Why am I swimming vertically?

[TK_KW]

I've currently finished up two rounds of praziopro. Noticed ich so now I've started to ramp up copper. I have cupramine on hand. Ive slowly ramped up copper over last four days. Copper level currently sits at 1.28ppm after today's dosing. Anything I can do for this girl, or do I just wait it out? Thanks

Edit: swims vertically or darts in normal direction in up right position, but she slowly turns on side after a few seconds. Then swims to up right herself vertically. If that makes sense

 

[Frtdrmrose7]

That is a typical spinal injury, there is some evidence that this can be brought on by meds and not always injury. You can dose 1 Tablespoon of pure USP Epsom salts per 5G to help. To confirm this can you post a video or just look for decreased or no use of his tail. Realistically though odds of recovery are low, eventually they will stop eating and lay on the bottom of the tank. I would provide a low flow tank for her and you’ll just have to wait it out unfortunately.

 

[TK_KW]

That is a typical spinal injury, there is some evidence that this can be brought on by meds and not always injury. You can dose 1 Tablespoon of pure USP Epsom salts per 5G to help. To confirm this can you post a video or just look for decreased or no use of his tail. Realistically though odds of recovery are low, eventually they will stop eating and lay on the bottom of the tank. I would provide a low flow tank for him and you’ll just have to wait it out unfortunately.

When I feed misis it went straight for it and ate. I figured it's a result of copper or whatnot, as it's been fine for weeks. Tank has hob filter and power head pointed at surface for agitation. Fingers crossed but not hold my breath

 

[Frtdrmrose7]

When I feed misis it went straight for it and ate. I figured it's a result of copper or whatnot, as it's been fine for weeks. Tank has hob filter and power head pointed at surface for agitation. Fingers crossed but not hold my breath

It can be a result of copper and I’ve never found a reason for it. usually if it is a spinal issue it will get worse before it gets better. I’m not trying to be all gloom and doom but if this is a spinal issue the prognosis is not good. Wishing you the best of luck.
Can you post a video?

 

[rkpetersen]

This sucks, I just went through this with a laboutei.
I got it fat and sassy from DD, eating right from the start.
Went through GC in water and food first. Did great.
Around the time of dosing CP, maybe slightly before, not certain, I noticed it swimming a bit odd.
This progressed to paralysis of the anal fin and back third roughly, in about 36 hours.
Did not see an injury but could have happened; tank is small and covered. Fish was never a dasher that I witnessed.
No copper at all in the tank.
Was eating at first, then stopped.
The fish had a constitution of iron and although not eating, was still alive and moving around.
Then it developed typical swim bladder symptoms.
Spinal paralysis and swim bladder condition.
Probably should have just euthanized it then. But I didn't see it giving up, so I didn't.
Dosed epsom salts a few times, also added kanamycin.
The fish survived two separate swim bladder venting procedures performed by myself.
The second was performed with Tricaine anesthesia and was successful at both relieving the condition and not immediately killing the fish, much to my surprise.
Spinal paralysis however showed no evidence of improving. The fish could swim but to a limited extent, but sometimes still upside down, although now at the bottom not the surface.
Even though it had great muscle mass to start and probably a good bit of fat stored in his liver before he got sick, he was noticeably thinner.
Finally euthanized him after 15 days of not eating. Could he still have recovered from the paraplegia? I hope not.
Having a fish that is horribly disabled but otherwise still active is so much worse than having a fish that just dies quickly, as bad as that can be.

I wish you better luck.

 

[TK_KW]

It can be a result of copper and I’ve never found a reason for it. usually if it is a spinal issue it will get worse before it gets better. I’m not trying to be all gloom and doom but if this is a spinal issue the prognosis is not good. Wishing you the best of luck.
Can you post a video?

Not sure why the quality is **** after uploading but it's something visual

 

[Frtdrmrose7]

Not sure why the quality is **** after uploading but it's something visual

Yes that is a spinal injury as I suspected. Like I said keep it in low flow, try Epsom salts, and unfortunately it’s a wait and see situation. Sorry

 

[TK_KW]

This sucks, I just went through this with a laboutei.
I got it fat and sassy from DD, eating right from the start.
Went through GC in water and food first. Did great.
Around the time of dosing CP, maybe slightly before, not certain, I noticed it swimming a bit odd.
This progressed to paralysis of the anal fin and back third roughly, in about 36 hours.
Did not see an injury but could have happened; tank is small and covered. Fish was never a dasher that I witnessed.
No copper at all in the tank.
Was eating at first, then stopped.
The fish had a constitution of iron and although not eating, was still alive and moving around.
Then it developed typical swim bladder symptoms.
Spinal paralysis and swim bladder condition.
Probably should have just euthanized it then. But I didn't see it giving up, so I didn't.
Dosed epsom salts a few times, also added kanamycin.
The fish survived two separate swim bladder venting procedures performed by myself.
The second was performed with Tricaine anesthesia and was successful at both relieving the condition and not immediately killing the fish, much to my surprise.
Spinal paralysis however showed no evidence of improving. The fish could swim but to a limited extent, but sometimes still upside down, although now at the bottom not the surface.
Even though it had great muscle mass to start and probably a good bit of fat stored in his liver before he got sick, he was noticeably thinner.
Finally euthanized him after 15 days of not eating. Could he still have recovered from the paraplegia? I hope not.
Having a fish that is horribly disabled but otherwise still active is so much worse than having a fish that just dies quickly, as bad as that can be.

As I'm new to marine fish keeping, I'm just trying my best. With the help of all of you, the information is so vast and helpful. But I understand it happens. But it bugs me. But I absolutely can not stomach having ich, or anything else, in my large DT if I can prevent it. I'm learning so much every day

 

[TK_KW]

Yes that is a spinal injury as I suspected. Like I said keep it in low flow, try Epsom salts, and unfortunately it’s a wait and see situation. Sorry

Thanks for your help

 

[Frtdrmrose7]

You are doing the right thing by qt’ing. You will save yourself a lot of work and heartache in the future.

 

[BestMomEver]

It sucks losing them, especially when you’re doing everything to help them thrive. I think we’ve all been there. Keeping my fingers crossed for her..

 

[TK_KW]

You are doing the right thing by qt’ing. You will save yourself a lot of work and heartache in the future.

Quick question.

If you add 1 tbsp per 5G. How often do you do that? Does it stay in water volume or dissipate?

 

[Frtdrmrose7]

Quick question.

If you add 1 tbsp per 5G. How often do you do that? Does it stay in water volume or dissipate?

Once and honestly I’ve never heard of it fixing this, it’s more of a hail Mary because of its anti inflammatory properties.

 

[sean rand]

I've currently finished up two rounds of praziopro. Noticed ich so now I've started to ramp up copper. I have cupramine on hand. Ive slowly ramped up copper over last four days. Copper level currently sits at 1.28ppm after today's dosing. Anything I can do for this girl, or do I just wait it out? Thanks

Edit: swims vertically or darts in normal direction in up right position, but she slowly turns on side after a few seconds. Then swims to up right herself vertically. If that makes sense

If u said ur using cuppermine than 1.28 is WAY to high

 

[Frtdrmrose7]

If u said ur using cuppermine than 1.28 is WAY to high

Good catch, yes if using cupramine it is therapeutic at .5

 

[lagatbezan]

Do huge water change to drop the copper level down.

 

[Frtdrmrose7]

Quick question.

If you add 1 tbsp per 5G. How often do you do that? Does it stay in water volume or dissipate?

What copper is in this water now?

 

[TK_KW]

i thought its 1.75 jesus. i must has mis read. ***. good thing i have 55g pre heated and pre mixed. Doing emergency water change right now

 

[TK_KW]

What copper is in this water now?

1.28ppm of cupramine, as of 530 pm tonight. hanna checker test

60% water change? or more?

 

[Frtdrmrose7]

i thought its 1.75 jesus. i must has mis read. ***. good thing i have 55g pre heated and pre mixed. Doing emergency water change right now

Cheleted copper is 1.75 (copper power,etc). This may be the cause of the spinal issue. Let’s cross our fingers she gets better in a sterile tank.