Getting with the flow in my 650g DT

[gt44ever]

Hello reefers!
I'm looking to up the flow in my monster FO(WLR) tank. Most of the monster threads I've been through are using somewhere north of 4x 4000+gph powerheads for flow, granted mostly for reefs.

Currently I have this (controlled water flow shown along with a rough aquascape. Tank is roughly 10' long x 34" wide x 28" tall):

The only flow is from the return pumps, which I'm currently estimating about 3x system volume (750g) total flow from 2 pumps, so about 2250gph. They enter just under the surface. I have several braces that break the surface and have some definite stagnant flow between a couple of them.

My question is, where do I need to go with these big powerheads and what might be some good options for me (Gyre style pumps vs traditional impeller styles, concentrated flow vs broader more conical patterns, do lots of smaller pumps vs a few big ones, etc)?

I've tried digging around, but not finding a lot of similar setups with the end-to-end flow like this. I've seen a lot of side overflows and some creative inflows, and I don't have a good way to redo the overall circuit at this time.
Right now, I would likely do 4-6 powerheads (depending on power and flow shape) spaced across the tank in pairs just increasing the existing flow pattern (across top which should draw back along the bottom), but I'm new to all this so don't know if that's a good plan or if I'm just moving some water around with no real purpose.

 

[Ron Reefman]

Just a suggestion, I'd consider 2 gyres on the back glass, one just outside, towards the ends of the tank at 1/3 and 2/3. In other words at 30% out from the drain end and at 30% in from the return end. Then do a good size wavemaker pump in the middle and pointed slightly toward the drain end.

You have far less issues with it being a fish only tank and no corals to worry about.

 

[KrisReef]

I think I would put 1 or 2 gyres, or 2 powerheads near the bottom of the tank on the wall of the overflow to push water back across the bottom of the tank towards the return pumps to create a circular current inside the tank.

 

[Ron Reefman]

I think I would put 1 or 2 gyres, or 2 powerheads near the bottom of the tank on the wall of the overflow to push water back across the bottom of the tank towards the return pumps to create a circular current inside the tank.

Excellent idea Kris!

 

[gt44ever]

Ok, first I'm going to update my diagrams with clear directional indicators just to make things a bit clearer:

I'm going to use cardinal directions for sides since the tank is a peninsula style that's visible from both sides. Just makes it less confusing.
One note, I only have access from the South side of the tank so any side glass placement will likely be there so I can actually get to it for service.

I'll do a quick diagram as ideas roll in so I can make sure nothing gets lost in translation.

Just a suggestion, I'd consider 2 gyres on the back glass, one just outside, towards the ends of the tank at 1/3 and 2/3. In other words at 30% out from the drain end and at 30% in from the return end. Then do a good size wavemaker pump in the middle and pointed slightly toward the drain end.

You have far less issues with it being a fish only tank and no corals to worry about.

I'm going to guess back glass here would be my north side. I'm just going to swap to south for service since that should really matter between them. I might also consider mounting on the cross braces if the location works out for me.
I think I would end up with something like this (note new items in orange with green flow arrows. Note the length of the flow arrows roughly approximates the power of the flow):

A few of these aren't quite what I have in my head but close enough for the moment. This to me would be a "cross flow" configuration where the powerheads and gyres are mostly turning the water across the main circuit flow.
I know I don't have as much to worry about, but just don't know what would work well with my tank as long and big as it is.

I think I would put 1 or 2 gyres, or 2 powerheads near the bottom of the tank on the wall of the overflow to push water back across the bottom of the tank towards the return pumps to create a circular current inside the tank.

I'll sketch this one too, but can't go too low as its a very very fine sand bottom for the sharks. I can't even gravel vac it very well because the sand comes up almost as easily as any detritus. I'll show it here about halfway down and I'll include a center gyre in along with 2 powerheads just for clarity on both items.

Powerheads here will definitely be glass mounted with magnets as there's no other way to get the north powerhead into place without taking a swim. Not even sure I could get the gyre in that location without a major dip so likely would go for just the powerheads here.
I'd call this maybe a reverse or counter flow since the powerheads are pointed against the main circuit flow. I know it's technically enhancing what should be the rough circular motion the main circuite flow is generating, but simpler to class by where the powerheads are pointing. The main circuit doesn't exactly generate a ton of motion throughout the tank.


If I've misunderstood or am speaking gibberish, feel free to correct me. I'm here to learn.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

I think I would put 1 or 2 gyres, or 2 powerheads near the bottom of the tank on the wall of the overflow to push water back across the bottom of the tank towards the return pumps to create a circular current inside the tank.

Kris you are dead on. 2 Gyres or 2 large powerheads exactly as you stated, would make 1 big gyre to turn over the entire display, so to speak. This would also limit the amount of dead spots everywhere, or at least almost everywhere.

 

[Ron Reefman]

gt44ever, you didn't say this was a peninsula in your original post. That makes a HUGE difference!

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Ok, first I'm going to update my diagrams with clear directional indicators just to make things a bit clearer:

I'm going to use cardinal directions for sides since the tank is a peninsula style that's visible from both sides. Just makes it less confusing.
One note, I only have access from the South side of the tank so any side glass placement will likely be there so I can actually get to it for service.

I'll do a quick diagram as ideas roll in so I can make sure nothing gets lost in translation.


I'm going to guess back glass here would be my north side. I'm just going to swap to south for service since that should really matter between them. I might also consider mounting on the cross braces if the location works out for me.
I think I would end up with something like this (note new items in orange with green flow arrows. Note the length of the flow arrows roughly approximates the power of the flow):

A few of these aren't quite what I have in my head but close enough for the moment. This to me would be a "cross flow" configuration where the powerheads and gyres are mostly turning the water across the main circuit flow.
I know I don't have as much to worry about, but just don't know what would work well with my tank as long and big as it is.


I'll sketch this one too, but can't go too low as its a very very fine sand bottom for the sharks. I can't even gravel vac it very well because the sand comes up almost as easily as any detritus. I'll show it here about halfway down and I'll include a center gyre in along with 2 powerheads just for clarity on both items.

Powerheads here will definitely be glass mounted with magnets as there's no other way to get the north powerhead into place without taking a swim. Not even sure I could get the gyre in that location without a major dip so likely would go for just the powerheads here.
I'd call this maybe a reverse or counter flow since the powerheads are pointed against the main circuit flow. I know it's technically enhancing what should be the rough circular motion the main circuite flow is generating, but simpler to class by where the powerheads are pointing. The main circuit doesn't exactly generate a ton of motion throughout the tank.


If I've misunderstood or am speaking gibberish, feel free to correct me. I'm here to learn.

Ok you have sharks and fine sand. Here is where it gets tricky.

I assume the point in this is not so much, flow for the fish, but to help keep everything clean? If so the placement of the gyres and powerheads in your bottom illustration would be ideal, water going past the lower mid section, in theory should help pull/push up from the sand a little, in so short words lol. I have a puffer tank/ray that is set up in a similar manner, but it is not a peninsula even though my overlfow is at one end. I only have plain jane powerheads that sit about 3" off the sand and sit just about level. The flow out of them is pretty straight, so I do not blow sand around but there is enough flow on the sand to keep the nasties suspended until they go down the overflow at the other. Like your tank as well, my returns are opposite of the overflow and blow towards it. I do have one return kicked down some and to the middle of the tank for a bit of randomness in flow, but it is not much. For me, it works and the rays seem to love gliding it when they play.

 

[gt44ever]

gt44ever, you didn't say this was a peninsula in your original post. That makes a HUGE difference!

Ya sorry. new and still sorting out what's important to mention and forgetting details way more than I should.
Edit: Also if anyone wants to have a look at my build thread and correct anything I stated here or there, the link is in my signature. I apologize in advance if I've given any bad information.
Edit2: It's probably more accurate to call it a semi-peninsula style. It's built into the wall and the east end is wall aside from a small porthole. It is fully visible down both the north and south sides. So condensed, we have:
N-glass
S-glass w/tank access
W-wall w/overflow
E- wall w/porthole and return lines
Hopefully, with that there's no further confusion.

Ok you have sharks and fine sand. Here is where it gets tricky.

I assume the point in this is not so much, flow for the fish, but to help keep everything clean? If so the placement of the gyres and powerheads in your bottom illustration would be ideal, water going past the lower mid section, in theory should help pull/push up from the sand a little, in so short words lol. I have a puffer tank/ray that is set up in a similar manner, but it is not a peninsula even though my overlfow is at one end. I only have plain jane powerheads that sit about 3" off the sand and sit just about level. The flow out of them is pretty straight, so I do not blow sand around but there is enough flow on the sand to keep the nasties suspended until they go down the overflow at the other. Like your tank as well, my returns are opposite of the overflow and blow towards it. I do have one return kicked down some and to the middle of the tank for a bit of randomness in flow, but it is not much. For me, it works and the rays seem to love gliding it when they play.

Ya keeping things cleaner is a big part of it. I have a fair bit of detritus that just settles back out of the water column, plus some messy eaters, and while I'm also looking into a cleanup crew down the road, most good cleaners look like food in my tank. I do think some of the smaller fish might appreciate more flow though as well (I also have a Blue/Queen angel, Soldierfish, and 2 groupers). I'm not overly concerned with major deadspots at the moment as my rockwork is pretty sparse and minimal, but I'll be redoing the rockwork in the not-so-distant future with a lot more structure so planning on trying to "future proof" a bit as well.

Ok, that should be doable. To follow up though, would I be able to get a pair of powerheads to keep things moving across the full length of the tank since it's around 10 feet long?
For example: My return flow kinda peters out about 1/3 of the way across the top and I get some stagnant spots between some of the braces. I've been considering adding a one or two pair of powerheads around those braces on opposite sides of the tank blowing with the return flow to keep the surface from stagnating in those areas. I'm in a diagramming mood so here's that though with the added pumps shown in purple:


Just out of curiosity, what model powerheads? I know quite a few have a more dispersed conical flow, which would be tricky to use close to the sand without blowing it. A straighter, more focused flow should also do better at traversing my tank I would think.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Ya sorry. new and still sorting out what's important to mention and forgetting details way more than I should.



Ya keeping things cleaner is a big part of it. I have a fair bit of detritus that just settles back out of the water column, plus some messy eaters, and while I'm also looking into a cleanup crew down the road, most good cleaners look like food in my tank. I do think some of the smaller fish might appreciate more flow though as well (I also have a Blue/Queen angel, Soldierfish, and 2 groupers). I'm not overly concerned with major deadspots at the moment as my rockwork is pretty sparse and minimal, but I'll be redoing the rockwork in the not-so-distant future with a lot more structure so planning on trying to "future proof" a bit as well.

Ok, that should be doable. To follow up though, would I be able to get a pair of powerheads to keep things moving across the full length of the tank since it's around 10 feet long?
For example: My return flow kinda peters out about 1/3 of the way across the top and I get some stagnant spots between some of the braces. I've been considering adding a one or two pair of powerheads around those braces on opposite sides of the tank blowing with the return flow to keep the surface from stagnating in those areas. I'm in a diagramming mood so here's that though with the added pumps shown in purple:


Just out of curiosity, what model powerheads? I know quite a few have a more dispersed conical flow, which would be tricky to use close to the sand without blowing it. A straighter, more focused flow should also do better at traversing my tank I would think.

There are a ton of options. My puffer/ray tank is an 8' tank and the returns give out just past half way across. The way I have the power heads and their size does make it across, and seems to help with extending the flow of the returns. I assume it is the whole mix of directional flow mixed in. With the powerheads running, my returns can make it all the way across. With them off, not so much. As mentioned before, they are your basic powerheads. Simple Hydor Korilla Magnum 3250s. Both together make it across 8' no problem, with the end of the run being less "push" of course.

As for other models, the cheap chinese powerheads are usually very directional and can be aimed to create a very tight flow. There are numerous name chinese name brand ones and big name ones that are very direct flow as well, with your gyres being a wider spread. You also have models that can pull and push. At this point, flow type and size is endless with all of the options out there.

A co-worker of mine has a 10' pennisula, so I just pinged him what he uses, and he uses Vortech MP60s. He has 3 of them in his tank about 6" off the sand on the overflow end and they make it the entire distance with ease. His overflow also is the entire end of that tank. He uses the night mode to turn them down as well at night. Where I just use a timer to turn mine off at night lol. His tank runs fiji pink sand and it has a very hills/valleys, but where he finally set them up at, it does not blow it around after the initial few hours of running. He is also very happy with them and is acting like a the salesman he is, "Tell him they will work great, just buy them. he will be happy." But me being the engineer, says for you to do some research on them. I can say though, if you do want to research them, ecotech support has always been good to me in the past. As have other bigger name brands.

The one thing I have learned with this is trial and error. I have tried sooo many times to plan it out, with only needing more or less than I had planned. Flow is surely a fun aspect if you like toying with things. I can say though, with the right powerheads and right placement, it can be done with minimal units, especially since you are not trying to create a a chaotic random flow like I have in my SPS tank. No sand in that bad boy.

The best thing I can think with a tank that big is to try and research what powerheads can go the distance of the tank. Powerheads can bu put on the sides, but it is a peninsula, I would not want them there if I could help it.

 

[gt44ever]

There are a ton of options. My puffer/ray tank is an 8' tank and the returns give out just past half way across. The way I have the power heads and their size does make it across, and seems to help with extending the flow of the returns. I assume it is the whole mix of directional flow mixed in. With the powerheads running, my returns can make it all the way across. With them off, not so much. As mentioned before, they are your basic powerheads. Simple Hydor Korilla Magnum 3250s. Both together make it across 8' no problem, with the end of the run being less "push" of course.

As for other models, the cheap chinese powerheads are usually very directional and can be aimed to create a very tight flow. There are numerous name chinese name brand ones and big name ones that are very direct flow as well, with your gyres being a wider spread. You also have models that can pull and push. At this point, flow type and size is endless with all of the options out there.

A co-worker of mine has a 10' pennisula, so I just pinged him what he uses, and he uses Vortech MP60s. He has 3 of them in his tank about 6" off the sand on the overflow end and they make it the entire distance with ease. His overflow also is the entire end of that tank. He uses the night mode to turn them down as well at night. Where I just use a timer to turn mine off at night lol. His tank runs fiji pink sand and it has a very hills/valleys, but where he finally set them up at, it does not blow it around after the initial few hours of running. He is also very happy with them and is acting like a the salesman he is, "Tell him they will work great, just buy them. he will be happy." But me being the engineer, says for you to do some research on them. I can say though, if you do want to research them, ecotech support has always been good to me in the past. As have other bigger name brands.

The one thing I have learned with this is trial and error. I have tried sooo many times to plan it out, with only needing more or less than I had planned. Flow is surely a fun aspect if you like toying with things. I can say though, with the right powerheads and right placement, it can be done with minimal units, especially since you are not trying to create a a chaotic random flow like I have in my SPS tank. No sand in that bad boy.

The best thing I can think with a tank that big is to try and research what powerheads can go the distance of the tank. Powerheads can bu put on the sides, but it is a peninsula, I would not want them there if I could help it.

Ok cool. Hadn't heard of the Magnum Koralia models (prolly because they appear to be discontinued). Just nano and evolution, which tap out under 3000gph, which I'm assuming isn't quite enough flow. I'm considering something fairly cheap to start and may upgrade to something more controllable over time if I feel the need. If a 3250gph is making it across 8' though, I may be able to get away with a little less pump that I originally thought.

Unfortunately I do believe MP60s will not work on my tank without putting a hole in a wall. Both ends are drywalled in aside from a little porthole so nothing on the outside of that glass and it looks like the MP60s can only run perpendicular to the glass unless I'm missing something. Also my wallet cried a bit seeing the price on those so not quite in the budget either.

I'm sure I'll spend way too much time researching different models to try to optimize the flow within my budget as I'm an engineer as well and have spent way too much time researching all sorts of things to the nth degree. ;Bookworm

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Ok cool. Hadn't heard of the Magnum Koralia models (prolly because they appear to be discontinued). Just nano and evolution, which tap out under 3000gph, which I'm assuming isn't quite enough flow. I'm considering something fairly cheap to start and may upgrade to something more controllable over time if I feel the need. If a 3250gph is making it across 8' though, I may be able to get away with a little less pump that I originally thought.

Unfortunately I do believe MP60s will not work on my tank without putting a hole in a wall. Both ends are drywalled in aside from a little porthole so nothing on the outside of that glass and it looks like the MP60s can only run perpendicular to the glass unless I'm missing something. Also my wallet cried a bit seeing the price on those so not quite in the budget either.

I'm sure I'll spend way too much time researching different models to try to optimize the flow within my budget as I'm an engineer as well and have spent way too much time researching all sorts of things to the nth degree. ;Bookworm

Yeah, they are pricy for the MPs. Don’t feel bad. I research everything, think of how to redesign, can I make it cheaper and better all the time lol. Keep us updated though which way you go and what works. I am sure you are not the only one with this situation of lacking access and such.

 

[gt44ever]

So found out I actually could attach to my east glass as there's a gap between the glass and the drywall that is (just) accessible. I'd likely only be able to use about the top or bottom 1/4-1/3 of the glass though as I'll have to break out my contortionist act to get anything in there and my arms are only so long. West wall is likely impossible as I'm looking at 3/4" of glass plus another 1/2" of drywall and that's if there isn't a stud where I want to mount.

I'm working on compiling a list of powerheads and some flow information on them that I'm going to post on here. Actually had the post largely typed up and lost the draft :mad: but here's a basic rundown of what will go up. Maybe it'll eventually go into a powerhead quick reference or something:
Basic requirements to make the list:

• Must flow over 3000gph. I think the lowest flow rate I currently have is 3400gph. This is to improve the odds of clearing 10' of tank (technically 10.5, but that last 6 inches shouldn't make or break anything)
• Budgeting a max of about $200 per pump. I'll go over for some and go ahead and list a few pricier options (MP60, Tunze's) that might be upgrades down the road if I cheap out in the short term. I have a couple around $280 that I might be able to justify as well.
• Have to be available for purchase new in the US (so no Koralia Magnums even though I would otherwise consider them)

And I'll list some fairly basic info:

• Price (typical, not sale)
• Flow rate
• Flow shape as best I can tell from videos, reviews, etc. as well as if I think it'll have a good shot at flowing across my tank
• any special notes pertaining to mounting, design, etc.

And as a primer, since I'm not going to recompile my list today, a few of the pumps that I'm planning on including here:

• MP60 and MP40 (informational only)
• Tunze 6155, 6255, and Stream 3 (informational)
• Octo Pulse 4 (was going to consider but mounting won't work so well so informational as well)
• Tunze 6105
• Aqua Medic Ecodrift 20
• Neptune WAV
• Skimz SS18
• various Jebao models
• Your Choice Aquatics EW-40
• Rossmont Mover M4100
• Uniclife W-40
• Aqua Medic Oceanprop 15000
• Aquaneat 6600 and 3400
• Aquarium Masters Aqua Pulse 5280
• Maxspect Gyres
• Jebao Gyres
• Sicce Voyager HP4000
• H2Pro Wavemaker 4227

A few of these won't make that cut and I already know some won't work for me (mostly mounting issues), but I'll go ahead and add the info anyway since I have a lot of it collected already. Any comments on these are welcome as well as any additional models that I could consider. I'm hoping to have the detailed list posted next week.
Cheers

 

[gt44ever]

Well went ahead and picked up a couple of the aqua pulse 5280s from the lfs today since I really just have the word of the folks there to go off of... They hold a tighter cone than I expected (little to no drop and make it about 1/2 of the way across before interference with the return flow causes and pretty stark upwelling and then the flow peters out a little further across... Likely dont have them low enough but they're suction cup mounts and I got them as low as I could without taking a dip. Probably need to try a different flow regeme or go with a magnetic mount. A smaller overall pump will also likely be a good idea as these have one major unintended side effect:

Yes that is a shark (name rocky road) resting on top of the powerhead... He likes to play around at the top of the water and then will settle straight down to the bottom by the overflow... The real issue is he bumps the powerhead down in yhe process eventually making it point at the sand, blowing it everywhere.

I'm gomma let these run for a few days and go deeper on the other models I listed. Well see what I land on though it'll likely be less prone to serving as a perch for rocky road

 

[gt44ever]

Ok, big post coming. I'm going to summarize what I've seen on the various powerheads I've researched (and bought in one case). Also going to add some size info due to my, ah, perching issue, as well as mounting info since that's also important for limited access tanks like mine.
Here we go:

Out of price range, but good pumps that merit looking into (maybe upgrades down the road)
MP-60 and MP-40
$700 and $366
7500gph and 4500 gph
Size: Fairly compact due to dry/wet design - 4"x2.8" for 60 and 3"x3" for 40
Mounting: Wet-dry magnetic setup - 1" and 3/4"
Flow: Generally seems to be a medium cone, well call it 90 degrees and possibly more of a wide stream. Might be because these pumps have kind of established themselves as a standard in powerheads. The 60 should clear the tank and be manageable with the fine sand (per anecdotal evidence in very similar tank)
Notes: Mounting is limited to perpendicular to the mounting surface, which can be limiting. In my case, it makes them a bit of a no-go as I'm either too thick (3/4" glass + drywall), very limited access (E end of the tank) or would have to but the dry side in the wet (inside overflow). Also well out of price range

Tunze 6155, 6255
$434 and $491
3950 and 4800 gph
Size: both- 3.5" (the only dimension Tunze lists). I'm guessing this is the spherical body so add about a 1/2" or so to account for mounting and another 1/2" for the nozzle.
Mounting: Magnetic disc - 3/4" and 1"
Flow: 6155 is a fairly tight nozzled flow, but doesn't actually have the best long distance flow. It's around a 45 degree cone. 6255 is a "wide flow" design from Tunze and I've found limited hard data on it so we'll assume at least a 90 degree cone. The 6255 may well be able to cross the tank with sheer flow volume, but I'd expect a fair bit of sand kicked up along the way. 6155 may be able to cross the 10'.

Tunze Stream 3 (6150)
$351
3962gph
Size: Its big. 3.7 " x 2.7 " x 7.2".
Mounting: Dual magnetic disc - 2/3" (little thin for my glass)
Flow: Comes with a few different nozzles from wide to narrow to a deflected flow that would be used to mount the pump vertically while producing a horizontal flow. Fairly certain I could make this work to cross the tank. If nothing else, the use of attachable nozzles means I could make my own to better focus the flow.

Gyre style pumps
Maxspect XF280 and XF350 (older 250 models would likely be simlar to 350)
$309 and $170 ($260 w/ controller)
6000 and 5280 gph
Size: long but thin - 14.8" x 3.8" x 2" and 12.8" x 3" x 1.5"
Mounting: Central magnetic bar - 1.25" and 3/4"
Flow: Wide and flat. Not a focused flow, but they seem to be able to send water a long way, likely by effectively pushing across the entire width of the water column. Just not sure if they'll make 10'
Notes: not sure how well I'll be able to mount these either since I'd need to mount to the overflow to get the flow regime I'm going for. might be better served as a way to generate varying flow patterns or to supplement the return flow in my tank.

Jebao SCP-150 and CP-55 (and various other "cross flow" models from them)
$117 and $104
7500 and 6864 gph
Size: 12.8"x2.5"x1.8". I'm going to assume the CP-55 is similar since the 150 is apparently its replacement
Mounting: Central magnetic bar - 0.6" (light for my glass, but would work fine on the thin overflow material)
Flow: Assuming similar to the Maxspects but likely not as consistent unit to unit (Jebao seems to be a fairly solid brand out of China, but not always consistent). I would hope ~7000gph of flat wide flow would cross my tank, but would depend on how reliable the flow information is. Other general gyre pump comments also apply here

Higher end pumps ($>150 per pump)
Tunze Stream 6105
$280
3400gph
Size: 3.5" (same as the other 6155 and 6255 per Tunze's website. Not so sure these are all actually the same size though)
Mounting: Magnetic disc - 2/3"
Flow: More focused than the 6155, call it about 40 degree cone. Also seems push higher velocity flow further than it's bigger brothers (per advanced aquarist article on these pumps). Might make it across or might need some help since it's down a bit on flow. Might be the best long, tight flow Tunze aside from possibly the Stream 3

Reef Octopus Octo Pulse 4
$280
4500 gph
Size: 3.54" L x 3.54" W x 3.14" H
Mounting: Dual magnetic setup with a wet side magnet used to adjust the angle on the powerhead - 5/8"
Flow: I've misplaced my notes on this pump, but I believe it's somewhere around the MP-40 in terms of pattern.
Notes: While the mounting is very cool and I like the idea, not sure it'll work well for my application as it's limited to about 30 degrees or so of adjustment from perpendicular to the glass. Since I'm expecting to mount to the side glass, I need about 90 degrees

Aqua Medit Ecodrift 20.0 (and 20.1)
$210
5283gph
Size: 5.35” x 4.33” (pretty big)
Mounting: Magnetic disc - 0.6" (really light for a pump this powerful. Not sure it'll work on my glass)
Flow: Looks like a Tunze clone of sorts and I'm not finding a lot of good info so I have to assume its around a 40-45 degree cone, maybe a little wider depending on the edge turbulence. I'd expect it to make 10' since it's basically a more powerful Tunze.

Sicce Voyager HP4000
$198
4000gph
Size: Big, but set at 90 degrees, likely a decent amount shorter but wider- 6.81” x 3.6” x 3.67”
Mounting: Magnetic block - 0.8"
Flow: Pretty focused (BRS has a great video on this one) with good long range velocity. Around a 60 degree cone, maybe a bit less. Traverses BRS's 6ft test tank with no real trouble.
Notes: Like the flow, but might be a bit bulkier than ideal.

Neptune WAV
$175
4000gph
Size: They say it's smaller than the competition (by mass, because obviously that's what's important here) but don't provide any sort of dimensions (the part I'd actually care about)
Mounting: Magnetic block - 1"
Flow: Generally considered more focused than an MP-40, but not really a tight stream either. Best I can tell it's a "wide stream" I guess, so it widens out very quickly, but holds the flow further out instead of continuing to widen
Notes: Requires an Apex to run. Also limited to 40 degrees of pivot from perpendicular, which finally registered as not workable for my current plan

Budget friendly (but not cheap) options (<$150, >$50)
Skimz SS18.0
$120
4755gph
Size: 4.125" x 3.125" x 2.75" (pretty small overall)
Mounting: Magnetic Disc - 3/4"
Flow: Very little info on these. Best I can tell, it'll likely be somewhere around an MP-40 or a few other lower end pumps. We'll call it 90 degrees for now

Your Choice Aquatics (YCA) EW-40
$105
3430gph
Size: 3.62"x5.20" (little longer than most)
Mounting: Magnetic disc - 0.6" (thinner than I'd like)
Flow: Not a lot of info here. Body is similar to the cheap Aqua pulse I just picked up so best case would be a wide stream, otherwise call it like 90 degrees again for a kind of medium wide flow

H2Pro Wavemaker 4227gph
$104
4227gph
Size: actually can't find any info. Looks like the YCA EW-40 so assume about the same, maybe a little bigger
Mounting: Magnetic Disc - no hard info here. Assume 0.6" until proven otherwise
Flow: This pump has so little info, but looks like the YCA so I'll assume similar flow to that, just more of it. Could end up like the Tunze's where the higher flow pump isn't necessarily better for long distance flow though.

Rossmont Mover MX4100
$104 (in a 2 pack)
4100gph
Size: 4.0" L x 3.0" W x 3.2" H (fairly small)
Mounting: Magnetic block - .75"
Flow: Comes with an optional focusing ring. They claim 120 degrees standard and 60 degrees with the ring. Does seem to move a lot of water and I could potentially make my own focusing ring if I need a tighter flow.
Notes: Controller is expensive ($200) and only runs 2 pumps as a time. Can be had as a set for $400 total for 2 pumps and the controller

Jebao SOW-20 and OW-40 (and some of the other similar models)
$87 and 70
5283 and 3963 gph
Size: 4.7"x3.7" and 4.2"x3.1" (plus another 1/2" or so for the mounting hardware)
Mounting: Magnetic disc - 0.75" and 0.6"
Flow: These look like Tunze clones so I'll expect similar performance to those in terms of flow pattern. We'll err on the side of caution and assume a 45 degree cone or so

Uniclife W-40
$70
3400gph
Size: 4" x 3.1" x2.76" (pretty small)
Mounting: Magnetic Disc - 0.75" (per reviews, not official)
Flow: not a lot of info. Very similar design to the Skimz so we'll assume a similar type of flow at around 90 degrees

Cheap options (likely just a holdover until something nicer can be bought) - Mostly non-controllable
Aqua Medic Oceanprop 15000
$40
3962gph
Size: 5.5"x3.5"x4" (little bulkier than some)
Mounting: Suction cup
Flow: Little to no info. eBay seller says it's a wide flow so assume somewhere in the 90-120 degree cone range.
Notes: Cheapest controllable pump here. Possibly remaining old stock. Suction cup likely makes this a no go unless I need pumps high in the water column.

Aquaneat 6600 and 3400
$33 and $11.44 (for 2 3400s)
6600gph and 3400gph
Size: 6.5 x 6 x 3.5 (that's a big powerhead) and 3.75 x 3.25 x 3 (more medium sized)
Mounting: Magnetic disc - no info on thickness; Suction cup (and apparently it's a fragile design)
Flow: 6600 is likely pretty focused as it used aimed nozzles. Call it 40-45 degrees. 3400 is likely wider and more like 90 degrees, though there's limited real data here.

Aquarium Masters Aqua Pulse 5280
$29 (LFS)
5280gph
Size: 5.9x3.9x5.5 (very bulky in tank)
Mounting: Suction cup (strong enough to support a shark!)
Flow: More focused than I expected. I'll call it around a 60 degree cone or so. Definitely gets wide in a hurry though as you'll barely feel the current a couple feet out. Doesn't quite make it 10', though the achievable mounting height is a limiting factor here as it's likely fighting with the return flow more than I'd like.


That's all I have for now. Right now I have a few shortlisted options I'd strongly consider:
Rossmont - great value proposition and seems to work well in a similar sized tank. Likely my top choice for the moment
Skimz - Little worried about flow pattern here, but another great value with a high level of flow.
Jebao SOW-20 - inexpensive with a high flow rate
Oceanprop - might take a flier on these. Worst case, I crank them down and see if one might work out in the 35g QT I'm setting up. Only major issue is the suction cup mount.
Aquaneat 6600 - another flier option that would likely just be to hold be over until I can afford a Tunze or other higher end pump. Really worried about how bulky it is though.
Tunze - I'd hope the 6105 works, otherwise save up for some of the higher end models. Stream 3 might be good if they put out a rocker cover like they have for some of their other models. Either way, pretty expensive and might require going cheap for the short term.

I like the Sicce flow pattern, but think it's likely still bulkier than I'd prefer.
Might try to just roll with the Aqua Pulse and see if I can rig up a magnetic disc to attach the suction cup to or something. Do wish they were a little smaller though.

 

[gt44ever]

So quick update as I've had the pai of Aqua Pulse 5280s in for a couple weeks now.

Top shot shows pump placement and direction of flow as well as a little bit of what's going on in the tank (dark red flow arrows). I also have a little Rossmont M900 that's eventually going in my QT just helping to disturb the surface in zone 2 where things have been a little stagnant. That's only temporary until I sort out the rest of the setup. The Aqua Pulse powerheads are about halfway down on the side glass as that's as far as my arms will reach without swimming with my sharks.
The south Aqua Pulse is supposed to be aimed just below horizontal, same as the North side, but Rocky Road is having none of it and keeps pumping it down. These powerheads don't lock into place the best so large fish can move them with repeated contact. the downward angle has left a bit of a bare spot on the bottom from blowing the sand more than I'd like.
Surface flow now makes it into zone 3 where I get just a bit of film from oily foods but it's patchy and shifts around from the flow. The upwelling here also contributes to the disturbance of the surface. Lower flow in zones 4 and 5 is there, but more chaotic
Bottom shot just shows powerhead placement as I'm unable to get a good idea of what it looks like from that perspective.

Couple notes on the powerheads:
Rossmont M900 (temporary): assuming a similar flow with the larger MX4100, I don't see this being a focused enough option for me and I'm not sure a better focusing ring would actually help all that much. I think the issue here might be in the prop design, which is a bit more difficult to adjust. Also, I missed the mounting restrictions inherent to the design, which only allow about a 45-60 degree angle from perpendicular depending on how everything's oriented on the pump. I think they'll work great on my QT, but not so much on the DT.
On the plus side, the Rossmont magnets are a bit underrated. The M-series is rated for 1/2" glass, but the M900 holds fine on my 3/4". Not sure it would stand up to much abuse but it's stayed put so far despite Rocky Road bumping it every now and again.

Aqua Pulse 5280: Good strong flow. moderately focused but a definite cone shape. Mounting isn't the most robust as previously mentioned and I can't quite put them parallel to the side glass as the prop cage is just a little to big. They're likely running about 5 degrees or so from parallel, which shouldn't be a big deal.

Updated shortlist:
Tunze 6105s - I've had these recommended a few times and will likely see if I can get a deal on some used ones. Only other possible issue is the glass thickness rating on them, but that's technically upgradable.
Tunze Stream 3s (6150) - I'm thinking these would be brilliant, but can't justify the price. I should be able to hide them along the overflow and the dual magnet might keep a certain shark from adjusting the aim.
Skimz SS18.0s - Trying to find out how focused the flow would be. Likely one of my best values, but really want to find out how they flow before ordering. One reviewer claims a pretty narrow flow so might be closer to 60 degrees than my previously assumed 90
Jebao SOW-20 - The cheap option

Aquaneat's have kinda disappeared and not sure I'd want something that bulky anyway.
moving on from suction cups as well due to depth. The Aqua pulse's may end up on the East glass reinforcing the return flow long term. Maybe about 1/4 depth aimed towards the surface in zone 3 to try to keep the oily film from building up.

 

[gt44ever]

ok so finally progress. I'm fairly happy with the current results, but do still need to tweak a bit. Ive settled on 4 skimz SS18.0 powerheads and a single gyre xf150 to provide some variable flow. 2 ss18's mounted about 1/4 up on the west end and the other pair about 1/4 down on the east.
West is almost dead level. Just a smidge up as these do cone out a decent bit near the pump but shift to more of a wode stream further out. They also really push a long ways and make a good 7-8ft unassisted.
East ss18's are aimed up about 15 degrees to try to encourage surface movement in zones 2 and 3 to prevent oily film build up. Still need to place one but need a spare set of hands for that
Gyre is nearly centered on the east Wall (house support pole in the way for true center) and fairly close to the surface and aimed high. I'm running it reversing right now but it does a great job of pushing water across the top.

Still need to fine tune a little as I'm blowing sand but some of that is rocky road adjusting the aim on the west powerheads... Frequently

Will likely update again once I've fine tuned some more and I may still add diagram of the final configuration. Posting from phone though so not going to happen tonight.

 

[Hitman]

Are you still liking the Skimz SS18 powerheads?

 

[gt44ever]

Are you still liking the Skimz SS18 powerheads?

Yep. I'm running 4 of them, 2 on each end. They do a great job of sending water a long way and have a fairly narrow cone. Only issie I have is they can be shifted around more easily than I'd prefer so I no longer have sand on the west end of the tank. They never fall off, just shift and rotate a bit.

Also have a gyre xf150 high and center on the east end but its proving rather unreliable. It's great when it works just hasnt been working a lot of the time. Oddly, that has been knocked off the side

 

[Hitman]

Glad to hear as I’ve been eyeing a set of 4 for my 600 build. My thoughts are to put them down low and put 1 Maxspect XF350 on each end up high. How long are the cords for the SS18’s