IM Plumbing

[DmitryB]

Ok got my IM 170 INT today and it's heavy! Then I got to the plumbing. I'm not a DYI person in general, so even though it's all pre-made for you, it's still a puzzle. And IM's instructional video is not helpful in many ways because the actual hardware is actually more pre-assembled than in the video, so the woman demonstrating is doing all kinds of things I don't understand because we don't have to do them! In any case, somehow I think I managed. But one question: see screen grab below from the instructions about Gate Valve being required. It is not provided and it's not shown in the installation video. Anybody have any idea - especially those who have done IM installations - what this is and if it's actually needed? (Incidentally, they also say they do not provide plumbing below the bulkheads, but they did! It wasn't in the instructional video either, but there were extra pieces tied together. So these instructions are a bit wrong in any case.)

 

[Marco_99]

It’s used to dial in the flow to make it dead silent. Basically you control the water level in your overflow box with it. The more you open the valve the faster the water leaves the box creating water rushing noise. If you slowly close the valve you maintain a water level and decrease the turbulence of flow in your box making less rushing water noise

 

[DmitryB]

Wait isn't this a gate valve? If that's what this is, they DID install it.

 

[Marco_99]

Wait isn't this a gate valve? If that's what this is, they DID install it.

Yes that is a gate valve

 

[DmitryB]

LOL ok so their instructions are just wrong.

NOW, having some issues with the plumbing. Both drain pipes are leaking - hopefully it's just the bulkheads need to be tightened - which I can't do when the tank is full because it's in what I intend to be its final place and can't reach the overflow!

 

[DmitryB]

Ok now what in the world is this noise?!



EDIT: Ok did a quick search and that gate valve (!!) needs to be closed to raise the level of water in the overflow. I did and that horrible noise stopped. Now the only noise is the dripping water from the drain pipes.

IM says to just hand-tighten the bulkheads and insert the PVC pipes without force. But... maybe it actually needs some kind of adhesive? Now I'll be paranoid all the time.

 

[UncommonSense]

Ok did a quick search and that gate valve (!!) needs to be closed to raise the level of water in the overflow.

You close it partially, just enough to make the drains silent! You do not want to completely close it!

IM says to just hand-tighten the bulkheads and insert the PVC pipes without force. But... maybe it actually needs some kind of adhesive?

Oh wow! Yeah… you should be cementing pipe into fittings… you can technically form a seal without cement, but it isn’t going to be a robust seal, and nobody likes random leaky plumbing!

I’ve got not clue if IM uses PVC, or CPVC plastic for the pipe and fittings, so my recommendation here would be “all purpose” pipe cement!

— just make sure you’ve got all your plumbing where you like it, and note that pipes will easily slip into fittings all the way to the fitting’s shoulders after cement is applied (spin 1/4 turn while seating pipe)… you’ve only got a few minutes of work time before the cement begins to really solidify, so do your fittings one-by one, ideally holding the pipe into the corresponding fitting for 30-60 seconds after seating it so it doesn’t try to slowly push itself back out before the cement stops it! (Best-bet would be watching a simple how-to video on cementing plastic pipe if you’re a visual learner!)

 

[DmitryB]

Ok did a quick search and that gate valve (!!) needs to be closed to raise the level of water in the overflow.

You close it partially, just enough to make the drains silent! You do not want to completely close it!

IM says to just hand-tighten the bulkheads and insert the PVC pipes without force. But... maybe it actually needs some kind of adhesive?

Oh wow! Yeah… you should be cementing pipe into fittings… you can technically form a seal without cement, but it isn’t going to be a robust seal, and nobody likes random leaky plumbing!

I’ve got not clue if IM uses PVC, or CPVC plastic for the pipe and fittings, so my recommendation here would be “all purpose” pipe cement!

— just make sure you’ve got all your plumbing where you like it, and note that pipes will easily slip into fittings all the way to the fitting’s shoulders after cement is applied (spin 1/4 turn while seating pipe)… you’ve only got a few minutes of work time before the cement begins to really solidify, so do your fittings one-by one, ideally holding the pipe into the corresponding fitting for 30-60 seconds after seating it so it doesn’t try to slowly push itself back out before the cement stops it! (Best-bet would be watching a simple how-to video on cementing plastic pipe if you’re a visual learner!)

Yeah the leaks are gnarly! IM says no adhesive necessary (and their instruction video reflects that) but I'm not gonna listen to that. I should use it on both the bulkheads before screwing them and the pipes going into the bulkheads?

IM uses Sched 80 PVC.

Gonna empty the tank tomorrow, seal the connections. And then just pour water into the overflow to make sure it's not leaking. I don't think I can do another 170 + sump fill of fresh water!

Here's the double leak video

 

[RoanokeReef]

Looks like its leaking from the bulkheads. You shouldn't use cement on them. IM stuff is already glued so no need. Check the gaskets on the bulkhead and don't over tighten them.

 

[Marco_99]

Yeah the leaks are gnarly! IM says no adhesive necessary (and their instruction video reflects that) but I'm not gonna listen to that. I should use it on both the bulkheads before screwing them and the pipes going into the bulkheads?

IM uses Sched 80 PVC.

Gonna empty the tank tomorrow, seal the connections. And then just pour water into the overflow to make sure it's not leaking. I don't think I can do another 170 + sump fill of fresh water!

Here's the double leak video

What they are probably referring to is where the bulkhead gaskets meets the glass or meets the acrylic on your overflow box. You do not glue or put any sealant on the gasket surfaces itself. Where your hard pipe connects into the bulkhead it needs to be glued. The bulkhead’s tend to be a different plastic than sch 80 pvc ,and like UncommonSense said that tends to be an “all purpose cement” scenario glueing the two plastics together, as the bulkheads are usually an ABS plastic. Another note is to check your pipes in the sump and make sure they’re 1 inch to 1 1/2 inches below the waterline this ensures a quiet & functional water flow. If they tend to be longer than that, it creates too much pressure resistance, and your flow doesn’t quite come out of the overflow box like it should.. if they are shorter than that, you might get a water noise. There is that sweet spot for function and dead silence.

 

[Privateye]

No adhesive is needed for bulkheads - the gasket (which goes on the side containing the water) should do the work for you.

Hand tight may be enough, but you also may need a little more force. It kind of depends on the bulkhead they're using. Usually when you get an overflow kit for a drilled tank (which has two pipes and bulkheads for drain and return) it comes with a little wrench you use to tighten the bulkheads. When I get into bigger ones like 4-6" I use channel locks. Hand tight is kind of a relative term since we have different hand strengths. They just don't want you to damage something by over-tightening it.

Chances are you just need a little more force, but you do want to be careful. If it gives you a lot of resistance, stop.

Since it's a new tank this probably isn't the issue, but if there's sand around where that gasket should go then that can cause a bulkhead leak too.

 

[vittpsu21]

I used their pre-plumb also, just make sure the o rings are in place, I did have a leak at the bulkheads that took me a bit to fix but eventually I got it. Just had to take a part and re put it together a few times to get it to work

 

[DmitryB]

Thanks all! So no cement on the bulkheads. (Any value in teflon tape?)

And yes cement on the pipe itself going into the bulkhead inside the overflow.

 

[RoanokeReef]

Thanks all! So no cement on the bulkheads. (Any value in teflon tape?)

And yes cement on the pipe itself going into the bulkhead inside the overflow.

Confused what you mean in the bold.

To the point, you don't need to use any cement on their pipping. I also wouldn't use Teflon as it's not needed.

 

[Daasmo]

My IM required no cement or teflon tape. I did have a leak on the return bulkheads but that was because I didn't have them tight enough. If they are hand tight and still leaking I would double check that your O ring is seated properly. I keep my overflow water level just below the secondary drain. Small turns on the gate valve, wait a minute, and then keep adjusting until it's quiet.

 

[DmitryB]

Confused what you mean in the bold.

To the point, you don't need to use any cement on their pipping. I also wouldn't use Teflon as it's not needed.

The PVC going into the bulkheads inside the overflow as in the image below: use cement on those? IM seems to say not necessary anywhere. (But they also say Gate Valve not included and it was installed!)

 

[RoanokeReef]

Their plumbing is preglued so no need to use cement.

 

[Saltyreef]

The PVC going into the bulkheads inside the overflow as in the image below: use cement on those? IM seems to say not necessary anywhere. (But they also say Gate Valve not included and it was installed!)

I assume you already watched this video?

 

[DmitryB]

I assume you already watched this video?

Multiple times. She seems very blasé!

 

[Saltyreef]

I think once you get your bulkheads tightened correctly you should be leak free. I doesnt seem, from what i skimmed, you have any other leaks?