Ever seen Phosphates this high? Woah!

JayFish4004

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Just got my ATI tests back and my phosphates are off the charts high. Oddly enough I have zero nuisance algae to speak of and everything is healthy. I’m a big fan of “if it aint broke dont fix it” but also curious how Im so off the charts here without any signs of it.


Salinity34.41 PSU35.00 PSU-0.59 PSU
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Carbonate hardness7.77 °dKH7.50 °dKH+0.27 °dKH
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Major elements
Chloride19170 mg/l19243 mg/l-73.10 mg/l
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Sodium10731 mg/l10690 mg/l+40.60 mg/l
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Magnesium1350 mg/l1278 mg/l+71.63 mg/l
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Sulfur1008 mg/l894.1 mg/l+114.1 mg/l
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Calcium442.7 mg/l409.2 mg/l+33.58 mg/l
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Potassium427.6 mg/l396.5 mg/l+31.07 mg/l
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Bromine48.41 mg/l65.11 mg/l-16.70 mg/l
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Strontium8.94 mg/l7.77 mg/l+1.17 mg/l
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Boron5.11 mg/l4.28 mg/l+0.83 mg/l
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Fluorine1.57 mg/l1.26 mg/l+0.31 mg/l
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Minor elements
Lithium89.48 µg/l165.2 µg/l-75.74 µg/l
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Silicon108.7 µg/l97.19 µg/l+11.54 µg/l
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Iodine40.78 µg/l63.17 µg/l-22.39 µg/l
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Barium72.67 µg/l9.72 µg/l+62.96 µg/l
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Molybdenum12.44 µg/l11.66 µg/l+0.77 µg/l
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Nickelu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Manganeseu.0.97 µg/l-0.97 µg/l
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Arsenicu.1.46 µg/l-1.46 µg/l
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Berylliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Chromeu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Cobaltu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Ironu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Copperu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Seleniumu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Silveru.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Vanadium1.75 µg/l1.46 µg/l+0.29 µg/l
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Zinc1.10 µg/l1.94 µg/l-0.84 µg/l
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Tinu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Nutrients
Nitrate40.03 mg/l2.00 mg/l+38.03 mg/l
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Phosphorus575.1 µg/l14.58 µg/l+560.5 µg/l
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Phosphate1.76 mg/l0.04 mg/l+1.72 mg/l
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Pollutants
Aluminium10.58 µg/l0.10 µg/l+10.48 µg/l
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Antimonyu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Bismuthu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Leadu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Cadmiumu.0.19 µg/l-0.19 µg/l
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Lanthanumu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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Thalliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Titaniumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Tungstenu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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Mercuryu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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JayFish4004

JayFish4004

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Just got my ATI tests back and my phosphates are off the charts high. Oddly enough I have zero nuisance algae to speak of and everything is healthy. I’m a big fan of “if it aint broke dont fix it” but also curious how Im so off the charts here without any signs of it.


Salinity34.41 PSU35.00 PSU-0.59 PSU
check.png
View
Carbonate hardness7.77 °dKH7.50 °dKH+0.27 °dKH
check.png
View
Major elements
Chloride19170 mg/l19243 mg/l-73.10 mg/l
check.png
View
Sodium10731 mg/l10690 mg/l+40.60 mg/l
check.png
View
Magnesium1350 mg/l1278 mg/l+71.63 mg/l
check.png
View
Sulfur1008 mg/l894.1 mg/l+114.1 mg/l
high_med.png
View
Calcium442.7 mg/l409.2 mg/l+33.58 mg/l
check.png
View
Potassium427.6 mg/l396.5 mg/l+31.07 mg/l
check.png
View
Bromine48.41 mg/l65.11 mg/l-16.70 mg/l
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Strontium8.94 mg/l7.77 mg/l+1.17 mg/l
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Boron5.11 mg/l4.28 mg/l+0.83 mg/l
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Fluorine1.57 mg/l1.26 mg/l+0.31 mg/l
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Minor elements
Lithium89.48 µg/l165.2 µg/l-75.74 µg/l
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Silicon108.7 µg/l97.19 µg/l+11.54 µg/l
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Iodine40.78 µg/l63.17 µg/l-22.39 µg/l
low_med.png
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Barium72.67 µg/l9.72 µg/l+62.96 µg/l
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Molybdenum12.44 µg/l11.66 µg/l+0.77 µg/l
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Nickelu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Manganeseu.0.97 µg/l-0.97 µg/l
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Arsenicu.1.46 µg/l-1.46 µg/l
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Berylliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Chromeu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Cobaltu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Ironu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Copperu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Seleniumu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Silveru.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Vanadium1.75 µg/l1.46 µg/l+0.29 µg/l
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Zinc1.10 µg/l1.94 µg/l-0.84 µg/l
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Tinu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Nutrients
Nitrate40.03 mg/l2.00 mg/l+38.03 mg/l
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Phosphorus575.1 µg/l14.58 µg/l+560.5 µg/l
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Phosphate1.76 mg/l0.04 mg/l+1.72 mg/l
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Pollutants
Aluminium10.58 µg/l0.10 µg/l+10.48 µg/l
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Antimonyu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Bismuthu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Leadu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Cadmiumu.0.19 µg/l-0.19 µg/l
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Lanthanumu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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Thalliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Titaniumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Tungstenu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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Mercuryu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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Likely contributors:

Recently started trying Reef Nutrition AB+ - I’ve only dosed 2-3 times in the last few weeks.

Recently started feeding Reef Frenzy Nano - maybe overfeeding this or feeding too often.

I also feed TDO pellets but I’m fairly certain its the Reef Frenzy or AB+
 

Enderg60

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Yup, When i started testing phos on my tank it was around 4.0 Not 0.04....

Granted I had never thought of phosphate at that point, had a highly socked and well fed tank with a sulpher denitrator on it. So yeah, made sense.

Id still bring it down slowly with some GFO since thats pretty high.
 
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JayFish4004

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Yup, When i started testing phos on my tank it was around 4.0 Not 0.04....

Granted I had never thought of phosphate at that point, had a highly socked and well fed tank with a sulpher denitrator on it. So yeah, made sense.

Id still bring it down slowly with some GFO since thats pretty high.
Should I do GFO or just heavily limit the Reef Frenzy (maybe once a week) and AB+ (maybe once a month?). I get a little nervous about changing things too quick and killing stuff.

The crazy part in all of this is I do weekly 20-30% water changes. When I was only doing mysis and pellets it was high but barely, now with the Reef Frenzy Nano its off the charts high.
 

areefer01

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You are going to get conflicting reports on what you should or shouldn't do. Whatever you do decide just go slow. Seriously. Go slow. With that out of the way how about this:

1. How does the display look to you? Vibrant and healthy?
2. Any signs of algae?
3. If signs, what kind and how is the herbivore population both snail and fish?

Ok, now:
1. Have you run any manual tests to compare?
2. Do you have a history of results how does it look?
3. Knowing those numbers how do they look to 1 - 3 above?

Me personally unless the system is showing signs of troubles, and not the Irish ones, I wouldn't sweat it. I'd monitor and assess but if the history is high phosphate but awesome display as you said. Don't over correct or react and hold steady. It is just a number after all. And above all the conflicting advise is to nuke it from space as quick as possible but it has already been proven that amazing displays with a long history of 20 years have had phosphate over 1.x.

TL; DR my point is rather simple which I hope I conveyed properly. Do you have a manual test or other form of phosphate history and how does your display look to you over it. And lastly how is the herbivore population

All the best to you.
 
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JayFish4004

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You are going to get conflicting reports on what you should or shouldn't do. Whatever you do decide just go slow. Seriously. Go slow. With that out of the way how about this:

1. How does the display look to you? Vibrant and healthy?
2. Any signs of algae?
3. If signs, what kind and how is the herbivore population both snail and fish?

Ok, now:
1. Have you run any manual tests to compare?
2. Do you have a history of results how does it look?
3. Knowing those numbers how do they look to 1 - 3 above?

Me personally unless the system is showing signs of troubles, and not the Irish ones, I wouldn't sweat it. I'd monitor and assess but if the history is high phosphate but awesome display as you said. Don't over correct or react and hold steady. It is just a number after all. And above all the conflicting advise is to nuke it from space as quick as possible but it has already been proven that amazing displays with a long history of 20 years have had phosphate over 1.x.

TL; DR my point is rather simple which I hope I conveyed properly. Do you have a manual test or other form of phosphate history and how does your display look to you over it. And lastly how is the herbivore population

All the best to you.
I would say by all means the system is vibrant and healthy - very little algae to speak of. I did recently (last few weeks) start introducing new food so my fear is while algae may be fine now, it may be on the cusp of going crazy. I have a great cleanup crew of nessarrius snails, cerith snails, trochus snails, fighting conch, 2 emerald crabs, 2 sea stars and a tuxedo urchin.

Here are my results from mid April - Phosphorus went from 30 to 500 in the last 3 months and only thing new is feeding Reef Frenzy Nano daily and a few doses of AB+.


SymbolValueCalculated reference valueDifferenceResultActions
Base elements
Salinity34.79 PSU35.00 PSU-0.21 PSU
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Carbonate hardness8.11 °dKH7.50 °dKH+0.61 °dKH
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Major elements
Chloride19253 mg/l19447 mg/l-194.5 mg/l
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Sodium10912 mg/l10804 mg/l+108.1 mg/l
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Magnesium1357 mg/l1292 mg/l+65.28 mg/l
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Sulfur1054 mg/l903.6 mg/l+150.0 mg/l
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Calcium440.9 mg/l413.5 mg/l+27.37 mg/l
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Potassium424.8 mg/l400.7 mg/l+24.03 mg/l
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Bromine49.48 mg/l65.81 mg/l-16.33 mg/l
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Strontium8.93 mg/l7.86 mg/l+1.08 mg/l
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Boron4.75 mg/l4.32 mg/l+0.43 mg/l
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Fluorine1.56 mg/l1.28 mg/l+0.29 mg/l
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Minor elements
Lithium102.6 µg/l167.0 µg/l-64.41 µg/l
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Silicon109.0 µg/l98.22 µg/l+10.82 µg/l
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Iodine24.70 µg/l63.84 µg/l-39.14 µg/l
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Barium69.41 µg/l9.82 µg/l+59.59 µg/l
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Molybdenum16.80 µg/l11.79 µg/l+5.01 µg/l
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Nickelu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Manganeseu.0.98 µg/l-0.98 µg/l
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Arsenicu.1.47 µg/l-1.47 µg/l
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Berylliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Chromeu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Cobaltu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Ironu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Copper1.16 µg/l0.49 µg/l+0.67 µg/l
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Seleniumu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Silveru.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Vanadium0.65 µg/l1.47 µg/l-0.82 µg/l
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Zincu.1.96 µg/l-1.96 µg/l
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Tinu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Nutrients
Nitrate31.70 mg/l2.00 mg/l+29.70 mg/l
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Phosphorus31.98 µg/l14.73 µg/l+17.25 µg/l
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Phosphate0.10 mg/l0.04 mg/l+0.05 mg/l
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Pollutants
Aluminium9.27 µg/l0.10 µg/l+9.17 µg/l
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Antimonyu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Bismuthu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Leadu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Cadmiumu.0.20 µg/l-0.20 µg/l
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Lanthanumu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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Thalliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Titaniumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Tungstenu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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Mercuryu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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JayFish4004

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AB+ IME doesn’t really create much phosphates (or nitrates for that matter). Far more likely to be the coral frenzy and pellets.
It was at 30 with the pellets and if anything I feed less pellets now than I did in April. Thinking it has to be the Reef Frenzy Nano then.

Wonder if I just move back to mysis and pellets and ditch the Reef Frenzy? Or just do Reef Frenzy once a week for a bit to see what that does?
 

MaxTremors

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It was at 30 with the pellets and if anything I feed less pellets now than I did in April. Thinking it has to be the Reef Frenzy Nano then.

Wonder if I just move back to mysis and pellets and ditch the Reef Frenzy? Or just do Reef Frenzy once a week for a bit to see what that does?
I would wait until your phosphates are lower, and then resume feeding the coral frenzy once every 1-2 weeks the day before you do water changes. In general frozen foods have less phosphates than pellets or flakes.
 
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areefer01

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Thanks for the reply. Vibrant and healthy is great. I over feed as well :)

You can dial back feeding but as you suggest pick one to reduce or remove and make it a methodical process and make notes. Personally speaking if this is LRS frozen food it is probably the best on the market and pure. You could drop it to once a week or the other frozen food and see. I guess it would depend on cost or if it matters.

From what you are describing through is that it looks great and amazing to you but has high phosphate. I definitely wouldn't over react or correct and continue what you are doing if you want to lower it then go about it in a methodical way and take notes.
 
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I would wait until your phosphates are lower, and then resume feeding the coral frenzy once every 1-2 weeks the day before you do water changes. In general frozen foods have less phosphates than pellets or flakes.
I’m in a tricky situation - decided to buy a Biota Mandarin pair, which I adore, but comes with feeding challenges that need to be figured out. Before I got the mandarins I only fed mysis and had nitrates around 10ppm and very low phos. This was in January, roughly 7 months ago. My fish were also way less healthy, the pellets have been huge for their healthy bellies.

The mandarins are good eaters and will eat mysis, reef frenzy, tdo pellets and pods. I add pods once a month as a safety net as well. I have 7 other fish who will also consume the pellets like there’s no tomorrow, so I end up needing to throw in a few more because of that.

I’m starting to think that its probably not a good idea to do AB+ and Reef Frenzy if I’m already needing to feed pellets. The corals probably have all the nutrients they need in the water.
 

Erin1971Texas

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I’m starting to think that its probably not a good idea to do AB+ and Reef Frenzy if I’m already needing to feed pellets. The corals probably have all the nutrients they need in the water.
^^This :)
 

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When I was testing phosphates .03-.1 my sps would always die. Now I test at .65 and ALL of my corals including SPS are doing great without anything dying in months.

I am by no means saying one way is better than the other nor that I know anything. Just stating observation of my own system. I have some Rowaphos sitting on the shelf but too scared to use it as everything is doing well. Best of luck and please keep us updated.
 

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When I was testing phosphates .03-.1 my sps would always die. Now I test at .65 and ALL of my corals including SPS are doing great without anything dying in months.

I am by no means saying one way is better than the other nor that I know anything. Just stating observation of my own system. I have some Rowaphos sitting on the shelf but too scared to use it as everything is doing well. Best of luck and please keep us updated.
How mature is ur tank. How long have those pieces been in there. Have u put any frags in there recently with no issues?
 
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JayFish4004

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How mature is ur tank. How long have those pieces been in there. Have u put any frags in there recently with no issues?
Tank is about 14 months old now - 9 small fish and about 14 pieces of coral. I had a staghorn die recently but thinking my citron goby eating his polyps was more likely the cause - a recent birdsnest addition is doing well. I can’t keep bali green slimers alive either but thinking the citron harassing is also the cause there
 

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Tank is about 14 months old now - 9 small fish and about 14 pieces of coral. I had a staghorn die recently but thinking my citron goby eating his polyps was more likely the cause - a recent birdsnest addition is doing well. I can’t keep bali green slimers alive either but thinking the citron harassing is also the cause there
I can't even keep certain SPS alive and most brown out smh and since it's a smaller tank when i do par up my lps have an issue
 

ggNoRe

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The system has been up and running for a year and a half.

The mosts recent sps added (birdnest) was about 2 months ago after my phosphates had already spiked back up and has never shown any signs of distress and is doing well. And I almost forgot that I even more recently added a JF Solar Flare Milli only a couple weeks ago that looks absolutely amazing with great polyp extension

4 months ago I ordered several SPS frags. Right before they came in I noticed my phosphates were really high (around .4) so I used Chemipure Elite. I didn't want to make any fast changes so I used the 25 gallon rated bag even though my system is 200 gallons. So right around the same time the corals arrived my phosphates dropped from around .4 to about .1 over the course of the next 3 weeks. About half of the SPS died and other than one the rest either bleached or browned out. Since then I just do my regular maintenance and don't add anything. My phosphates have crept back up to .65. All of the corals that bleached or browned out but didn't die are miraculously coming back to life.

Pictures attached. You can really see the RR Pink Floyd was basically dead and started to come back to life.

Hope this all makes sense I know I'm bouncing around a lot.
 

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Corals.com

Crotalus

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Should I do GFO or just heavily limit the Reef Frenzy (maybe once a week) and AB+ (maybe once a month?). I get a little nervous about changing things too quick and killing stuff.

The crazy part in all of this is I do weekly 20-30% water changes. When I was only doing mysis and pellets it was high but barely, now with the Reef Frenzy Nano its off the charts high.
Coral Feast advertises itself as low in phosphates, but I can't put a number on it.
 

Lionfish hunter

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Just got my ATI tests back and my phosphates are off the charts high. Oddly enough I have zero nuisance algae to speak of and everything is healthy. I’m a big fan of “if it aint broke dont fix it” but also curious how Im so off the charts here without any signs of it.


Salinity34.41 PSU35.00 PSU-0.59 PSU
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Carbonate hardness7.77 °dKH7.50 °dKH+0.27 °dKH
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Major elements
Chloride19170 mg/l19243 mg/l-73.10 mg/l
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Sodium10731 mg/l10690 mg/l+40.60 mg/l
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Magnesium1350 mg/l1278 mg/l+71.63 mg/l
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Sulfur1008 mg/l894.1 mg/l+114.1 mg/l
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Calcium442.7 mg/l409.2 mg/l+33.58 mg/l
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Potassium427.6 mg/l396.5 mg/l+31.07 mg/l
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Bromine48.41 mg/l65.11 mg/l-16.70 mg/l
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Strontium8.94 mg/l7.77 mg/l+1.17 mg/l
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Boron5.11 mg/l4.28 mg/l+0.83 mg/l
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Fluorine1.57 mg/l1.26 mg/l+0.31 mg/l
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Minor elements
Lithium89.48 µg/l165.2 µg/l-75.74 µg/l
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Silicon108.7 µg/l97.19 µg/l+11.54 µg/l
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Iodine40.78 µg/l63.17 µg/l-22.39 µg/l
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Barium72.67 µg/l9.72 µg/l+62.96 µg/l
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Molybdenum12.44 µg/l11.66 µg/l+0.77 µg/l
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Nickelu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Manganeseu.0.97 µg/l-0.97 µg/l
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Arsenicu.1.46 µg/l-1.46 µg/l
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Berylliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Chromeu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Cobaltu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Ironu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Copperu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Seleniumu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Silveru.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Vanadium1.75 µg/l1.46 µg/l+0.29 µg/l
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Zinc1.10 µg/l1.94 µg/l-0.84 µg/l
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Tinu.0.49 µg/l-0.49 µg/l
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Nutrients
Nitrate40.03 mg/l2.00 mg/l+38.03 mg/l
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Phosphorus575.1 µg/l14.58 µg/l+560.5 µg/l
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Phosphate1.76 mg/l0.04 mg/l+1.72 mg/l
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Pollutants
Aluminium10.58 µg/l0.10 µg/l+10.48 µg/l
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Antimonyu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Bismuthu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Leadu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Cadmiumu.0.19 µg/l-0.19 µg/l
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Lanthanumu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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Thalliumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Titaniumu.0.10 µg/l-0.10 µg/l
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Tungstenu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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Mercuryu.0 µg/l+0 µg/l
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I am skeptical of these results if you never had a phosphate problem and are not seeing algae. You would be surprised how often results are wrong. Did you verify these results with a different test?
 
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