This will end the hobby: AMENDMENTS TO LACEY ACT IN HOUSE COMPETES ACT HR4521

[TheDorkLord]

This one?

Text - H.R.4521 - 117th Congress (2021-2022): Bioeconomy Research and Development Act of 2021

Text for H.R.4521 - 117th Congress (2021-2022): Bioeconomy Research and Development Act of 2021

www.congress.gov

 

[mdb_talon]

The amendment wants to turn it into a whitelist, pretty much ban anything that isn't on it.

They are proposing a whitelist, so a reversal of the current state. It would assume that everything is harmful until proven otherwise. Good luck proving that for wild imports. And who will pay for doing the research needed to prove a species is not and will never be harmful to humans, either directly or via pathogens it may carry?

Again that is not at all what it does. There are valid reasons you may have to oppose it....however what you keep describing is not it.

 

[mdb_talon]

@TheDorkLord

No. See here. https://usark.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/2022-HR4521-excerpt.pdf

 

[TheDorkLord]

@TheDorkLord

No. See here. https://usark.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/2022-HR4521-excerpt.pdf

Thanks

 

[brmc1985]

Again that is not at all what it does. There are valid reasons you may have to oppose it....however what you keep describing is not it.

Exactly. The act is basically saying nothing is changing with common species in the trade. NEW SPECIES or ones that are not common like rare lizards, snakes, monkeys etc can be affected. But we don’t need every new dang animal in captivity. The intent of the act is to ban animals that could be harmful to humans via diseases (see Covid 19), livestock disease and invasive to the environment. That’s it

 

[polyppal]

Aw man I wish the non-alarmist posts started earlier. I was already draining my tank!

Quick! Flush the Tangs before the Feds get here!

 

[mdb_talon]

Quick! Flush the Tangs before the Feds get here!

Lol. With the price of some tangs it might be worth the risk of doing "hard time" and hoping the dont find them

 

[flagg37]

How does one go about proving that a species is not invasive without first letting it in?

 

[brmc1985]

Lol. With the price of some tangs it might be worth the risk of doing "hard time" and hoping the dont find them

Breed and sell on the black market since OP thinks the government is coming for all our pets.

 

[brmc1985]

How does one go about proving that a species is not invasive without first letting it in?

We pretty much know what species are invasive and have them banned already. This is for new species that are trying to be imported.

 

[flagg37]

We pretty much know what species are invasive and have them banned already. This is for new species that are trying to be imported.

Right, but for those new species, how can you tell if it’s going to be invasive? In this case you need to prove the reverse. What possible criteria can be used to judge a species is safe to be able to allow it.

 

[GARRIGA]

USARK has been battling this since 2008. Won the battle but apparently not the war. I breed Boas and oddly for me it was never a threat although at one point it seems it would be. Now I’m not sure we will ever end this. Although the interstate restrictions would likely increase my business since all in state now have limited options other than driving out to acquire. Crazy how one group thinks another should be.

 

[LegalReefer]

I dont see anything like what is being described. I did not read all the entire act but did read the language for the amendments to the lacey act(the relevant part for this discussion)and it is not as described here at all. I am not saying i agree with the amendments as written , but it certainly it is nothing like the thread subject declares.

What the act does do is prohibit many animals(though based off their classifications coral would not be included) from being imported if that animal had not been imported in more than minimal quantities in the prior year unless it gets added to the white list. My only problems here is the bill does not define "minimal quantities" they push that off until after bill is passed. In any case i would not expect this bill to have much impact at all immediately(though could over time depending on politics of getting newly desired species added to white lists)

See below for the text i believe to be relevant.

‘‘(1) IN GENERAL.—Importation into the
7 United States of any species of wild mammals, wild
8 birds, fish (including mollusks and crustacea), am-
9 phibians, or reptiles, or the offspring or eggs of any
10 such species, that is not native to the United States
11 and, as of the date of enactment of the America
12 COMPETES Act of 2022, is not prohibited under
13 subsection (a)(1), is prohibited, unless—
14 ‘‘(A) during the 1-year period preceding
15 the date of enactment of the America COM-
16 PETES Act of 2022, the species was, in more
17 than minimal quantities—
18 ‘‘(i) imported into the United States;
19 or
20 ‘‘(ii) transported between the States,
21 any territory of the United States, the Dis-
22 trict of Columbia, the Commonwealth of
23 Puerto Rico, or any possession of the
24 United States; or
VerDate Nov 24 2008 16:47 Jan 25, 2022 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 01663 Fmt 6652 Sfmt 6201 C:\USERS\KLMERYW

If this is the actual direct language of the amendment, we’re probably mostly fine. Note it specifies fish with mollusks and crustaceans subcategorized. Nowhere in this thing does that include cnidarians, so corals are probably ironically unaffected (tho this may simply be an oversight on the part of the drafters, and could be corrected with redefinition of terms), even tho this seems to be targeting the more niche wild pet trade. Looks like we’re mainstream now, ladies and gents!

 

[brmc1985]

Right, but for those new species, how can you tell if it’s going to be invasive? In this case you need to prove the reverse. What possible criteria can be used to judge a species is safe to be able to allow it.

You study it’s natural habitat. If there are habitats in the US that are similar then there is a chance it would be invasive. Example is big snakes in Florida. Zebra mussels from Russia. Lion fish in Florida.

 

[brmc1985]

If this is the actual direct language of the amendment, we’re probably mostly fine. Note it specifies fish with mollusks and crustaceans subcategorized. Nowhere in this thing does that include cnidarians, so corals are probably ironically unaffected (tho this may simply be an oversight on the part of the drafters, and could be corrected with redefinition of terms), even tho this seems to be targeting the more niche wild pet trade. Looks like we’re mainstream now, ladies and gents!

Sadly coral probably isn’t considered invasive because of ocean acidification and wafter temperature and will pretty much be gone for the most part. Some states have bans on some already but there is no threat from corals taking over Iowa.

 

[MNFish]

What is the definition of more than minimal quantities as I feel to me that is where the grey area is.

the species was, in more than minimal quantities—

 

[flagg37]

You study it’s natural habitat. If there are habitats in the US that are similar then there is a chance it would be invasive. Example is big snakes in Florida. Zebra mussels from Russia. Lion fish in Florida.

So by that logic, there’s pretty much no animal that could be imported since the US has such a diverse environment. No fish/coral since it could be invasive to Hawaii. No tundra animals since they could be invasive to Alaska. Desert animals, no luck, Arizona and New Mexico. Even rainforest animals would likely be invasive to the redwood forests in California.

 

[flagg37]

This is a federal bill is it not? So it would apply to the import of animals into the US as a whole not individual states.

 

[JPM San Diego]

Is this a phishing attempt?
Don't give out your information

 

[brmc1985]

So by that logic, there’s pretty much no animal that could be imported since the US has such a diverse environment. No fish/coral since it could be invasive to Hawaii. No tundra animals since they could be invasive to Alaska. Desert animals, no luck, Arizona and New Mexico. Even rainforest animals would likely be invasive to the redwood forests in California.

Invasive isn’t just could an animal live in that environment. It’s more of “could this animal reproduce and take over and severely impact the natural habitat”