Negative criticism on vendors

[B-ridge]

I understand vendors pay a fee to be able to conduct there business here, but ultimately it’s us the community that makes up reefs2reefs. They pay a fee and offer deals to get is the consumers and hobbyist attention so we would purchase from them.
Now my issue with this is all feedback whether positive or negative should be warranted. I feel vendors shouldn’t have the control to delete posts as there discretion. Also when one is commenting on a vendor outside posts/comments should be allowed. As a community we have a right to know what’s been done good or bad. Why can’t I agree with a fellow hobbyist if I feel he or she’s been done wrong? Why can’t I agree with a vendor if I feel a hobbyist is wrong? As a vendor I would welcome all comments. Good and bad. Any publicity bad or good is good for business. I would want people to see and comment that way I could change certain things if it’s warranted and show the community I’m trying to do what’s best for the community.
Not sure if I’m overreacting which some will probably say I am and I welcome that. That’s what makes us a community and we grow stronger. Positive and negative input.
Just me thinking out loud after a couple of injustices I feel we’re done to myself and some fellow reefers in the past and recently. I would suggest since vendors wanna delete posts that the person or persons should just take it yonwjrh the better business bureau. That way they can’t delete that and everyone see it.
Can’t wait to hear the responses back from the community. I can see this possibly getting a little hostile so let’s keep this as peaceful and civilized as we can.

 

[DSC reef]

Vendors can't delete members posts. You can like the post on feedback so that is being able to agree with a member good or bad. The rules have been this way for a long time, vendor feedback is between the OP and vendor. If you feel that "injustices" have been dealt to you then PM a mod.

 

[hbrochs]

I agree completely. Factual complaints should have a place to be heard. Ideally there should be some effort to come to mutually agreeable solution before one drags it into the public. I always prefer to have the opportunity to make things right in my business before someone posts a critical review. I’ve also been victim of completely unfounded bad reviews that can be very frustrating. In the end, vendors that have good practices will have overwhelming positive reviews and a couple bad reviews will be seen as outliers.

 

[GoldeneyeRet]

I agree. Unfortunately I have come to realize r2r is not a place to research vendors or products as the feedback is biased.

It is important to realize, however, this is a private venue and advertising is the name of the game. Site owners are allowed to make the rules whether users like them or not.

 

[DSC reef]

How is it biased? You can post any feedback in the correct section good or bad?? @GoldeneyeRet are you saying that R2R protects the vendors?

 

[Crabs McJones]

Vendors do not have the ability to remove posts. And positive feedback everyone is welcome to engage in the conversation. Negative feedback threads do not allow outside comments. This is so the vendor and the consumer have a chance to state their cases and hopefully come to a resolution that they are both happy with without one or the other having to go through pages of comments. Users are more than welcome to post a link to their own feedback thread in regards to the same vendor however :) And feedback threads are never removed. Hope this helps clear up some stuff :)

 

[HB AL]

Vendors can't delete members posts. You can like the post on feedback so that is being able to agree with a member good or bad. The rules have been this way for a long time, vendor feedback is between the OP and vendor. If you feel that "injustices" have been dealt to you the PM a mod.

Ya, I didn’t think vendors could delete members posts either. Maybe the op had some post removed by a moderator, which is what moderators are there to do if things are not appropriate.

 

[DSC reef]

Ya, I didn’t think vendors could delete members posts either. Maybe the op had some post removed by a moderator, which is what moderators are there to do if things are not appropriate.

He's most likely referring to not being able to post in another members feedback thread which is against the rules. He's free to post his own feedback.

 

[TheEngineer]

I’d also like to add that sponsors have been removed from R2R in the past when they’re clearly bad actors. Not naming names but it rhymes with Beef Dudes.

Also, if you have a negative experience also you should start a thread of your own to talk about it. There’s also a review section where you can rate vendors, even those that aren’t sponsors.

 

[kschweer]

Vendors do not have the ability to remove posts. And positive feedback everyone is welcome to engage in the conversation. Negative feedback threads do not allow outside comments. This is so the vendor and the consumer have a chance to state their cases and hopefully come to a resolution that they are both happy with without one or the other having to go through pages of comments. Users are more than welcome to post a link to their own feedback thread in regards to the same vendor however :) And feedback threads are never removed. Hope this helps clear up some stuff :)

I understand vendors pay a fee to be able to conduct there business here, but ultimately it’s us the community that makes up reefs2reefs. They pay a fee and offer deals to get is the consumers and hobbyist attention so we would purchase from them.
Now my issue with this is all feedback whether positive or negative should be warranted. I feel vendors shouldn’t have the control to delete posts as there discretion. Also when one is commenting on a vendor outside posts/comments should be allowed. As a community we have a right to know what’s been done good or bad. Why can’t I agree with a fellow hobbyist if I feel he or she’s been done wrong? Why can’t I agree with a vendor if I feel a hobbyist is wrong? As a vendor I would welcome all comments. Good and bad. Any publicity bad or good is good for business. I would want people to see and comment that way I could change certain things if it’s warranted and show the community I’m trying to do what’s best for the community.
Not sure if I’m overreacting which some will probably say I am and I welcome that. That’s what makes us a community and we grow stronger. Positive and negative input.
Just me thinking out loud after a couple of injustices I feel we’re done to myself and some fellow reefers in the past and recently. I would suggest since vendors wanna delete posts that the person or persons should just take it yonwjrh the better business bureau. That way they can’t delete that and everyone see it.
Can’t wait to hear the responses back from the community. I can see this possibly getting a little hostile so let’s keep this as peaceful and civilized as we can.

May I ask if there is something specific or a specific thread that made you start this thread? As a member of the staff I can tell you that we work very hard to keep the feedback forum on the up and up. Allowing outside comments can hinder a resolution between the two parties and can lead to a mob mentality. We encourage feedback, both positive and negative and as @Crabs Mcjones said please link to feedback threads you have started if it deals with the same vendor. Also just to reiterate, vendors cannot remove any threads or posts.

 

[GoldeneyeRet]

How is it biased? You can post any feedback in the correct section good or bad?? @GoldeneyeRet are you saying that R2R protects the vendors?

I am saying exactly what I said.

R2r is awesome but It is not a good place to get unbiased feedback regarding vendors and products.

No more, no less.

 

[Crabs McJones]

R2R allows both positive and negative feedback. How is it bias? Is there a third option I am unaware of? o_O If that was the case, the synergy feedback should have been removed ;)
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/synergy-reef-shadow-overflow-horrible.480176/
Along with the fishy business aquatics thread
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/fishybusiness-aquatics-are-a-lie.413067/

 

[DSC reef]

I am saying exactly what I said.

R2r is awesome but It is not a good place to get unbiased feedback regarding vendors and products.

No more, no less.

I asked how it is biased as both parties can put in full disclosure in feedback as that's what it's meant for so everyone can see. I can literally look at vendor feedback and make decision because of the rules in place but you say biased? Ok. Agree to disagree.

 

[GoldeneyeRet]

Well this wasn't really about me or my feedback threads. But since yall want examples and you brought upmy thread...

First I have been involved in threads discussing equipment in the appropriate forum. Hundreds of such threads exist. In several of those threads sponsors products have been mentioned and the threads get moved to feedback where all comments are deleted. This is bias since non sponsor threads are left for users to read while negative comments regarding sponsors are deleted under the guise of vendor feedback.

And regarding my feedback thread... I follow the rules but the vendor is not required to. In that thread synergy reef posted all my personal information including address and phone number in his assualt on me. He stated it was done " per crab mcjones" which I believe to be false. I dont believe crabs said that but, that post remains, undeleted. My phone and address was edited out, but my real name remains to this day. Had I violated the rules I expect it would be deleted entirely and I would be reprimanded, and I would deserve that consequence. I feel this is an example of bias, helping a company slander and threaten me.

Furthermore, synegy reef follows me around on threads where I mention his product. He attacks me personally yet nothing is done. I expect if I attacked him, there would be consequences or at least moderation. Alas, he gets neither.

I researched synergy here before buying. The few negative posts led me to believe it was a good product. After having trouble with the product and the company I have been in contact with dozens of people who have had the same issues. All of them have said they felt their negative comments were stifled in some way. R2r is aware of synergys issues and keeps allowing /helping them to scam more users.

For these reasons, I feel r2r is not a good place to find unbiased information.

I also feel r2r has the right to be biased. They are a for profit venture that I assume relies on advertising to survive. I love r2r and feel I gain immensely by being a member. In fact I enjoy r2r so much and gain so much from it, I am now a partner member.

I'm not intending to criticize r2r, I just call em like I see em.

 

[Graffiti Spot]

We don't have a vendor feedback thread on this site where users can post good or bad experiences without getting deleted?

 

[DSC reef]

@GoldeneyeRet like this thread. Hmmm, plenty of discussion going on with out bias.....

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/s...vortech-lack-of-long-term-reliability.508520/

 

[GoldeneyeRet]

We don't have a vendor feedback thread on this site where users can post good or bad experiences without getting deleted?

No, we do not

 

[kschweer]

Well this wasn't really about me or my feedback threads. But since yall want examples and you brought upmy thread...

First I have been involved in threads discussing equipment in the appropriate forum. Hundreds of such threads exist. In several of those threads sponsors products have been mentioned and the threads get moved to feedback where all comments are deleted. This is bias since non sponsor threads are left for users to read while negative comments regarding sponsors are deleted under the guise of vendor feedback.

And regarding my feedback thread... I follow the rules but the vendor is not required to. In that thread synergy reef posted all my personal information including address and phone number in his assualt on me. He stated it was done " per crab mcjones" which I believe to be false. I dont believe crabs said that but, that post remains, undeleted. My phone and address was edited out, but my real name remains to this day. Had I violated the rules I expect it would be deleted entirely and I would be reprimanded, and I would deserve that consequence. I feel this is an example of bias, helping a company slander and threaten me.

Furthermore, synegy reef follows me around on threads where I mention his product. He attacks me personally yet nothing is done. I expect if I attacked him, there would be consequences or at least moderation. Alas, he gets neither.

I researched synergy here before buying. The few negative posts led me to believe it was a good product. After having trouble with the product and the company I have been in contact with dozens of people who have had the same issues. All of them have said they felt their negative comments were stifled in some way. R2r is aware of synergys issues and keeps allowing /helping them to scam more users.

For these reasons, I feel r2r is not a good place to find unbiased information.

I also feel r2r has the right to be biased. They are a for profit venture that I assume relies on advertising to survive. I love r2r and feel I gain immensely by being a member. In fact I enjoy r2r so much and gain so much from it, I am now a partner member.

I'm not intending to criticize r2r, I just call em like I see em.

I’m not going to go back and forth but we allow members to start feedback threads and discuss issues with vendors. In the case you are talking about both sides can’t seem to drop the issue and continue to go out of their way to post in threads throughout the site about the issues. At some point a line needs to be drawn and the issue needs to be chalked up to an unhappy customer and a vendor not happy someone doesn’t like their product. We are all adults and at some point need to move on. No sides have been taken and sometimes the reality is both parties just may not be happy.

 

[kschweer]

I’m not going to go back and forth but we allow members to start feedback threads and discuss issues with vendors. In the case you are talking about both sides can’t seem to drop the issue and continue to go out of their way to post in threads throughout the site about the issues. At some point a line needs to be drawn and the issue needs to be chalked up to an unhappy customer and a vendor not happy someone doesn’t like their product. We are all adults and at some point need to move on. No sides have been taken and sometimes the reality is both parties just may not be happy.

Just to add I looked back and cannot find where your personal info is still posted. I may just be missing it. If it is in fact still there please report the post and I will make sure it’s removed.
@GoldeneyeRet

 

[GoldeneyeRet]

R2R allows both positive and negative feedback. How is it bias? Is there a third option I am unaware of? o_O If that was the case, the synergy feedback should have been removed ;)
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/synergy-reef-shadow-overflow-horrible.480176/
Along with the fishy business aquatics thread
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/fishybusiness-aquatics-are-a-lie.413067/

@kschweer it was not I that brought up synergy reef, it was r2r staff. I have long since moved on. I will continue to give my opinion on that product just as i do the ones i am happy with. The bias here is that i am told to move on when unhappy with a product, but trumpeting praises if others is not an issue.

To the OP, I agree with you.

Due to the extreme level of defensiveness regarding this issue I going to bow out. I thought it could be productive but not.

Happy reefing all, nothing to get chafed over.