A believer in H2O2

[Nano_Tuners]

Wanted to share my experience with the effectiveness of H2O2 baths

This whitetail tang had an advanced case of velvet, and after a few days in the QT was on deaths door :(

I ended up treating him with a 30m Hydrogen Peroxide bath (following @Humblefish instructions) followed by a standard prophylactic quarantine. Within 24 hours of the first bath, there was no visible trophants on the fish, and he appeared to be much less stressed... Two weeks in now (with another bath this weekend) and he seems to be recovering quite well!

My new standard QT procedures will start with peroxide baths from now on!

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/hydrogen-peroxide.640232/#post-6845416

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I'm working on some H2O2 dosing experiments right now. There are low and high dose test strips available that help with checking dosages and confirm some assumptions that have been made. One thing that turns out not to be true is "aeration drives off H2O2". The instructions I saw said not to aerate the bath. Well, using the tests, I found that 24 hours of heavy aeration didn't appreciably lower the concentration at all. Likewise is the advice not to use plastic with peroxide. Think about it, what containers do they sell it in? There are just certain plastics that are incompatible.

I'm looking at four main uses:

1) algae control in reefs
2) dips for Amyloodinium (already a paper out on that)
3) as an adjunct oxygen source in heavily stocked tanks (not reefs obviously)
4) sterilizing agent for tanks as a replacement for bleach

This is going to be a long project, as I only have a few minutes each day to work on it....

Jay

 

[brandon429]

It’s a good thing we are a decade past the concern that peroxide use kills biofilters, it doesn’t whatsoever. Now that forums exist which allow experimentation and fair debate, peroxide experimentation can proceed to the benefit of reefing. Ten years ago peroxide was deemed so devastating by several mods on different forums that discussion was squelched totally, truth still poked through apparently.

peroxide is now a permanent tool for the hobby, though they hoped it wouldn’t be.



we still argue to this day in the chemistry forum here regarding whether or not peroxide use kills biofilters...but anyone with a serious interest can see from any single peroxide dosing thread on google it didnt harm a filter, or cause a cycle, even on the accidental overdose runs. As of today I think we truly have thirty thousand separate peroxide dosing threads to sample for patterning, and the pattern is nobody concerns over the biofilter anymore except for old school chemistry holdouts who think work threads are mere anecdote and nothing useful

 

[josephxsxn]

1) algae control in reefs
2) dips for Amyloodinium (already a paper out on that)
3) as an adjunct oxygen source in heavily stocked tanks (not reefs obviously)
4) sterilizing agent for tanks as a replacement for bleach

@Jay Hemdal Heavy user of #1 (dips for frags with alage) and #4 here, I dont do anything with Bleach. If there is anything I can share to help please let me know would be happy to explain.


@StudioReef thanks for sharing your story! It seems like every month this hobby is starting to advance more and more compared to when I started.

 

[Nano_Tuners]

I'm working on some H2O2 dosing experiments right now. There are low and high dose test strips available that help with checking dosages and confirm some assumptions that have been made. One thing that turns out not to be true is "aeration drives off H2O2". The instructions I saw said not to aerate the bath. Well, using the tests, I found that 24 hours of heavy aeration didn't appreciably lower the concentration at all. Likewise is the advice not to use plastic with peroxide. Think about it, what containers do they sell it in? There are just certain plastics that are incompatible.

I'm looking at four main uses:

1) algae control in reefs
2) dips for Amyloodinium (already a paper out on that)
3) as an adjunct oxygen source in heavily stocked tanks (not reefs obviously)
4) sterilizing agent for tanks as a replacement for bleach

This is going to be a long project, as I only have a few minutes each day to work on it....

Jay

The aeration tip is nice, I have just stirred it in. I also use a food safe plastic bucket for the dips - I think humblefish said somewhere else the idea of not using plastic was anecdotal

 

[Nano_Tuners]

It’s a good thing we are a decade past the concern that peroxide use kills biofilters, it doesn’t whatsoever. Now that forums exist which allow experimentation and fair debate, peroxide experimentation can proceed to the benefit of reefing. Ten years ago peroxide was deemed so devastating by several mods on different forums that discussion was squelched totally, truth still poked through apparently.

peroxide is now a permanent tool for the hobby, though they hoped it wouldn’t be.



we still argue to this day in the chemistry forum here regarding whether or not peroxide use kills biofilters...but anyone with a serious interest can see from any single peroxide dosing thread on google it didnt harm a filter, or cause a cycle, even on the accidental overdose runs. As of today I think we truly have thirty thousand separate peroxide dosing threads to sample for patterning, and the pattern is nobody concerns over the biofilter anymore except for old school chemistry holdouts who think work threads are mere anecdote and nothing useful

In such an expensive hobby, with all its 'snake oils', its nice to have something come along that is extremely cheap, effective for multiple things, and available everywhere

(in 6mos, companies will be selling "Hydropro Max" for $9.99/bottle :rolleyes:)

 

[brandon429]

to this day in the chemistry forum we battle over whether or not its harmful, I like how forums provide ongoing, near perpetual snake oil filtration :)

besides if they readily accepted everything I like too, would reefing be as fun we need the checks and balances to have things to post about

it sure does garner repeating patterns though in so so many ways, far too many to be relegated to happenstance or anecdote. we're into full prediction mode lol eight years ago: look at a tank picture, state what lives and dies from a peroxide dose, log on file whether it was accurate prediction or not.

even though everything gets contacted, we know the patterned sensitives and conversely the tough animals, which is just about every animal expect lysmata shrimp. there aren't too many standouts, we consider no reef fish to be sensitive in our peroxide application threads / hammering out algae. I never knew it could help in fish disease till humble posted it a while back, handy stuff. lysmata shrimp are amazingly weak to it, remarks upon something unique in their metabolism I bet / tbd. they're the standout weakest link in peroxide work, trace amounts has killed them very very very high degree. we have several 20K$ + sps mixed reefs dosing it in our logs, only lysmata are the concern not someone's 22 year old tridacnid / irony.

 

[Nano_Tuners]

I'm working on some H2O2 dosing experiments right now. There are low and high dose test strips available that help with checking dosages and confirm some assumptions that have been made. One thing that turns out not to be true is "aeration drives off H2O2". The instructions I saw said not to aerate the bath. Well, using the tests, I found that 24 hours of heavy aeration didn't appreciably lower the concentration at all. Likewise is the advice not to use plastic with peroxide. Think about it, what containers do they sell it in? There are just certain plastics that are incompatible.

I'm looking at four main uses:

1) algae control in reefs
2) dips for Amyloodinium (already a paper out on that)
3) as an adjunct oxygen source in heavily stocked tanks (not reefs obviously)
4) sterilizing agent for tanks as a replacement for bleach

This is going to be a long project, as I only have a few minutes each day to work on it....

Jay

It would seem like an ideal solution to sterilize tanks. When COVID hit (and everyone was disinfecting everything) I read an article stating that using pure H2O2 (in a spray bottle) is an almost instant disinfectant, whereas bleach and other disinfectants are technically supposed to 'soak' on a surface for several minutes before you wipe them off.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

It would seem like an ideal solution to sterilize tanks. When COVID hit (and everyone was disinfecting everything) I read an article stating that using pure H2O2 (in a spray bottle) is an almost instant disinfectant, whereas bleach and other disinfectants are technically supposed to 'soak' on a surface for several minutes before you wipe them off.

Trouble is, with organic material, the H2O2 gets reduced pretty quickly. The new test strips (I got mine on Amazon) can tell you if there is any residual peroxide left or not.

Jay

 

[JRAD]

I had on outbreak of velvet that came in on some live rock that I should not have put directly into my tank. By the time I realized what was happening 3 of my 7 fish were dead. I had copper power on hand but no dip other than plain water. Ran to the store and bought some h2o2. I heavily aerated a gallon of tank water and rounded up the remaining fish and dipped for 1 hour. Most were showing signs of velvet. After the dip the fish were clearly more comfortable and went through copper without a problem. 6 weeks later all alive and well!

 

[Seabiscuit]

I'm working on some H2O2 dosing experiments right now. There are low and high dose test strips available that help with checking dosages and confirm some assumptions that have been made. One thing that turns out not to be true is "aeration drives off H2O2". The instructions I saw said not to aerate the bath. Well, using the tests, I found that 24 hours of heavy aeration didn't appreciably lower the concentration at all. Likewise is the advice not to use plastic with peroxide. Think about it, what containers do they sell it in? There are just certain plastics that are incompatible.

I'm looking at four main uses:

1) algae control in reefs
2) dips for Amyloodinium (already a paper out on that)
3) as an adjunct oxygen source in heavily stocked tanks (not reefs obviously)
4) sterilizing agent for tanks as a replacement for bleach

This is going to be a long project, as I only have a few minutes each day to work on it....

Jay

I would love to read about your experiments later on. I follow you already. Will followers be notified when you post your findings?

 

[ScottR]

I’ve been dosing H2O2 directly to my tank. Mainly for algae and cyano control. I have to say I’ve seen no downsides whatsoever. I’ve used it for dipping zoas, especially those with zoa pox. I have overdosed my dips a few times and it melted zoas. I’m still learning. But best to start slowly and work your way up. As for fish parasites, this is something I will experiment with and update at a later time.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I would love to read about your experiments later on. I follow you already. Will followers be notified when you post your findings?

Yes - I’m running the tests specifically for posting here.

Jay

 

[monicalooze]

I’ve been dosing H2O2 directly to my tank. Mainly for algae and cyano control. I have to say I’ve seen no downsides whatsoever. I’ve used it for dipping zoas, especially those with zoa pox. I have overdosed my dips a few times and it melted zoas. I’m still learning. But best to start slowly and work your way up. As for fish parasites, this is something I will experiment with and update at a later time.

How much are you dosing? Has it worked well for algae and cyano?

 

[brandon429]

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/r...lenge-thread-hydrogen-peroxide.187042/page-28
Look at that Ulva invasion we wiped out, huge reefs all fixed up. I have seen peroxide used about fifty thousand times and that was in 2019 alone lol we love the stuff. Its the single best cheat I have ever been shown or will ever be shown in reefing. I found that by initial force control over uglies vs allowed invasion, the common road, we can disallow plants and foster coralline production, then it wards off plants and we can back off with the perox

I haven't dosed my rocks for algae in ten years, they're all coralline.

peroxide cleans my glass though.

 

[Nano_Tuners]

I had on outbreak of velvet that came in on some live rock that I should not have put directly into my tank. By the time I realized what was happening 3 of my 7 fish were dead. I had copper power on hand but no dip other than plain water. Ran to the store and bought some h2o2. I heavily aerated a gallon of tank water and rounded up the remaining fish and dipped for 1 hour. Most were showing signs of velvet. After the dip the fish were clearly more comfortable and went through copper without a problem. 6 weeks later all alive and well!

Thats awesome, similar to my tang scenario. I think the bath does a lot to help them cope with the rest of the QT treatment.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Yes - I’m running the tests specifically for posting here.

Jay

Thanks for this Jay.

Glad to see h2o2 is gaining some traction. I have been doing hybrid TTM with h2o2 for quite a while now, previously did h2o2 dips before the hybrid TTM, dipping frags in it for as long as I can remember and using it for algae control for many years. Luckily the algae control is no more lol. Lots of tangs solve that problem.

If you need any data, I have notes for all fish ran through it. I also have numerous setups to help in testing if that is needed as well.

Just let me know.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Thanks for this Jay.

Glad to see h2o2 is gaining some traction. I have been doing hybrid TTM with h2o2 for quite a while now, previously did h2o2 dips before the hybrid TTM, dipping frags in it for as long as I can remember and using it for algae control for many years. Luckily the algae control is no more lol. Lots of tangs solve that problem.

If you need any data, I have notes for all fish ran through it. I also have numerous setups to help in testing if that is needed as well.

Just let me know.

Thanks - but the key for what I'm doing stems from using the dip and read test strips, not calculated doses, you aren't using the strips are you? The trouble is that the "delivered" dose of H2O2 is dependent on the organic loading of the system - so you may calculate a dose for one tank, but that dose will be different in a tank with different organics, as they reduce the peroxide preferentially.

I just finished two tests yesterday - H2O2 at 25 ppm is stable in freshly mixed, aerated seawater for 72+ hours. I also ran a test of a series of bleach solutions and peroxide solutions on samples of algae/polyp covered plastic sheet and found that peroxide isn't a good bleaching agent, and didn't dissolve the polyps (we use bleach for cleaning jelly exhibits and I hoped that the easier-to-rinse peroxide would work better...it did not). A 1:5 bleach solution was the lowest dose that worked well (so about 1% active hypochlorite). Peroxide even at at 3% didn't work.

Jay

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Thanks - but the key for what I'm doing stems from using the dip and read test strips, not calculated doses, you aren't using the strips are you? The trouble is that the "delivered" dose of H2O2 is dependent on the organic loading of the system - so you may calculate a dose for one tank, but that dose will be different in a tank with different organics, as they reduce the peroxide preferentially.

I just finished two tests yesterday - H2O2 at 25 ppm is stable in freshly mixed, aerated seawater for 72+ hours. I also ran a test of a series of bleach solutions and peroxide solutions on samples of algae/polyp covered plastic sheet and found that peroxide isn't a good bleaching agent, and didn't dissolve the polyps (we use bleach for cleaning jelly exhibits and I hoped that the easier-to-rinse peroxide would work better...it did not). A 1:5 bleach solution was the lowest dose that worked well (so about 1% active hypochlorite). Peroxide even at at 3% didn't work.

Jay

I was using test strips. Once I get home, I will take a look at my notes and get you the brand of test strips.

 

[Abhishek]

I definitely will be following this study and thank you for doing this @Jay Hemdal .
I would be interested in knowing what concentrations of H2O2 are we looking at for disinfecting and for Amyloodinium.
Also what test strips do you use for finding the right ppm of H2O2 concentration.

I have used this Amazon product ASIN B07WNRWXD5 for eyeballing 150 ppm of H2O2 while doing hybrid TTM but I shall be very very interested in knowing your study results .