Cryptic zone - do you believe in it ?
- Thread starter Abhishek
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I see, thank you. It appears there is some Coraline algae on the rocks. Will it grow in complete darkness, or am I mistaken about the algae?
Also, what are the implications on system reliability (in the event of a prolonged power outage / air conditioning outage) with this cryptic refugium? I have lived the idea, and I know the old RTOM you are referencing (I also found it beautiful and fascinating).
I ask, as I am building my next system with redundancy and reliability as the most important focus. If the cryptic zone is particularly sensitive in the event of an anomaly , I may not add it, even with the potential benefits it offers.
ectoaesthetics
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... and feed live phyto!
yeah phyto is sooo huge IMO. I used to just feed nanno and have moved to @reefnutrition ‘s live phyto blend. I have even seen a difference in sponge, filter feeder, and pod populations with the switch.
I feed oysterfeast and phytofeast to my main tank every Sunday evening. This week I added their rotifeast and r.o.e. I have never seen my soft corals stay open so long as the lights ramped down in the evening.
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Kudos on putting an emphasis on redundancy!
. Abhishek may need to elaborate but there are red/maroon sponges so that's probably what we're seeing in the photos.
From my experiences I'd say cryptic sponges and refugiums are pretty resilient and will deal with prolonged power failures better than fish and corals.
Kudos on putting an emphasis on redundancy!
Abhishek may need to elaborate but there are red/maroon sponges so that's probably what we're seeing in the photos.
From my experiences I'd say cryptic sponges and refugiums are pretty resilient and will deal with prolonged power failures better than fish and corals.
I'd love to hear more about it.... I've got a large space I was originally going to use in my sump for a Chaeto refugium, but it was just too much work to keep it clean. Let me be clear - I am not challenging the idea - just want to learn more. I would hate to add an ecosystem that could potentially be the "weak link". Great to hear your thoughts on the resiliency of it. I have also read most of the writings I could find on cryptic refugia - although I must admit, I did not like the idea of having the zones inside of the display space, as was illustrated.
First off, it's pretty much impossile to stop cryptic sponges from finding places to grow in a reef system. They will thirve anywhere there's low light levels behind and underneath corals and rock. Cryptic refugiums can be setup in dedicated spaces but they can also be incorporated into existing refugiums. For example, your refugium you were using for cheato would work for both just by adding a layer of rock raised slightly off the bottom so sponges would be underneath while chaeto would be in the light. Or you could just remove the lights, toss in some maricultured live rock that has some sponges on it.
After what I have read about the roles of DOC especially labile DOC released from algae (see Forest Rohwer's "Coral Reefs in the Microbial Seas") cryptic sponges are essential for healthy reef systems to survive. Here's a video of the system of my build thread showing the unlit sump which has sponges growing on the glass.
@naterealbig Looked a little closer at some of the red and yellow sponge in one of my systems. The red is pliable and soft like the yellow which is a sponge so I'm pretty confident it is an encrusting sponge.
To give you an idea of where sponges might grow in a system here's pictures of sponge in the display tank with front views. (But even though sponges do well in a DT I'll still set up a cryptic fuge if I can on a system.)
These sponges are growing in the shaded areas to the right of the toadstool.
and here'd looking at the back behind the aquascaping. This is about 5 years old.
To give you an idea of where sponges might grow in a system here's pictures of sponge in the display tank with front views. (But even though sponges do well in a DT I'll still set up a cryptic fuge if I can on a system.)
These sponges are growing in the shaded areas to the right of the toadstool.
and here'd looking at the back behind the aquascaping. This is about 5 years old.
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I recently installed a remote DSB (40 gallon breeder). I was planning on putting rock rubble on an eggcrate base above the sand to create a cryptic zone. I didn’t want the rock resting on the sand. I have the sides of the tank covered with cardboard to make it as dark as possible. I can also add something on top. My question is will the sponges just grow or will I need to seed it? I seeded the sand with live sand and mud from IPSF in Hawaii. I do have some sponges on some ocean live rock I have in my system from KP Aquatics in Florida. I did see the cryptic seed packages on the website mentioned in this thread.
Big E
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My frag tank sump is a dark plastic tub with just an Amaxx 1 skimmer. I don't have a lid on it but all the rock is covered in non-photo type animals, mostly sponges. I never specifically put anything in there so it just grew on it's own.
The rock was seeded from establish tanks. The most dominant is yellow sponge which has completely covered a bag of Siporax I have in there. Nitrates are kept under control but at times I've had to use some GFO.
The rock was seeded from establish tanks. The most dominant is yellow sponge which has completely covered a bag of Siporax I have in there. Nitrates are kept under control but at times I've had to use some GFO.
NS Mike D
In the arena.
my 10 gal DIY sump for my 29g DT. No DSB. I had just done some work on it, so now the cheato is fully covering the top with a 1.5" mat, filtering most of the light.
In any case, that is rubble rock in an egg crate basket and I can see sponges in there. There is a yellow sponge on the egg crate (middle low) that does grow in lighted areas (there are some in the DT).
I've often thought about seeding some more cryptic sponges. I considered this a semi-cryptic zone (which is why I never ordered seed pieces) given the light spill, but it's obious to me now, with full cheato coverage, the lower inner section is indeed cyptic
I don't want to discourage anyone from getting sponges starter colonies, diversity is generally a good thing. I also see different sponges dominate in different systems so it seems reasonable to me there's some species specific selection happening. Trying different types/species may help get cryptic sponges established faster. It's pretty hard to stop sponges from growing though.
mav3rick478
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This is very interesting, I love trying to let nature do it's thing. It's one of the reasons why I always loved saltwater tanks, trying to recreate a some what self sustaining eco system in a box. This makes me want to include a cryptic zone in my build. I pretty much have one in my current tank with the HOB refugium that is filled with rubble rock but that intent was to have a place for pods to flourish. Now i see it was also a small cryptic zone.
F i s h y
2nd In Command.
This idea is really intriguing. I appreciate everyone's contributions. I'm still in the planning stages of my tank, and I have so many ideas of what I'd like to do, this just adds another dimension to the thoughts. In the late 90s early 2000s I ran a reef tank that incorporated so many of the different thought processes together in what would be a largely frowned upon way in today's reefing world. I cant wait to challenge what is considered mainstream yet again when my build is complete. Hopefully my tank will be wet before the end of 2020... thanks again to all the contributors on this thread.
As I stated in an earlier post I setup a remote DSB (40 gallon breeder) and I’m planning on putting rock rubble in a eggcrate box raised above the sand. I have the materials to build the box. I had seeded the sand with a live sand mix, mud and various worms from ipsf in Hawaii. I seeded the sand mid April. I dropped some food pellets on the sand yesterday and used a flashlight to see what might be down there. I have the sides of the tank covered to keep it mostly dark inside the tank. Immediately a bristleworm came out of the sand, I could see a number of pods running about and a few minutes later I saw a number of other smaller worms that came up from the sand. So the DSB is showing signs of life. I also started a very light Carbon dosing schedule to get a food supply for my existing sponges on some other rock to start growing. Those rocks will go into the box that will be above the DSB. Things are progressing. Once I get the box made I will take some photos and post them here.
mav3rick478
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I want some input, like I said earlier this would be a great addition to a filter system running a refugium and skimmer. So how big of a zone would you need to supplement the refugium for a 75 gallon tank? I’m wondering due to lack of space in my stand could I use those big media filter canisters that are used for filtering water for houses? Basically a huge RODI canister but they are not clear, usually blue so no light could get in. Could even run a couple inline to double the surface area or maybe put them inside or behind a controller cabinet.
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