'd had 10 to 20 each of the 3 events when they were all in my big DT with fish, crabs and more.

We saw nothing early last night. But this morning we have found 3 very small babies. Yes, just 3. And they are spread kind of far apart. the back left, the back right and 2/3rds of the way forward from the back and 1/3rd of the way in from the left. So location of these babies gives me no idea which RFA was the mother of these babies.

The other thought That I had is that the mother might have been a young RFA, wherefore smaller, and may not have had many eggs to fertilize. But it could also just be a timing thing. Males were ready and spawned, but the females were not ready and there were only a few eggs.

Now, we had 3 spawning events. So how much time passed from each one until we saw babies? That gives us 3 possible gestation periods:

3/27 spawn until 5/3 babies = 37 days
4/5 spawn until 5/3 babies = 28 days
4/14 spawn until 5/3 babies = 19 days

At least now we have some slightly better data for the gestation period. It's possible these are from the first spawn and we may not see any more babies. But the optimist in me is hoping that 37 days is the gestation period and the second spawn from 4/5 may produce more babies on or about 5/12. Or the final spawn from 4/14 may produce babies on or about 5/21.

 

[raketemensch]

Hmmm, and you said you left everything on the second time, so it's hard to say whether that was a factor or not?

 

[Ron Reefman]

Hmmm, and you said you left everything on the second time, so it's hard to say whether that was a factor or not?

Yes. We didn't catch the 2nd spawn at the start. We weren't paying close attention because we had just seen a spawn 9 days before. So the 2nd and 3rd spawns were totally a surprise. By the time we saw the 2nd spawn, the water was very foggy and we just let the 2 small powerheads, the HOB filter and the in tank skimmer on.

Now it's been 6 days since we found the 3 babies and nothing has changed. My thinking is, the gestation period is about a month and these babies could have been from either the first or 2nd spawn. But that's just my gut feeling and there still isn't any science to say for sure. Having 3 spawning events certainly clouded the ability to make a firm scientific data point.

And I don't know why just 3 babies. That's definitely the smallest 'litter' I've had. And most other people here who have seen babies, seem to have bigger numbers as well. My 3 previous rounds were 10 to 20 babies. And these are all the same anemones. But they are all in a new tank and I did have a salinity issue when my ATO created a siphon and dropped the SG down to 1.014 for a couple of hours. And once I caught it, I got it back up to 1.020 quickly and up to 1.026 over the next 24 hours.

That was before any of the spawning events. It may even have been one of the reasons they spawned. Lots of plants and animals reproduce due to stress. And the salinity could have damaged the sperm, or the eggs, or both. And that's why the low number of babies.

I'd love to hear anybody's comments or opinions about these suggestions.

 

[najer]

That was before any of the spawning events. It may even have been one of the reasons they spawned. Lots of plants and animals reproduce due to stress. And the salinity could have damaged the sperm, or the eggs, or both. And that's why the low number of babies.

I only have one that sulks behind a rock where I can't see it!
I would agree about the stress response being a potential factor.

 

[dracus]

Hey all. I just learned of RFAs about a week ago and ordered a couple after doing a little reading. Then I obsessively read all 25 pages of this amazing thread - great resource Ron! Anyway, my two ultras arrived today and I was able to successfully place them on a rock. It has pretty deep holes/crevices and I think I'll be able to fit 4-5 RFAs on it. Here's a pic - this is only a few hours after I placed them on the rock so I imagine they'll open up a bit more after they acclimate. Now I need to order a bunch more so I can have a better shot at getting both genders. I'm completely obsessed with the successful spawning I've seen in this thread!

Some quick tank info: I have a 75ga Reefer 350, bare bottom, with Kessil A160WEs. The RFA rock is on the bottom of the tank in between the two lights, so relatively low PAR compared to the rest of the tank.

 

[Ron Reefman]

Hey all. I just learned of RFAs about a week ago and ordered a couple after doing a little reading. Then I obsessively read all 25 pages of this amazing thread - great resource Ron! Anyway, my two ultras arrived today and I was able to successfully place them on a rock. It has pretty deep holes/crevices and I think I'll be able to fit 4-5 RFAs on it. Here's a pic - this is only a few hours after I placed them on the rock so I imagine they'll open up a bit more after they acclimate. Now I need to order a bunch more so I can have a better shot at getting both genders. I'm completely obsessed with the successful spawning I've seen in this thread!

Some quick tank info: I have a 75ga Reefer 350, bare bottom, with Kessil A160WEs. The RFA rock is on the bottom of the tank in between the two lights, so relatively low PAR compared to the rest of the tank.

Just a comment to try and help you along. These colorful RFAs come from slightly deeper water and as such, may not do photosynthesis as well as their bland looking brothers and sisters that live in the shallows. Therefore, it's really a good idea to feed them something every couple of weeks. And maybe even every week if you want them to breed. Almost any food will do. I feed mine all kinds of things, but mostly frozen brine shrimp and cut up shrimp I collect out in the estuary. In fact today I brought home a bunch of snails and tiny grass shrimp from the beach. I also had a few very small fish (1/4 to 1/2 inch) in the jar and they died. I set those on some of my favorite RFAs and they all ate them in no time!

BTW, a day at the beach... love that crystal clear water!

Me searching along the edge of the mangroves

A good size lightning welk

A nice Florida fighting conch

We saw lots of sand dollars

A crown conch which is more common in estuaries than along the beach

This one is special. The shell is a Pear, but the mollusk is gone. A good size hermit crab has moved in. On the top of the shell there are at least 2 Hitchhiker anemones, one with a purple mouth and 1 or 2 toward the top of the shell that appear to have orange mouths. They attach to shells or the carapace of crabs. When the crab eats the anemone gets bits of food that flow away. But the crab gets some protection by having anemones attached that keep some predators away. I love hitchhiker anemones, but they are not photosynthetic and need to be feed regularly. I kept one for about 6 months one time, but now I leave them alone.

 

[dracus]

Just a comment to try and help you along. These colorful RFAs come from slightly deeper water and as such, may not do photosynthesis as well as their bland looking brothers and sisters that live in the shallows. Therefore, it's really a good idea to feed them something every couple of weeks. And maybe even every week if you want them to breed.

Thanks, I definitely plan on target feeding them weekly. I read every word in every post in this thread, so I've gathered a lot of good info so far. I'd never heard of RFAs before last week and now you could definitely say I have an obsession. I love your RFA breeder tank, that's an excellent idea!

 

[SamMule]

Yep, this thread inspired me as well... Just got a 6 pack of little Ultras added to our little 16g cube. Really hoping to get some offspring!

 

[ApoIsland]

I've heard that idea expressed before and I've seen the same kind of response in some plants. Stress them and they flower and create seeds to propagate the species.

Now we'll see if we get babies. BTW, I have tanks of 5g, 10g, 20g and 40g (2 actually) if I should need more room for babies!

You can definitely get them to spawn with a stress induced event. I would imagine normal survivability and growth decreases in these cases though.

I had spawning both times I have moved in the last 3 yeas (usually do (75-90% water change during move) as well as when I forgot to turn the power back on after feeding and the tank was without power for about 36 hours. Those 3 events each resulted in 50+ babies. The babies appear 3-4 weeks after spawning and usually hang on for a couple months while slowly disappearing.

After the last event I was very good about feeding every 2-3 days and had 15-20 that grew from the size of a pin point to the size of a pencil eraser over the course of a couple months. The rest disappeared.

Unfortunately I lost my mind and introduced a file fish for the aiptasia. Well the file fish was moved from the sump to the display tank in the morning before I went to work. By the time I got home every baby nem was gone and the adults were curled up. Removed the file fish immediately. Over the course of a week a few baby nems started slowly reappearing. This was a couple months ago and only 5 or 6 have appeard of the 15-20 that were doing good though. I'm sure the file fish was able to get a big enough chunk out of most of them that they perished.

 

[Ron Reefman]

@ApoIsland
Your info fits in well with what happened in my breeding tank. The babies appeared 37 days after the first spawning and 28 days after the second. My best guess is the first spawn was the responsible one.

And you make an excellent point about feeding the babies. These colorful RFA don't due photosynthesis as well as the shallow, far less colorful RFA do. They can survive with normal feeding of the fish, but they do far better if they are really fed.

 

[raketemensch]

I had spawning both times I have moved in the last 3 yeas (usually do (75-90% water change during move) as well as when I forgot to turn the power back on after feeding and the tank was without power for about 36 hours. Those 3 events each resulted in 50+ babies. The babies appear 3-4 weeks after spawning and usually hang on for a couple months while slowly disappearing.

After the last event I was very good about feeding every 2-3 days and had 15-20 that grew from the size of a pin point to the size of a pencil eraser over the course of a couple months. The rest disappeared.

How big have your babies gotten? Any idea on the growth rate?

 

[ApoIsland]

How big have your babies gotten? Any idea on the growth rate?

I had one survive long term from the first spawning event that I never fed at all. It grew to about the size of a dime in about two years.
Another from the second spawning event grew to about half the size of a dime over the course of a year. Never fed this one either.

The 15-20 that survived and grew from the last spawning event about 6 moths ago really varied in growth. You could definitely see an increased growth rate and survivability rate with food though. A few grew to the size of a pencil eraser, a couple to half dime size, but the majority stayed very small, maybe half of a pencil eraser, over those couple months.

They received food 2-3 times a week (mysis only) for the first couple months before I lost motivation. Feeding is such a pain in my tank with the three tangs, the copper banded, and the one wrasse that really beat them up for the food. From the time when I stopped feeding, to when I stupidly introduced the file fish, the growth really slowed. They definitely benefit from feeding. In my tank at least.

This weekend I'll try to snap and load some pics of the babies that survived the file fish disaster.