Cycling the tank correctly

Uzair Aiman

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Hi. Im very new to this hobby. I currently have a 30L tank (roughly 10 gallons). Ive set up this tank last week (Sunday , 2nd May 2021). I use dry rock and crushed coral (also dry). I run with a hang on filter, some bio media, a small wavemaker and also a bag of activated carbon (no lights yet since I am not planning to add corals yet). Ive went to my local fish store and have picked up Saliferts nitrite and ammonia test kits and also a salinity test kit( the refractometer).

The guy at the store recommended me to use Microbacter7 to start cycling my tank , dosing it everyday for the past week. The store also told me that tap water was sufficient enough for now (dosed with antichlorine). I dont know my tap water perimeters (I live in east Malaysia) but I trusted the guy at the shop since he seemed like he knows alot about what he is doing. Im planning to buy some RODI water soon as soon as I add fishes. My question is how long should it take before it is safe to add fishes? (planning to add clowns). Ive read a constant ammonia reading of <0.15 to 0.25 (not quite sure since Im quite new) since the past 2-4 days and Ive seen little to none nitrite levels in my tank since day 1. Am I doing this right? Is it just a game of waiting right now? And also, Ive found out Brightwells product called microbacter starter XLM which is used to cycle faster, so I am afraid that the shop gave me the wrong product to start cycling. Will it still cycle with Microbacter 7? He told me that this cycle would finish at around 1-2 weeks using this microbacter 7. I hope Im doing this correctly since Ive invested some of my good money on this tank (Im a student so its quite a big deal for me haha)
 

Azedenkae

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Hi. Im very new to this hobby. I currently have a 30L tank (roughly 10 gallons). Ive set up this tank last week (Sunday , 2nd May 2021). I use dry rock and crushed coral (also dry). I run with a hang on filter, some bio media, a small wavemaker and also a bag of activated carbon (no lights yet since I am not planning to add corals yet). Ive went to my local fish store and have picked up Saliferts nitrite and ammonia test kits and also a salinity test kit( the refractometer).

The guy at the store recommended me to use Microbacter7 to start cycling my tank , dosing it everyday for the past week. The store also told me that tap water was sufficient enough for now (dosed with antichlorine). I dont know my tap water perimeters (I live in east Malaysia) but I trusted the guy at the shop since he seemed like he knows alot about what he is doing. Im planning to buy some RODI water soon as soon as I add fishes. My question is how long should it take before it is safe to add fishes? (planning to add clowns). Ive read a constant ammonia reading of <0.15 to 0.25 (not quite sure since Im quite new) since the past 2-4 days and Ive seen little to none nitrite levels in my tank since day 1. Am I doing this right? Is it just a game of waiting right now? And also, Ive found out Brightwells product called microbacter starter XLM which is used to cycle faster, so I am afraid that the shop gave me the wrong product to start cycling. Will it still cycle with Microbacter 7? He told me that this cycle would finish at around 1-2 weeks using this microbacter 7. I hope Im doing this correctly since Ive invested some of my good money on this tank (Im a student so its quite a big deal for me haha)
Your LFS is not wrong, technically. People do cycle with MB7, but yes, MB XLM apparently works faster/better. Though on that note, FritzZyme Turbo Start 900 works best, but not sure if you can get it in Malaysia.

You also don't need to cycle with RODI water, dechlorinated tap water should be sufficient. But, it is actually still better to cycle with RODI.

Anyways, to actually answer your question. Yes you should still be able to cycle with MB7. It may indeed take 2 weeks or so with it, which is not bad. But recently it seems like people have a lot of issues cycling with MB7 or Dr. Tim's One and Only Nitrifying Bacteria. Not to say you'll have issues, but just something to keep in mind. Worse case scenario, it'll probably just take a bit longer. Here, I made a cycling guide that could help you navigate through this:

1620751300781.png
 

NeonRabbit221B

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Typically you need to add an ammonia source for bacteria to take off. Ammonia chloride or some fish food and give it a few days. As Azzy's very fancy guide mentions at the point you can test and know where you are. How far into the setup are you?
 
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Uzair Aiman

Uzair Aiman

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Your LFS is not wrong, technically. People do cycle with MB7, but yes, MB XLM apparently works faster/better. Though on that note, FritzZyme Turbo Start 900 works best, but not sure if you can get it in Malaysia.

You also don't need to cycle with RODI water, dechlorinated tap water should be sufficient. But, it is actually still better to cycle with RODI.

Anyways, to actually answer your question. Yes you should still be able to cycle with MB7. It may indeed take 2 weeks or so with it, which is not bad. But recently it seems like people have a lot of issues cycling with MB7 or Dr. Tim's One and Only Nitrifying Bacteria. Not to say you'll have issues, but just something to keep in mind. Worse case scenario, it'll probably just take a bit longer. Here, I made a cycling guide that could help you navigate through this:

1620751300781.png
Thanks for your quick reply. First thing, is ppm same as mg/L? haha sorry but I am really new to this hobby and this website. Also, Ive read on the brightwell website that if I were to use the Start XLM product I should remove my activated carbon. Do I need to do that when using MB7 also? Also, is a zero to none nitrite level normal when starting a cycle? What types of "problems" are we facing here when using the MB7? and how do I know that my tank is currently cycling (since my readings are constant right now). sorry If Ive got too many questions hahah
 
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Uzair Aiman

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Typically you need to add an ammonia source for bacteria to take off. Ammonia chloride or some fish food and give it a few days. As Azzy's very fancy guide mentions at the point you can test and know where you are. How far into the setup are you?
I dont understand by "how far" in the setup I am but Im currently just waiting for my ammonia to drop to zero then add fishes. I havent added any ammonia manually at all no, but somehow Ive read an ammonia reading of <0.15 to 0.25 constantly so I expect that it already has ammonia in it and I do not need to ghost feed the tank.
Ive set up this tank last week as I mentioned so its been around 9 days. Dosed with a half capful of MB7 for the past week. Thats all I got now
 

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See if you can find out from your local government agencies on a tap water report just to make sure there is no other contaminant that while safe for human consumption but will be unsafe for fish.

While not matter much for fishless cycling, you may want to do a big water change before you add fish/rodi water just to be safe

The other concern is the actual piping of your house. If you have old copper pipes then tap water may contain copper thats really bad for any inverts so even if your city's tap is fine, your personal home's tap may still be bad.
 

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I dont understand by "how far" in the setup I am but Im currently just waiting for my ammonia to drop to zero then add fishes. I havent added any ammonia manually at all no, but somehow Ive read an ammonia reading of <0.15 to 0.25 constantly so I expect that it already has ammonia in it and I do not need to ghost feed the tank.
Ive set up this tank last week as I mentioned so its been around 9 days. Dosed with a half capful of MB7 for the past week. Thats all I got now
One aspect of @Azedenkae guide that I wish he would add is mis-reads in testing. You likely don't have ammonia (0 ppm) if you never added ammonia so your readings of .25 ppm are likely false. By how far I am asking how many days has the system/rock been wet (9 days).

Anyways, the goal in cycling is to introduce an ammonia source to spike the ammonia levels in the tank to above 1 ppm then let bacteria multiply until your ammonia level drops to 0 (or close to it because of occurrence of mis-reads in testing)
 
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Uzair Aiman

Uzair Aiman

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See if you can find out from your local government agencies on a tap water report just to make sure there is no other contaminant that while safe for human consumption but will be unsafe for fish.

While not matter much for fishless cycling, you may want to do a big water change before you add fish/rodi water just to be safe

The other concern is the actual piping of your house. If you have old copper pipes then tap water may contain copper thats really bad for any inverts so even if your city's tap is fine, your personal home's tap may still be bad.
How big of a water change do you mean? Will it affect my bacteria in my already cycled tank if I make a major water change? Also, my local fish store stated that for new tanks its not recommended to do any water changes in the near future and Im not sure why.
 

Azedenkae

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One aspect of @Azedenkae guide that I wish he would add is mis-reads in testing. You likely don't have ammonia (0 ppm) if you never added ammonia so your readings of .25 ppm are likely false.
It's the first question I answered in the FAQ lol. Though maybe I should clarify it as potentially a false reading too, just to make it clearer.
 
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Uzair Aiman

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One aspect of @Azedenkae guide that I wish he would add is mis-reads in testing. You likely don't have ammonia (0 ppm) if you never added ammonia so your readings of .25 ppm are likely false. By how far I am asking how many days has the system/rock been wet (9 days).

Anyways, the goal in cycling is to introduce an ammonia source to spike the ammonia levels in the tank to above 1 ppm then let bacteria multiply until your ammonia level drops to 0 (or close to it because of occurrence of mis-reads in testing)
Alright, I will add a dead shrimp to my tank to introduce the ammonia. What about the bacteria that I have been adding for the past week? is it already dead since there is no ammonia or is it still alive? Scared that Ive wasted my precious2 bacteria. Also, can I use freshwater fish food to spike the ammonia? since I have bought any saltwater fist foods, and I keep freshwater fishes in my home so i only have freshwater food available right now
 

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It's the first question I answered in the FAQ lol. Though maybe I should clarify it as potentially a false reading too, just to make it clearer.
Yeah, I think the end goal and meaning of a .25 reading is "ehhh close enough". If you continually test ammonia levels at .25 then this is "zero" enough for me lol
 

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Alright, I will add a dead shrimp to my tank to introduce the ammonia. What about the bacteria that I have been adding for the past week? is it already dead since there is no ammonia or is it still alive? Scared that Ive wasted my precious2 bacteria
Not necessary! The bacteria can live on without an ammonia source for weeks and weeks. Just give the cycle a push and remove the shrimp after a few days.
 

Azedenkae

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Thanks for your quick reply. First thing, is ppm same as mg/L?
For most tests, yes. :D Sorry, forgot that Salifert reads in mg/L not ppm.
haha sorry but I am really new to this hobby and this website. Also, Ive read on the brightwell website that if I were to use the Start XLM product I should remove my activated carbon. Do I need to do that when using MB7 also?
I am not sure how activated carbon interacts with microbes actually. To be safe, I generally remove all filter media except biomedia.
Also, is a zero to none nitrite level normal when starting a cycle?
Yep. Until you introduce an ammonia source, and then you may start reading nitrites once ammonia is oxidized.
What types of "problems" are we facing here when using the MB7?
So far, bacterial blooms, and just a lack of nitrification. I had a tank go for a month without any, so seemed like I got a dud product.
and how do I know that my tank is currently cycling (since my readings are constant right now).
If you follow my guide, you'll see points of testing/etc. that can let you know what the progress is.
sorry If Ive got too many questions hahah
No probs. XD
 

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How big of a water change do you mean? Will it affect my bacteria in my already cycled tank if I make a major water change? Also, my local fish store stated that for new tanks its not recommended to do any water changes in the near future and Im not sure why.
Most of the nitrifying bacteria will be in the rock/sand or other surface area so once its cycled, wc won't impact it as long as the parameters like salinity, ph, alk, etc.. are similar between the old and new water to not introduce too much shock.

Not sure why ur LFS said to not do wc. I'm assuming he means "while cycling" bc you want to just let the biology do its thing.

A post cycled tank generally does have elevated nitrate which i would think that you'll want to remove via a large wc anyway before adding fish.

Large wc for me means 50%+
 
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Uzair Aiman

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Most of the nitrifying bacteria will be in the rock/sand or other surface area so once its cycled, wc won't impact it as long as the parameters like salinity, ph, alk, etc.. are similar between the old and new water to not introduce too much shock.

Not sure why ur LFS said to not do wc. I'm assuming he means "while cycling" bc you want to just let the biology do its thing.

A post cycled tank generally does have elevated nitrate which i would think that you'll want to remove via a large wc anyway before adding fish.

Large wc for me means 50%+
Alright. Thanks, will do a big RODI water change before adding any fish.
 
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Uzair Aiman

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Not necessary! The bacteria can live on without an ammonia source for weeks and weeks. Just give the cycle a push and remove the shrimp after a few days.
Sorry but maybe you've left out a question since ive just editted it. Is it possible to use freshwater fish food to spike the ammonia? since I havent bought any salt fish food yet
 
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Uzair Aiman

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For most tests, yes. :D Sorry, forgot that Salifert reads in mg/L not ppm.

I am not sure how activated carbon interacts with microbes actually. To be safe, I generally remove all filter media except biomedia.

Yep. Until you introduce an ammonia source, and then you may start reading nitrites once ammonia is oxidized.

So far, bacterial blooms, and just a lack of nitrification. I had a tank go for a month without any, so seemed like I got a dud product.

If you follow my guide, you'll see points of testing/etc. that can let you know what the progress is.

No probs. XD
Oof huhu, Ive added activated carbon while cycling for the past week, does it affect my bacteria population?
 

NeonRabbit221B

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Sorry but maybe you've left out a question since ive just editted it. Is it possible to use freshwater fish food to spike the ammonia? since I havent bought any salt fish food yet
Freshwater food should work too. The reason I recommend ammonia chloride is because you don't have to wait for it to break down. I also agree with the large water change once you can visibly see your tank being able to process 1 ppm ammonia in a day (more is fine).

To go more indepth about why you don't need to add more bacteria... If the bacteria do die off then they produce ammonia... which feeds the still living bacteria. Science is foggy whether this would impact anyone so consider your bacteria added and don't waste money adding more.

edit: Nope, carbon shouldn't impact bacteria pop.
 
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Uzair Aiman

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Freshwater food should work too. The reason I recommend ammonia chloride is because you don't have to wait for it to break down. I also agree with the large water change once you can visibly see your tank being able to process 1 ppm ammonia in a day (more is fine).

To go more indepth about why you don't need to add more bacteria... If the bacteria do die off then they produce ammonia... which feeds the still living bacteria. Science is foggy whether this would impact anyone so consider your bacteria added and don't waste money adding more.

edit: Nope, carbon shouldn't impact bacteria pop.
The breaking down part will take around 2-3 days am I correct? And is it possible to add TOO many ammonia (if i were to add excessive amounts of shrimp and food) that it will fail the cycle entirely?
 

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