Are we ruining the hobby???

[JumboShrimp]

I enjoyed all the various points of view.

 

[Nicholas Dushynsky]

I've been a marine aquarium hobbyist since 1965. Actually, we did quite well back then at keeping all types of fish, inverts, anemones, etc. I had many tanks and worked at Marine World in the Chicago area. Tanks were beautiful, basic, and most fish lived well. Myself and friends had all sorts of fish that would spawn and it was an enjoyable hobby. I loved seeing fish from all over the world: Pinecone fish from the South China Sea, Purple Tangs from the Red Sea, Clownfish from the Phillipines, fish hand caught by Rodney Jonklaas in the Indian Ocean, chunks of rock with sponges, gorgos, and corals from the Keys, all kinds of inverts, etc. With just a basic understanding of nitrogen cycle, the hobby was fun and relatively inexpensive and accessible to most folks.

Then in the 80s the hobby transformed into reefkeeping with the ability to keep more corals. As time has gone on the hobby progressed from most folks not being able to keep too many different corals and buying colonies to where we are today with designer corals and tiny frags.

In some respects this has been the natural progression, as equipment such as lighting and skimmers, etc. have improved--so has the ability to not only keep but propagate most corals.

When Pacific East Aquaculture started in 1999-2000 we sold lots of colonies and started growing some frags. We described the corals as Blue Acropora or Pink Bird's Nest and that was sufficient. At that time most folks were thrilled to just be able to just keep such corals alive. Naturally, over time we saw many of our customers become vendors as the ability to keep corals became more understood and easier so did the ability to propagate them. This progression was great.

At some point several years ago the number of coral vendors grew exponentially. I recall being one of maybe 3 coral vendors at MACNA in DC years ago to now there are close to a hundred. Things began to change as the industry became more competitive. In order to stand out and sell their corals vendors began using crazy names and prices to create so-called limited editions. Auctions started, and live sales, all in the interest of driving the hype, increasing sales, and profitability. Great, right? It's the American way, right? Good marketing.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not whining about this progression, just observing from many years on the inside. But, have we gone too far? Is where we are at now healthy for this hobby/industry? Are we bringing in enough new hobbyists to sustain it all? Have we made this into a rich man's hobby?? $1500 1/2 inch designer Acro frags, 25,000 angelfish, $1000 must have controllers, $800 can't live without LED fixtures, impossibly complicated dosing regimens, etc., etc! Have we killed the joy?

The weekly live sale or Ebay auctions and the endless hype leads to the frenzied hobbyist that is constantly trying to one-up other hobbyists. Tanks filled with tiny frags and the thought by many that if I get the latest designer coral I can grow it out and make a fortune.

But, what about the future of the hobby? Are we making it too complicated, too expensive, too elitist?? Are star polyps, leathers, and bubble corals no longer enough? Of course not, right?

True story: several years ago at a swap, (I use to be a vendor at about 25 a year), I had about 30 frags of really nice blue Zoanthids. Many folks came up to our booth and liked them, but they asked "what's the name"? When I shrugged my shoulders and said blue zoos, they walked away even though they liked the coral. By the early afternoon I became frustrated and started calling them King's Ransom Zoanthids. As the afternoon crowd flocked in we started selling them. Soon I had folks coming up asking if I had any of them King's Ransoms! And indeed, the very same coral that we couldn't sell any, sold out within a couple hours. What did this show me? Obviously I'm really dumb about marketing!! OK, admittedly, I still prefer, to my detriment, to say Blue Acro instead of Rainbow Swirl Atomic Passion Acro. Sure I'd sell more Atomic Passions, but it still gives me an icky feeling. Yeah, I know, I'm just dumb!

So, I know this thread will bring endless responses about how the designer craze is not what most folks want and object to it. But, at the same time I'll see someone ask "ID please, what's the name of this" , and they don't mean Acropora sarmentosa, they want Atomic Passion.

OK, so I'm getting to be an old curmudgeon. Maybe so, I've always been more of an old school low tech reefkeeper. I shun most new technology. I feel it makes things too complicated, expensive, prone to disasterous failures, and drives off potential new hobbyists. I'm so tired of folks coming into my store that are new hobbyists that feel reef tanks are impossible to keep or are bogged down in and endless string of agonizing problems from water chemistry perplexities to nuisance algae to losing all their fish to a parasite because they bought one fish at the local pet shop staffed with high school kids with zero experience.

I know, the Genie is out of the bottle now and it ain't going back in! So, just get with it old man!


I worked here late 60s - mid 70s. At the time they ran ads in TFH and other magazines on the theme of "I'm not so rare at Marine World" and showed a different fish each month, such as the then rarely seen Flame Angelfish!

We went from barely being able to keep corals alive to now propagating them easily. But, have we gone too far?? Designer names, insane prices, expensive equipment made out to be essential, complicated dosing requirements, etc. Where does this ultimately take us???

What about bringing new hobbyists in? The kids? Does everyone have thousands$$$ to afford that "impossible to keep" reef aquarium?

Anyway, it's been an interesting journey. Can't wait to see what's next. The coral export bans are transforming the hobby again. We shall see how it all turns out in the next year or two.

Very well said, I'm with the trying to keep it simple. I like the all in one style tanks that are just plug and play. I have a diy ato that has been flawless for over 3 years where a jug of water worked for 11 years flawlessly before that and a Chinese led black box, that's as high tech as I'm going. I hate the hype of the fancy name zoas of where you could buy a whole rock for 10 British pounds full of a mix of red and green ones and now you pay 10 per polyp of a radio active dragon eye (just an example). This was only 14 years ago. Dont even start with these bounce mushrooms.
I feel I just want the no name cheap corals, and low tech fish tanks. But most things now have fancy names, higher tech and higher price tags, I even enjoy doing water tests and that's automated now. Where will it all end?

 

[PacificEastAquaculture]

OK. Lots of great opinions and passion on this subject. But, at the same time the next live sale and Ebay auctions are around the corner and the constant hype becomes white noise in the background. In my opinion it all feeds into the naming/pricing frenzy. It's all in the marketing and more power to 'em, right? It's just like selling an inanimate object and not live animals. The threads on "what is the name of this" and the finger exercises begin in preparation for that latest live sale.

It's all good, right? To each their own. Live and let live, correct? Some folks love the hype and game and feeding the pyramid. Others are oblivious to it. Others tolerate it, but aren't exactly comfortable with it. Others hate it and feel it fuels elitism thus ruining their perceived real reason for the hobby. There's enough room for every opinion.

However, if you are passionate about this subject and are not enamoured with it all, then vote with your pocketbook.

 

[Dkeller_nc]

Dr. Mac -

You may or may not be interested in this perspective. I've been in the hobby about 30 years, so I'm aware of tanks with actual live rock, a hang-on skilter, and VHO fluorescent lighting. We really didn't know what we were doing back then from the standpoint of water chemistry, so we substituted frequent water changes.

At present, I have 4 reefs and a LR holding tank. The technology runs the gamut from Ecotech LEDs/Vortechs & Neptune's controller to dirt simple, skimmer and PC fluorescents (soon to be forced into being replaced with T5HOs). So I've experience with highly automated, high-technology tanks, to basic tanks with circulation and lighting, and water chemistry management that is entirely manual. Both work. The high-tech tanks require that you're a technical person and can understand how to troubleshoot technology when it goes South. The low-tech tanks require that you have a fair amount of biology knowledge and judgement to know when the inhabitants are stressed and what to do about it.

On the livestock side of things, I am lucky enough to be able to afford anything I want, including really rare fish. However, I don't have any "named" corals in any of the 4 reef tanks that I presently run. That's mostly because there's at least a few of us out here that think the comic-book culture name thing as applied to coral is just stupid and goofy, and we want no part of it. I generally only purchase colonies, typically wild colonies. I've made an occasional exception for maricultured colonies, but these also don't have names, other than the scientific ones. There have been a few occasional gifts of coral that I accepted where I was told what the comic-book name was; I immediately and intentionally forgot what that name was, and when it was time to pass frags of those colonies along to other reefers, I told the recipient the scientific name and that's all, which was an intentional attempt at removing any "lineage" from the coral, which I also think is ridiculous.

 

[Joedubyk]

In a lot of ways the designer stuff might just SAVE the hobby.

Think about it. People propogate the designer stuff to trade corals, to sell etc... These designers are great because they have been in aquaculture for GENERATIONS now which makes them much hardier than maricultured or wild. So they are hardy AND people want them. No one is going to aquaculture duncans or some random zoas/mushrooms. You can't make a living or make it worthwhile propagating 5 dollar frags.

At some point Id imgine there will be almost full bans on imports. The only way we'll be able to sustain the hobby is from our own propagation. With corals that people actually want and will pay for, it will actually be something that coral farmers can make a living on, doing.

 

[User1]

Dr. Mac -

You may or may not be interested in this perspective. I've been in the hobby about 30 years, so I'm aware of tanks with actual live rock, a hang-on skilter, and VHO fluorescent lighting. We really didn't know what we were doing back then from the standpoint of water chemistry, so we substituted frequent water changes.

At present, I have 4 reefs and a LR holding tank. The technology runs the gamut from Ecotech LEDs/Vortechs & Neptune's controller to dirt simple, skimmer and PC fluorescents (soon to be forced into being replaced with T5HOs). So I've experience with highly automated, high-technology tanks, to basic tanks with circulation and lighting, and water chemistry management that is entirely manual. Both work. The high-tech tanks require that you're a technical person and can understand how to troubleshoot technology when it goes South. The low-tech tanks require that you have a fair amount of biology knowledge and judgement to know when the inhabitants are stressed and what to do about it.

On the livestock side of things, I am lucky enough to be able to afford anything I want, including really rare fish. However, I don't have any "named" corals in any of the 4 reef tanks that I presently run. That's mostly because there's at least a few of us out here that think the comic-book culture name thing as applied to coral is just stupid and goofy, and we want no part of it. I generally only purchase colonies, typically wild colonies. I've made an occasional exception for maricultured colonies, but these also don't have names, other than the scientific ones. There have been a few occasional gifts of coral that I accepted where I was told what the comic-book name was; I immediately and intentionally forgot what that name was, and when it was time to pass frags of those colonies along to other reefers, I told the recipient the scientific name and that's all, which was an intentional attempt at removing any "lineage" from the coral, which I also think is ridiculous.

I always get the stink eye or negative replies when someone posts asking if this is a Homewrecker coral or Black Widow Bubble Tip Anemone and I reply looks like an acropora or rose bubble tip to me... What do I know. I have 11 RBTA's that have split over the past 7 years not to include the 3 that died from nasty splits and getting stuck in rocks or giving others away. Each one looks slightly different. Some more creamy white swirls others a darker shade or red.

What do I know other than what I can realistically afford.

 

[Joedubyk]

I always get the stink eye or negative replies when someone posts asking if this is a Homewrecker coral or Black Widow Bubble Tip Anemone and I reply looks like an acropora or rose bubble tip to me... What do I know. I have 11 RBTA's that have split over the past 7 years not to include the 3 that died from nasty splits and getting stuck in rocks or giving others away. Each one looks slightly different. Some more creamy white swirls others a darker shade or red.

What do I know other than what I can realistically afford.

Im not saying you specifically, but "what do I know other than what I can realistically afford," also hits home a point that I believe a lot of people who can't afford the "higher end" stuff hate on it because they can't afford it. I get it, the variations are small. But my colony of HW looks WAY nicer than just any 50 dollar coral. It's probably 10x brighter than any other acro in my tank. Yes, same family member as any other tenuis, but i also think is disengenous to say they're all the same thing. That part isn't true.

 

[Sea MunnKey]

Interesting read. So called "designer" coral names are at most times doesn't even relate to the details or colors associated with the corals itself. What is being termed as "Rainbow, whatever color with a slight tinge of whatever color" does not even come any closer to what's being shown/exhibited! Multicolor declaration means steep selling price to the public.

With the current Indo coral ban, Aussie corals are not getting cheaper by the day. Even first time Aussie coral collectors supplying to one of our local Toronto LFS (very affordable 1st time) have marked up their coral pricing the second time around because it has to reflect on the "market" value if these corals were to be sold to the US market. The demanded marked up price went up by more than 50 - 60% increment!! That was the last we heard from my LFS.

Anything related to the reefing hobby is getting ridiculously expensive. Most of the equipment & hardware that I use for my system are either used or retro fit. They were all purchased or collected from quitting or getting out of the country reefers either for a small fee or free.

Ever since the coral ban, my existing corals have started producing & growing faster with only the weekly water changes. Nowadays my money are spent mostly on dosing chemicals, foods for fish and corals & once a year salt supplies. That reminds me to replace the old T5 bulbs which is way overdue ... my poor corals

 

[User1]

Im not saying you specifically, but "what do I know other than what I can realistically afford," also hits home a point that I believe a lot of people who can't afford the "higher end" stuff hate on it because they can't afford it. I get it, the variations are small. But my colony of HW looks WAY nicer than just any 50 dollar coral. It's probably 10x brighter than any other acro in my tank. Yes, same family member as any other tenuis, but i also think is disengenous to say they're all the same thing. That part isn't true.

I don't take it that way at all and understand why you said or why. You can see back in one of my earlier posts I don't judge nor envy what others have or earn. There are those who take a risk starting a small business. There are those that know what they want and earn it. Risk takers. High drive. Whatever you want to call it I learned long ago I either didn't have it or made another choice - no regrets. Of course there are those that are born into it but that is another story.

This is just my opinion but maybe what we are talking about is a pedigree. Corals just don't have it although I guess we could say some are trying. ORA for example and LA/DD corals or fish with their certificates. However, and this is just an example so no offense, both Homewrecker and Walt Disney are Acropora tenuis. Right? They are named because of their color and the person, small business, or boutique shop who named it first.

Pedigree with animals such as a dog is at least known. Yes, I can go buy a black and tan German Shepherd and it will be a German Shepherd. Off the street, non AKC, owner has Sire/dang, and I can with somewhat confidence pay the lower cost for a non registered GSD and know it is pure. Or I can pay the higher cost for a AKC registered GSD and see the lineage, certifications, hips, etc. I know what I'm getting when I pay $500 dollars for a dog or if I pay $20,000.

This isn't apples to apples I know but just how I see corals with names.

 

[Joedubyk]

I don't take it that way at all and understand why you said or why. You can see back in one of my earlier posts I don't judge nor envy what others have or earn. There are those who take a risk starting a small business. There are those that know what they want and earn it. Risk takers. High drive. Whatever you want to call it I learned long ago I either didn't have it or made another choice - no regrets. Of course there are those that are born into it but that is another story.

This is just my opinion but maybe what we are talking about is a pedigree. Corals just don't have it although I guess we could say some are trying. ORA for example and LA/DD corals or fish with their certificates. However, and this is just an example so no offense, both Homewrecker and Walt Disney are Acropora tenuis. Right? They are named because of their color and the person, small business, or boutique shop who named it first.

Pedigree with animals such as a dog is at least known. Yes, I can go buy a black and tan German Shepherd and it will be a German Shepherd. Off the street, non AKC, owner has Sire/dang, and I can with somewhat confidence pay the lower cost for a non registered GSD and know it is pure. Or I can pay the higher cost for a AKC registered GSD and see the lineage, certifications, hips, etc. I know what I'm getting when I pay $500 dollars for a dog or if I pay $20,000.

This isn't apples to apples I know but just how I see corals with names.

Yes they are, and the look "similar" in a lot of ways as do the other rainbow tenuis....But think bout it this way. Jason actually goes out to indonsia, has a HUGE farm in his basement and dediates his life to finding unique looking coral and propagating it. All the people that demand all frags be 50 dollars, don't do that, nor would they want to do that.

But you are right about the animals. Some people will pay 3K for a dog that was selectively bred to be super small... It's very similar

Even ORA, that is fantastic for the hobby. Green slimers and Red planets grow easy and survive almost anything! Thats why designers are great. They arent just imports that have a 50/50 chance of dying. The whole hobby will have to start farming like crazy as I see bans coming sooner rather than later. We can sustain ourselves. But we need to make it worth it for the farmers. 20 dollars for a frag won't cut it

I do agree this hobby, just price and time wise, eliminates a lot of people -- and that does suck.

 

[User1]

Yes they are, and the look "similar" in a lot of ways as do the other rainbow tenuis....But think bout it this way. Jason actually goes out to indonsia, has a HUGE farm in his basement and dediates his life to finding unique looking coral and propagating it. All the people that demand all frags be 50 dollars, don't do that, nor would they want to do that.

But you are right about the animals. Some people will pay 3K for a dog that was selectively bred to be super small... It's very similar

Even ORA, that is fantastic for the hobby. Green slimers and Red planets grow easy and survive almost anything! Thats why designers are great. They arent just imports that have a 50/50 chance of dying. The whole hobby will have to start farming like crazy as I see bans coming sooner rather than later. We can sustain ourselves. But we need to make it worth it for the farmers. 20 dollars for a frag won't cut it

I do agree this hobby, just price and time wise, eliminates a lot of people -- and that does suck.

Not sure if it sucks though. As you said people have to earn a living and we are not the ones taking the risk. I've always wanted to write a book about drive in people be it someone like Dr. Mac at Pacific East Aquaculture or other successful people. Passion. Drive. Luck. Both. It really interests me be it a train conductor or ballerina. Some people know how to act on it and it always amazes me. Is it parenting? No idea.

And just because this thread needs more cow bell and because I mentioned German Shepherds here is my girl with one of her favorite toys.

 

[tnyr5]

I posted this in a different thread a while ago, but it's worth repeating:

And this (referring to the gratuitously-high-priced coral market) is where the simple economics ends and the pyramid-scheme-like practices of the unscrupulous vendors begin. The high price (which isn't a problem in and of itself, as all new things have high demand) is a false, implied promise to buyers that this coral is valuable and they have a good chance of making money off of it. People are dazzled by this fabrication, and buy these tiny frags, which are cut at that size specifically because they will go dormant and do nothing until they either die or begin active growth a year later. In this way, the vendor stays at the top of the pyramid. High mortality keeps the piece "rare" for a couple years, and by the time the skilled reefers nurse that speck along into a colony, it will have been thoroughly devalued and the vendor will have moved on to the next coral.

 

[JCOLE]

I agree with different things here. I agree that the "John Smith's Rootie Tottie Fresh and Frootie 3rd generation Atomic Cheerios Sugar Bomb" 3/4" stick for $350 is not helping the hobby. I remember how often I struggled and the corals I lost when I first started 15 years ago. Often at the beginning, I questioned the hobby and was it worth it. I couldn't imagine just getting into the hobby now and dropping thousands on equipment and corals to have them die while I was learning. I have a feeling that we are going to see a lot more people leaving the hobby than usual because of this. If that is the case then that would be the worst thing to happen to the hobby. We need all we can get to help keep this hobby growing. The more hobbyist we can get involved then the more propagating and cheaper corals should get.

However, I do understand supply and demand. The HomeWeckers, Walt Disney's, Pikachus, etc all look AWESOME. Everyone wants them for a reason and supply is limited. In a couple of years, these should drop as more are readily available. I might be different than others but that is why I fell in love with frags of SPS. I prefer the frags over colonies as I get to watch them grow from a little stick into a colony. I do not feel charging hundreds for a small frag is right. However, I do understand why they are doing it. What bothers me as well is the hobbyist that buy these corals to take advantage of their local reefers as well. I am all for using your hobby to sustain your hobby. If I dropped $300 on a coral then I would absolutely frag it when it grows to get my return on it. However, once I made my money back then I would start selling the frags for cheap to my fellow reefers to grow the coral population and diversity.

While I am against the high named corals, I also think it is not fair to compare coral prices in the past to coral prices nowadays. It was cheaper 15 years ago to import colonies into LFS for retail. You are paying the coral farmer, shipping and importing fee's and that was it. With the bans now this is forcing people to aquaculture. While this is a good thing for the hobby it can come with a price. With that comes payroll, lights, equipment, utilities, rent(depending on location), etc. All of this expense is what it costs now to grow out these corals to sell(which could take anywhere from 6-12 months). This is why I understand $50-$100 frags.

Just my $0.02

 

[Joedubyk]

I posted this in a different thread a while ago, but it's worth repeating:

And this (referring to the gratuitously-high-priced coral market) is where the simple economics ends and the pyramid-scheme-like practices of the unscrupulous vendors begin. The high price (which isn't a problem in and of itself, as all new things have high demand) is a false, implied promise to buyers that this coral is valuable and they have a good chance of making money off of it. People are dazzled by this fabrication, and buy these tiny frags, which are cut at that size specifically because they will go dormant and do nothing until they either die or begin active growth a year later. In this way, the vendor stays at the top of the pyramid. High mortality keeps the piece "rare" for a couple years, and by the time the skilled reefers nurse that speck along into a colony, it will have been thoroughly devalued and the vendor will have moved on to the next coral.

Not all vendors do that though. I think you pretty much just described cornbread haha

 

[falconut]

In a lot of ways the designer stuff might just SAVE the hobby.

Think about it. People propogate the designer stuff to trade corals, to sell etc... These designers are great because they have been in aquaculture for GENERATIONS now which makes them much hardier than maricultured or wild. So they are hardy AND people want them. No one is going to aquaculture duncans or some random zoas/mushrooms. You can't make a living or make it worthwhile propagating 5 dollar frags.

At some point Id imgine there will be almost full bans on imports. The only way we'll be able to sustain the hobby is from our own propagation. With corals that people actually want and will pay for, it will actually be something that coral farmers can make a living on, doing.

I see what you're saying, but if the only corals around are the overpriced designer corals, it may force the average people (who can't afford them) out of reefing.

 

[flsalty]

While this subject has been discussed to death on here, it does my heart good to see a vendor say it. I'm one of those weirdos who wants to know the Latin name, not the cartoon name. I like the basic bird's nest or bubble coral, but even those are getting expensive. Torches are insanely priced. This fellow curmudgeon misses the Good Old Days.

 

[User1]

While this subject has been discussed to death on here, it does my heart good to see a vendor say it. I'm one of those weirdos who wants to know the Latin name, not the cartoon name. I like the basic bird's nest or bubble coral, but even those are getting expensive. Torches are insanely priced. This fellow curmudgeon misses the Good Old Days.

No kidding with regards to the old days. I was just asking myself this the other day. Does no one hold the door open anymore for women (from a traditional point of view - nothing else) or older people...?

 

[PacificEastAquaculture]

Just FYI, Some of the biggest names in the "high-end" frag market have been customers for 15+ years and on occasion they have bought a colony from me in the past and I would see it fragged and in their tanks at swaps just weeks later, with the perception that it had been propagated for years. That's OK, not going to name names--that's not the point at all!! Please don't misinterpret, we all do what we must to survive. The point is that many times folks are paying many times more due to just a name on the coral and the name of the vendor under the assumption it's something special. Everyone's corals originated in the same place, the ocean. Some may have been in captivity longer than others and some may be multi-generational in captivity. I have Acro colonies that have been in our greenhouse for many years that I still take frags from and frags from those frags, and many many other types of corals that have probably 20 to 50 or more generations at our facility. Mostly these multi-generation in captivity corals are hardier and react better to lighting, etc than the newly imported. However, there is not a set pricing structure for what each generation in captivity is worth--it all depends upon type of coral and coloration--or in many instances what name is put on the coral or the name of the vendor.

I walk around swaps and chuckle to myself sometimes because I see the very same frags in a no-name tank and a "high-end" vendor tank but sold for many times more in the designer vendor's tank. Some corals are certainly truly unique, but many I see are only unique in price and name.

It's a difficult business to be profitable. Most things are priced based upon growth rate and color, and adding a factor for overhead cost and having to absorb part of shipping and shipping materials. There are the occasional pieces that are priced at whatever the vendor feels they can get for them, based upon rarity and/or extreme color. And then there are those sold by "high end" vendors with designer names that are sold based upon the need by some to be part of the cool kids. It's all good though, whatever makes you happy and keeps you in the hobby--lots of options for different tastes and desires. Hopefully we keep enough options available for beginners and to attract new hobbyists, as well as satisfying those that don't play the name game.

Not bashing anyone here, not my desire. No one is perfect, I get my share of bashing and am not saying my way is THE way. Just stirring the pot and it's interesting to hear all the opinions. I'm just wondering if it's all good for the long term survival of the hobby/industry. Certainly we all agree that continually hauling corals and fish out of the ocean in mostly a non-sustainable manner is not good. However, have we gotten so good at captive propagation that competition is so fierce that we had to invent ways to separate from the competitor in ways that are detrimental (i.e. designer names, live sales and auctions that drive a certain manic mentality, and the loss of the fact that we are dealing with live animals and not inanimate objects) to the long term survivability of the entire hobby/industry?

 

[Stang67]

Just wanted to chime in. I started this new hobby in April and had no idea what I was getting into. But this hobby seems to me to be just like my others. You can go as big and bold as you want to if you have the money to and if you don't then you have to be happy with what you can afford. If not find another hobby.
For example I have a 67 Mustang coupe. I wanted a 69 Camero but couldn't afford it. I love my car and will never part with it unless I need the $$. I could spend 7k to paint it but I don't have that so I deal with the paint the way it is. I wanted a manual but those were about 5k more so i have an automatic. I wanted a convertible but those are 10k more so no on that bit too. It doesn't have the biggest engine or loudest exhaust but I still get looks from the "old timers" when I take it to shows. Its a driver its not a trailer queen and I love it.
Same with my tank. Its not the biggest with the fanciest gizmo's. The coral I have are ones I (or my partner) picked out because they were what we liked with in our price range. Do I know the names of what I have? Yes. Does it matter to me what they are called? No.
I love my coral and I don't care what they are called or where they came from. They make me smile every time i walk by the tank. Just like Princess does every time I open the garage.
PS I don't think the high end crazy money the cars bring at Mecum or Barrett Jackson hurt the car hobby either. Kind of like the live sales here. I tune in to both to see how much crazy money gets thrown around for things that make people "happy".

 

[Joedubyk]

While this subject has been discussed to death on here, it does my heart good to see a vendor say it. I'm one of those weirdos who wants to know the Latin name, not the cartoon name. I like the basic bird's nest or bubble coral, but even those are getting expensive. Torches are insanely priced. This fellow curmudgeon misses the Good Old Days.

Well the indo ban made all indo corals expensive..thats' not the fault of the names. but if you like basic stylos and birdsnests, you're pretty golden!