Are we ruining the hobby???

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PacificEastAquaculture

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I've been a marine aquarium hobbyist since 1965. Actually, we did quite well back then at keeping all types of fish, inverts, anemones, etc. I had many tanks and worked at Marine World in the Chicago area. Tanks were beautiful, basic, and most fish lived well. Myself and friends had all sorts of fish that would spawn and it was an enjoyable hobby. I loved seeing fish from all over the world: Pinecone fish from the South China Sea, Purple Tangs from the Red Sea, Clownfish from the Phillipines, fish hand caught by Rodney Jonklaas in the Indian Ocean, chunks of rock with sponges, gorgos, and corals from the Keys, all kinds of inverts, etc. With just a basic understanding of nitrogen cycle, the hobby was fun and relatively inexpensive and accessible to most folks.

Then in the 80s the hobby transformed into reefkeeping with the ability to keep more corals. As time has gone on the hobby progressed from most folks not being able to keep too many different corals and buying colonies to where we are today with designer corals and tiny frags.

In some respects this has been the natural progression, as equipment such as lighting and skimmers, etc. have improved--so has the ability to not only keep but propagate most corals.

When Pacific East Aquaculture started in 1999-2000 we sold lots of colonies and started growing some frags. We described the corals as Blue Acropora or Pink Bird's Nest and that was sufficient. At that time most folks were thrilled to just be able to just keep such corals alive. Naturally, over time we saw many of our customers become vendors as the ability to keep corals became more understood and easier so did the ability to propagate them. This progression was great.

At some point several years ago the number of coral vendors grew exponentially. I recall being one of maybe 3 coral vendors at MACNA in DC years ago to now there are close to a hundred. Things began to change as the industry became more competitive. In order to stand out and sell their corals vendors began using crazy names and prices to create so-called limited editions. Auctions started, and live sales, all in the interest of driving the hype, increasing sales, and profitability. Great, right? It's the American way, right? Good marketing.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not whining about this progression, just observing from many years on the inside. But, have we gone too far? Is where we are at now healthy for this hobby/industry? Are we bringing in enough new hobbyists to sustain it all? Have we made this into a rich man's hobby?? $1500 1/2 inch designer Acro frags, 25,000 angelfish, $1000 must have controllers, $800 can't live without LED fixtures, impossibly complicated dosing regimens, etc., etc! Have we killed the joy?

The weekly live sale or Ebay auctions and the endless hype leads to the frenzied hobbyist that is constantly trying to one-up other hobbyists. Tanks filled with tiny frags and the thought by many that if I get the latest designer coral I can grow it out and make a fortune.

But, what about the future of the hobby? Are we making it too complicated, too expensive, too elitist?? Are star polyps, leathers, and bubble corals no longer enough? Of course not, right?

True story: several years ago at a swap, (I use to be a vendor at about 25 a year), I had about 30 frags of really nice blue Zoanthids. Many folks came up to our booth and liked them, but they asked "what's the name"? When I shrugged my shoulders and said blue zoos, they walked away even though they liked the coral. By the early afternoon I became frustrated and started calling them King's Ransom Zoanthids. As the afternoon crowd flocked in we started selling them. Soon I had folks coming up asking if I had any of them King's Ransoms! And indeed, the very same coral that we couldn't sell any, sold out within a couple hours. What did this show me? Obviously I'm really dumb about marketing!! OK, admittedly, I still prefer, to my detriment, to say Blue Acro instead of Rainbow Swirl Atomic Passion Acro. Sure I'd sell more Atomic Passions, but it still gives me an icky feeling. Yeah, I know, I'm just dumb!

So, I know this thread will bring endless responses about how the designer craze is not what most folks want and object to it. But, at the same time I'll see someone ask "ID please, what's the name of this" , and they don't mean Acropora sarmentosa, they want Atomic Passion.

OK, so I'm getting to be an old curmudgeon. Maybe so, I've always been more of an old school low tech reefkeeper. I shun most new technology. I feel it makes things too complicated, expensive, prone to disasterous failures, and drives off potential new hobbyists. I'm so tired of folks coming into my store that are new hobbyists that feel reef tanks are impossible to keep or are bogged down in and endless string of agonizing problems from water chemistry perplexities to nuisance algae to losing all their fish to a parasite because they bought one fish at the local pet shop staffed with high school kids with zero experience.

I know, the Genie is out of the bottle now and it ain't going back in! So, just get with it old man!


I worked here late 60s - mid 70s. At the time they ran ads in TFH and other magazines on the theme of "I'm not so rare at Marine World" and showed a different fish each month, such as the then rarely seen Flame Angelfish!
MarineWorld1_600x.jpg


We went from barely being able to keep corals alive to now propagating them easily. But, have we gone too far?? Designer names, insane prices, expensive equipment made out to be essential, complicated dosing requirements, etc. Where does this ultimately take us???
IMG-20180703-WA0000~2.jpg



What about bringing new hobbyists in? The kids? Does everyone have thousands$$$ to afford that "impossible to keep" reef aquarium?
StudentsInterns5.jpg


Anyway, it's been an interesting journey. Can't wait to see what's next. The coral export bans are transforming the hobby again. We shall see how it all turns out in the next year or two.
 
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S2G

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Interesting read. Personally I think it's turned into a circus and has gone too far. What goes up must come down though. It will level out im sure.

I can't fault anyone for cashing in on the latest craze. No such thing as bad publicity right?
 

tripdad

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I agree with much of what you said but temper it with the new knowledge we gain. It is now considered possible to get corals to spawn in our tanks. More hobbiest are trying to stretch the boundaries on the kinds of animals we can keep alive long term. Yes, there are some downsides and many regrets. I enjoy a crazy colored stick as much as anyone but I have grown to understand that while I like them, I don't need them to be happy. If I buy one, great, if I buy a nice birdsnest colony that's great too.
 

Mandelstam

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Interesting read and many good points!

I'm very new to the community and to reefing so I don't have your perspective. I know this isn't the whole picture but from a lot of what you see online and in forums you kind of get the picture that many hobbyists are also in it to make money. Or at least earn some money back. Buy a designer coral, frag it into microscopic parts and resell it. Kind of a vicious circle, you have to make money from the hobby to be able to afford the hobby. Sometimes that's the feeling I get anyway.

If I was a kid today I would NEVER be able to afford it. If I didn't have a decent well payed job I couldn't afford it. So yes it is elitist.

Also makes me think of the Dutch tulip bulb market bubble in the 1600's. At the peak ONE BULB could be worth six times an average person's annual salary. And then it all just crashed of course. Like so many other market bubbles.
 

falconut

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My thought are very similar to yours. Though I've never been a vender, just a hobbyist.

I've always had a small budget & was only able to turn my saltwater tank into a reef when I found some cheap magnetic ballasts & Diy halide reflectors & bulbs. It was very successful, but always went with the more affordable no-name corals. I even switched to cheap LEDs & still worked & looked great to me. Never used a controller and had a fully manual system, prices were too rich for me. So, it can be done on a cheaper budget, just have to really searvh around.

I'm always amazed at how people will pay so much for these designer corals. The same for some of the high priced equipment. I find it too much, but to each his own.
 

MrWheelock

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I'd consider myself a young guy, starkly fresh to this hobby in comparison, and I just want you to know that this article hits me in the feels.

I'm guilty I look at people's corals here and see the names and think man I gotta have that some day! Reading this thread really makes me take a step back for a second and think...

What can we as hobbyist, wholesalers, and at home entrepreneurs do to make this better?

As sad as it is the ban isn't likely to settle the market, honestly it will likely have the opposite effect. As the ban goes on some corals will get hard to source driving thier cost up.

Will aquaculturing be the tipping point? I see it has an upward trend from my point of view in the last 4 years.

Can aquaculture save this hobby? The balance will be hard, with more and more suppliers out there if the ban stays long term, this will in my opinion over time drive the cost down. With that though down also goes the profit for the aquaculturist.

Regards, thanks for posting this topic.
 
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Question - who is "we"? We being the hobbyist or we being a side hustle (hobbyist selling frags) or we being an aquaculture farm (you and similar small businesses) or we being the chop shop and/or boutique sellers.

I think the lines are starting to blue and would say yes, this is turning into a rich man/woman hobby or those willing to spend outside their means. You above all know I'm a huge fan of your business but even buying from you I have to buy during a sale or limit my selection. Most of your selection is out of my price range and the fish I would like to own I can't justify it.
Example: Dejongi Gramma @ 2500. I would love to own one of those but that is outside my budget. Is that your fault? No. How about the St. Thomas Polyp Mushroom at 199? No. Again, outside my budget. While I would really like a lot of the nicer or more colorful acropora's or mushrooms I simply cannot. Two in college prohibits me personally and my lack of planning isn't anyone's fault but mine and mine alone.

The more I write a reply the clearer it comes down to being the answer is no and it is my problem that limits me and mine alone. It isn't your issue I am limited and if people are paying 200 dollars or more for a mushroom more power to you and your team. I just know I can't so stay within my box.

The drive to be in the 1%, the risk takers of a small business owner employing like you do, no idea. It is beyond me. I don't have it. I did when I was 30 something but chose a different path. No regrets. I wish you and others though nothing but success and I'll continue to buy during the sales. That is all I can do.
 

Quietman

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Any hobby that gets popular and many that don't have the same trends. It's not enough to enjoy it, it has to have a special language and equipment and if you don't have the latest gear, knowledge etc, even though you've been doing it for years successfully - you're not really a "insert hobby name here". I'm thinking hiking, bike riding, running, music, games, etc. Everything I've enjoyed over the years. Seems like there's always two basic types of people...those that enjoy doing a hobby and those that enjoy the hobby culture. Some are both of course but you get my point. Nothing wrong with either per se, just how it is.

Good news though...old fuddy duddy's in a hobby start to become known as purists and a whole new back to basics trend usually starts...at three times the price. :)
 

TheHarold

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I would agree the hobby is dead in terms of just enjoying being able to keep these animals. Everything is about the best equipment, the best livestock, etc. Now the startup costs for even a small tank can easily be $50 per gallon. Ridiculous. It’s all commercial now, unfortunately. Very few people are willing to grab a $40 40b, a few T5s, and hang on filter,
 

andrewkw

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I would say the bans have hurt far more then any coral fad. There are no more cheap colonies as long as there is no more Indo. There are plenty of $5-$10-$20 frags but there are very very few cheap colonies left. Aquaculture is going to continue to grow and this is mostly a good, even great thing, but it's always going to cost more to grow something then it would to import it.

What's $1000 today will be $100 in a few years ect. Prices are never going back to the way they were but the same can be said about everything else that costs money. The fact that bread and butter corals are so expensive is imo more concerning then $1000 frags.

You just have more choice today then yesteryear, it's up to the individual to set a budget and a direction. Unless the price of glass, acrylic and water sky rocket you can still do a reef on various budgets. Black Box led's for instance are way cheaper than replacing your PC bulbs every 6-12 months and more modular so you can start with one or 2 add another and then another. Chinese DC pumps / powerheads are cheaper then Tunze's ect. They don't last as long and are not as good but they are way cheaper and can get the job done. Skimmer selection is through the roof these days with every possible budget.

For the record I don't think things are better now, I just don't think it's less enjoyable. While I'm not as old school as you I do miss lining up Saturday mornings for fresh $40 corals and making friends with people in line. I'm still having fun posting about my tanks and reading about others adventures on reef2reef ect.
 

Bob Weigant

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Great read and I mostly have to agree. This hobby is brutally expensive and when friends come over and start asking questions my answers blow them away . “ That cost how much?” can be heard threw out the neighborhood. I think things have gotten outta hand but if people are willing to pay it won’t stop. My tanks are simple. I don’t run all the newest gadgets. A protein skimmer and me paying attention to my tank has givin me good results
 

lynn.reef.nerd

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I think this hobby is like every other hobby/business out there. Things change and businesses need to adapt or fade out.

As a hobbyist, you get what makes you happy (isn't that what hobbies are suppose to do?). If a $5k coral makes you happy and you can afford it, go for it. I personally wouldn't :).

As a vendor, you need to provide what customers want. If you chose not to, someone else will swoop in and take your business.

I haven't been in the hobby long enough to say if the hobby is going downhill or not. However, I do see more people are actually in the hobby every year as compared to before. With youtube, sites such as R2R, and Facebook, it might actually be easier for hobbyist to enter the hobby and maintain a reef tank.
 
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