Macna raffle FAIL

[Brew12]

When did raffle tickets become more about winning the prizes than supporting the cause? If you want to support Macna, buy raffle tickets. If you want to buy an Apex, save the money to buy one.
If people only supported raffles because they actually expected to win, raffles wouldn't work. Am I really the only one that has purchased raffle tickets for little league baseball teams without knowing or caring what the prizes were? I sure hope not. Maybe our society has gotten more selfish than I would like to believe. What ever happened to the days when raffle tickets were basically considered a donation with a fun chance to win a prize?

 

[Tristren]

When did raffle tickets become more about winning the prizes than supporting the cause? If you want to support Macna, buy raffle tickets. If you want to buy an Apex, save the money to buy one.
If people only supported raffles because they actually expected to win, raffles wouldn't work. Am I really the only one that has purchased raffle tickets for little league baseball teams without knowing or caring what the prizes were? I sure hope not. Maybe our society has gotten more selfish than I would like to believe. What ever happened to the days when raffle tickets were basically considered a donation with a fun chance to win a prize?

I'd say that sums it up nicely.

 

[jdl513]

A raffle for volunteers only makes sense to me. Put all the items out on the floor for all to see with notice that the only way to participate is through volunteering.

Draw publicly and make a big deal out it so the attendees can express their appreciation for the volunteers efforts.

When it comes to the vendors i suspect they would want their name associated with this and as an added bonus encourage more people to step up and volunteer.

 

[Brew12]

A raffle for volunteers only makes sense to me. Put all the items out on the floor for all to see with notice that the only way to participate is through volunteering.

Draw publicly and make a big deal out it so the attendees can express their appreciation for the volunteers efforts.

When it comes to the vendors i suspect they would want their name associated with this and as an added bonus encourage more people to step up and volunteer.

I guess I fail to see what the difference is between donating time in exchange for tickets or donating money in exchange for tickets. Both have value.

 

[davejep]

I said I wouldn’t post. But here I go

How would you feel if I started a reef2reef lottery and got everyone in here to send me a big chunk of cash.
After the draw my brother was the one to walk away with the win because of the thousands of free tickets I gave him for helping me run the lottery. Would leave a bad taste in your mouth as well. It’s not about the actual prize or the money spent on tickets, it’s about feeling taken advantage of.

 

[rcpalmer1]

The problem is some people are gamblers and some are not. They see the same thing different.

I took off work the last two years and volunteered to help a vendor at RAP. I did not receive nor would I ever expected to get a free raffle ticket. I did get other things like frags and free entry but not even close to what I would had made at work. But volunteering is about the joy of volunteering. So I dont see anything wrong with volunteers getting freebies.

I am a gambler. I even worked at a casino for 7 years. Odds of winning are based on the number of tickets. A gambler expects their odds to be based on tickets they purchase devided by total number of tickets purchased.

A raffle where all tickets are free is fair. A raffle where all tickets are paid for is fair. I am not sure how to label it but a raffle where people pay for tickets then find out thousands were given away for free is wrong. I can understand people calling it cheating. It is not that they hid a ticket to pull out for a winner but that by adding in the free tickets reduced the odds of winning to the people who purchased tickets. Thus cheating them out of odds of winning.

In my state there are some strict rules for raffles. A civic club I belonged to wanted to raffle off a car. I was on the committee and had several conversation with the states attorney about setting up a raffle. This was several years ago but the in my state at that time this would not of been legal. I do not know what the laws are now and this is a different state. I am in no way saying this was not legal. I will say it was at least shady and would had felt wronged had I been there.

As far as volunteers winning prizes I bought several hundred dollars worth of tickets each day at both of the RAP I volunteered at and won something every day. 2017 I won the grand prize. I did not feel it was wrong as I had paid just like everyone else. It has been estimated between 50 to 100 people were given tickets. So if 50 people work 5 hours a day for 3 days that would be 9000 extra tickets.

If they kept records like it has been said they know how many tickets were sold and how many given away. They should release the numbers. If it was only a small number then it really didn't effect the odds much and some volunteers got lucky. Or they can just not care and by next year enough people will have forgotten they will sell plenty of tickets.

 

[jdl513]

I guess I fail to see what the difference is between donating time in exchange for tickets or donating money in exchange for tickets. Both have value.

True but this option doesn't dilute the value of the other. Separating would also increase the value of the volunteer only raffle entries.

The goal of a raffle is to maximize participation whether that is through someone's time or someone's wallet.

However that is done.

 

[Brew12]

I said I wouldn’t post. But here I go

How would you feel if I started a reef2reef lottery and got everyone in here to send me a big chunk of cash.
After the draw my brother was the one to walk away with the win because of the thousands of free tickets I gave him for helping me run the lottery. Would leave a bad taste in your mouth as well. It’s not about the actual prize or the money spent on tickets, it’s about feeling taken advantage of.

If you think MACNA cheated during the drawings, that is a different accusation. If you want to make recommendations on how they can change it so you feel they didn't cheat, I'm sure they would listen.

R2R does do a fund raiser at Christmas every year that is supported by a raffle. Most of the winners are R2R paying supporters, Mods, and/or Reef Squad members. That doesn't mean that there is cheating going on.

 

[Brew12]

I am a gambler. I even worked at a casino for 7 years. Odds of winning are based on the number of tickets. A gambler expects their odds to be based on tickets they purchase devided by total number of tickets purchased.

Most gamblers I know pay very close attention to odds. They know exactly what the odds are for each game and how those odds change during the course of the game.
In a raffle, the odds are continuously changing based on very arbitrary factors. It may fuel a gambling "itch" but I don't think too many people would support your statement that a raffle is good for serious gamblers. It would be like black jack where the dealer could arbitrarily swap out your bottom card after you made your bet. Would some people play? Sure. Would "gamblers"? I doubt it.

A raffle where all tickets are free is fair. A raffle where all tickets are paid for is fair. I am not sure how to label it but a raffle where people pay for tickets then find out thousands were given away for free is wrong.

So if we stopped calling them volunteers and stated we were going to pay the workers with voucher that could only be redeemed for raffle tickets, everything would be fine? That way no one gets any tickets for free and we don't have volunteers getting stuff for working.

Seems very cosmetic to me, but I'm sure MASNA would consider it if you think it would improve things.

 

[Usol]

I don’t know if stacks of tickets should be given out. But I think it’s reasonable to have their time compensated in some way. They couldn’t run such an alazing event without people donating their time.
Perhaps 3 sheets of tickets and early access to vendors would be more reasonable?

I disagree, they are "volunteering" they are soing it for there local club aswell as there love for the hobby..if the local club wants to xompensate they are MORE then able to spend some hard earned cash on purchasing a gift for each one

 

[BZOFIQ]

and the Raffle-Gate continues.

Here is my take. I volunteer at the Brooklyn Aquarium Society along a dozen + others to setup events on monthly basis.

Besides attending board meeting on monthly basis (full disclosure: I dont show up every single month), volunteers setup, operate and take down the show every month (except summer months) Most work from about 6 to well past midnight those fridays. The people who do this work volunteer their time in full capacity of the word every month. Some take off from work to do additional work beyond those hours, they go around to pickup store donations, pickup stuff from storage etc., - ALL WITHOUT COMPENSATION. People volunteer because they want to, everything else falls under compensated employment.

We do raffles too, nobody, not board members, not other volunteers get free tickets. There is one free ticket given to most attendees for goodie bags; I never even take these because I dont care for it. When drawing, the can is vigorously shaken before each ticket is drawn by a random member from the audience. We usually pick kids to pull the ticket, to encourage participation and because they are 100% not into any "fixing".

I know its hard to get volunteers to do all the work, but let's not forget what it means to volunteer.

 

[Devisissy]

Volunteers should not be able to participate. I volunteer for a lot of gaming conventions. We volunteer to meet people we admire, get to see the new stuff before everyone else, sometimes meet some famous people and the awesome swag bag. We are not allowed to play the raffles or enter the individual booths contests. If you're caught, which has happened, you're asked to leave and not invited back. The swag bag is awesome and more than enough for our efforts. This is a high end company that runs this event though and Macna isn't at their level, yet. So I completely under stand Op. I'd be ticked too.

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[Opus]

I just want to know if the people that won are going to report it to the IRS and pay their taxes on it.

 

[Devisissy]

I just want to know if the people that won are going to report it to the IRS and pay their taxes on it.

Depending on your state will determine if you have to report. My state it's anything valued over 1200.

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[Opus]

Depending on your state will determine if you have to report. My state it's anything valued over 1200.

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The state has nothing to do with the IRS. You are talking about state income tax.

 

[Victoria M]

Raffles are a gamble. Not an investment. Spending serious money hoping to win amazing somethings and then being mad you didn't win. Maybe there was cheating...I do not know. People are amazing and can do awful things. Raffles are meant to be a cheap thrill. I would rather spend $100 bucks on a sure thing than spend $50 on an off chance I might win. I throw $20 bucks at a good cause and enjoy seeing folks win.

 

[Devisissy]

The state has nothing to do with the IRS. You are talking about state income tax.

Then if it's not by state then it's 1200 you must claim. Just Googled. Apparently it's over 600. Sheesh. Greedy gov.

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[Victoria M]

I said I wouldn’t post. But here I go

How would you feel if I started a reef2reef lottery and got everyone in here to send me a big chunk of cash.
After the draw my brother was the one to walk away with the win because of the thousands of free tickets I gave him for helping me run the lottery. Would leave a bad taste in your mouth as well. It’s not about the actual prize or the money spent on tickets, it’s about feeling taken advantage of.

I can see that one would feel taken advantage of if this was their perspective. If you kept it a secret that you were giving your brother X number of lottery tickets then it would be deceitful. However it appears that most folks know that volunteers are given x number of tickets per hours volunteered. It also seems that many folks did not know this and felt duped. If left up to chance most people cheer on the winners, while nursing the sting of disappointment with good nature when we did not win. BUT If somethings looks janky and triggers our spidey sense then it offends our sense of right and wrong and fairness.

 

[Devisissy]

I can see that one would feel taken advantage of if this was their perspective. If you kept it a secret that you were giving your brother X number of lottery tickets then it would be deceitful. However it appears that most folks know that volunteers are given x number of tickets per hours volunteered. It also seems that many folks did not know this and felt duped. If left up to chance most people cheer on the winners, while nursing the sting of disappointment with good nature when we did not win. BUT If somethings looks janky and triggers our spidey sense then it offends our sense of right and wrong and fairness.

Wow that's sort of bad of them.

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[Victoria M]

Wow that's sort of bad of them.

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That was a hypthetical situation someone was using to demonstrate their perspective. That did not actually happen.