Simple Question About Ammonia Detoxifiers

[livinlifeinBKK]

Which product should I use in my QT (no meds involved observations only)...Prime or Amguard to detoxify ammonia? Of course I'll be doing water changes daily but while I'm trying to train my fish onto frozen foods a lot will probably go uneaten and buildup some ammonia. I'll also be running an airstone for oxygenation and have a couple pieces of live rock wisl the bacteria should help as well but I'd feel better if I had a product I could trust on hand to detoxify ammonia just to be safe.

 

[Dan_P]

Which product should I use in my QT (no meds involved observations only)...Prime or Amguard to detoxify ammonia? Of course I'll be doing water changes daily but while I'm trying to train my fish onto frozen foods a lot will probably go uneaten and buildup some ammonia. I'll also be running an airstone for oxygenation and have a couple pieces of live rock wisl the bacteria should help as well but I'd feel better if I had a product I could trust on hand to detoxify ammonia just to be safe.

Prime does nothing to reduce free ammonia concentration. I did not test Amguard, not sure whether @taricha did. I would keep a bottle of nitrifying bacteria on hand if you need an emergency fix. Also, lowering the pH several tenths is a quick way to rapidly decreasing free ammonia.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

Prime does nothing to reduce free ammonia concentration. I did not test Amguard, not sure whether @taricha did. I would keep a bottle of nitrifying bacteria on hand if you need an emergency fix. Also, lowering the pH several tenths is a quick way to rapidly decreasing free ammonia.

How would you suggest lowering the pH of I needed to?

 

[Dan_P]

How would you suggest lowering the pH of I needed to?

I would add dilute acid while monitoring pH.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I personally would not use either one as I do not have evidence they are useful.

products containing hydroxymethanesulfonate may be a better get. Chloram-x for example.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/323540441_Effect_of_Sodium_Hydroxymethanesulfonate_on_Ammonia_and_Related_Water_Quality_Parameters

 

[Garf]

Which product should I use in my QT (no meds involved observations only)...Prime or Amguard to detoxify ammonia? Of course I'll be doing water changes daily but while I'm trying to train my fish onto frozen foods a lot will probably go uneaten and buildup some ammonia. I'll also be running an airstone for oxygenation and have a couple pieces of live rock wisl the bacteria should help as well but I'd feel better if I had a product I could trust on hand to detoxify ammonia just to be safe.

I would cycle the QT and eliminate any need for questionable ammonia reducers.

 

[Dan_P]

I personally would not use either one as I do not have evidence they are useful.

products containing hydroxymethanesulfonate may be a better get. Chloram-x for example.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/323540441_Effect_of_Sodium_Hydroxymethanesulfonate_on_Ammonia_and_Related_Water_Quality_Parameters

Chloram-X does not reduce the concentration of unionized ammonia in seawater in the same tests that show Prime does not.

The ammonia test used in the above reference seems to be using the salicylate method which uses bleach or other chlorine source which is reduced by compounds like hydroxymethanesulfonate. Increasing the concentration of hydroxymethanesulfonate would appear to to be reducing ammonia concentration only because it destroys the chlorinating reagent in a concentration dependent manner.

 

[taricha]

Prime does nothing to reduce free ammonia concentration. I did not test Amguard, not sure whether @taricha did. I would keep a bottle of nitrifying bacteria on hand if you need an emergency fix. Also, lowering the pH several tenths is a quick way to rapidly decreasing free ammonia.

I didn't look at amguard either. The directions all seem consistent with a more concentrated version of Prime.

Like Dan said,
BioSpira, Fritz Turbo Start (One and Only also but slower) show unambiguous ammonia removal while ammonia "binder" / "detoxifier" products leave you no way to confirm that they work.
They interfere with total ammonia chemical tests and free ammonia sensing films don't detect a decrease.

HCl to drop pH to ~7.6 around the aragonite buffer level is a good way to lower the toxicity. going lower, you'd just dissolve aragonite and it'll go back to ~7.6ish.

These and having ability to do water changes to treat by dilution are ways you can be certain you are addressing the risk of toxicity.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

I didn't look at amguard either. The directions all seem consistent with a more concentrated version of Prime.

Like Dan said,
BioSpira, Fritz Turbo Start (One and Only also but slower) show unambiguous ammonia removal while ammonia "binder" / "detoxifier" products leave you no way to confirm that they work.
They interfere with total ammonia chemical tests and free ammonia sensing films don't detect a decrease.

HCl to drop pH to ~7.6 around the aragonite buffer level is a good way to lower the toxicity. going lower, you'd just dissolve aragonite and it'll go back to ~7.6ish.

These and having ability to do water changes to treat by dilution are ways you can be certain you are addressing the risk of toxicity.

I got some Fluval Cycle Biological Booster on standby that's supposed to allow immediate introduction of fish instead of prime or guard after hearing from you and @Dan_P . I haven't tried it before but it has great Amazon reviews and appears to be a similar product to the ones you suggested

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

I got some Fluval Cycle Biological Booster on standby that's supposed to allow immediate introduction of fish instead of prime or guard after hearing from you and @Dan_P . I haven't tried it before but it has great Amazon reviews and appears to be a similar product to the ones you suggested

Hopefully you don't already have fish in the qt... If that's true, then just cycle like you would any other tank and add critters once ammo is 0.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Hopefully you don't already have fish in the qt... If that's true, then just cycle like you would any other tank and add critters once ammo is 0.

Oh, and plan to siphon/vacuum out any uneaten food...

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

Hopefully you don't already have fish in the qt... If that's true, then just cycle like you would any other tank and add critters once ammo is 0.

Well I do have a very small fish in the QT right now but when I added him I transferred a good bit of rock from my DTs to the QT to detoxify any ammonia and am vacuuming when I do water changes daily

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Well I do have a very small fish in the QT right now but when I added him I transferred a good bit of rock from my DTs to the QT to detoxify any ammonia and am vacuuming when I do water changes daily

Sounds like you're doing everything right