OK, I need help-

scouncil · Apr 15, 2009

I have a lot of hair algae and a lot of red slime. I've got a Duncan (my biggest colony that is nearly dead and my hydnopora looks like it's melting from the bottom up. Of course the mushrooms and softies look fine. The acans look ok, sometimes good. The Zoos look fine (except for the ones that have some red slime on them) and the millies look fine. My green slimer is hanging in there, but looks not as good. And Brandon's baby looks good and has a friend (very cute).

pH 8.2
alk 8.5-9 (by my kit which is normal)
nitrates are there, but at the lowest measurable increment (<than whatever)

I'm doing the 3 part system (Ca, Alk, MG from Donny's and I'm using the fancy salt that Donny recommended). Water changes are 20gals every 2 weeks (Zach is taking a sample back to Donny's today).

The red slime is due to phosphates? (I don't have a kit to check for that) and we are running a phos reactor thing in the sump. I'm doing the vodka (thinking about drinking it myself) thing to help with the red slime (or is it the green hair algae). 1T a day. It is marginally better. I bought a copper banded butterfly to eat the aptasia (couldn't catch the wrasse that eats the shrimp), but the purple tang is being mean, so I'm not sure it's going to be a keeper.

Skimmer seems to be working ok as the nitrates aren't that bad (tested before water change today). I was feeding cube mysis alternating between dry food until the copper banded was added (trying to get it to eat) and now just doing mysis. I do DT's every other day- about 6T. I used to do "reef bugs" and the corals seemed to really like it, but stopped thinking that it might be adding to the phos problem?

Any ideas? Do I need a monster big skimmer like Brandon's? What can I do? The tank has never looked worse really. I'm sad.

And no sarcastic remarks please. I'm getting radiation and don't feel that great (though much better than when I was getting chemo) and just don't need the cuts right now. I would appreciate the help.
Susan

AlexStinson · Apr 15, 2009

I'll give your water the best once over I can when zack gets back.

scouncil · Apr 15, 2009

Thanks Alex, if it is phosphates, where are they coming from? Does a skimmer take out phosphates, or just an absorbing medium? Post and let me know what you find.

AlexStinson · Apr 15, 2009

your phosphates are ginormous... yes I had to make up a word for them. Yes a skimmer kind of pulls it out, it pulls out the organics before they break down. Phosphate media is much more efficient, and hopefully your vodka dosing it lowering it as well. I'm getting a reading now after about 60 seconds (I usually give it a 3 minute test) of 1.0mg/l. Just chillax and see if it is improving or not in a week. I'll tell zack we need to get you some new GFO running in the system.

If anyone can add anything please do, I am sure there is something I am wrong about.

p.s. if you decide to drink the vodka instead give me a call.

acronautical · Apr 15, 2009

Stop feeding the tank, period, for about two months. Trap out any fish that you can and give them new homes. It will still take a LONG time to balance this problem out, naturally, by letting the tank establish a balance.

scouncil · Apr 15, 2009

I'd have to tear the whole tank down to get the fish out, and my fish are big. Not to many tanks around here that would want them and the only tanks that could handle them, I know wouldn't want them......

And Alex, it's a big bottle. I could spare some. I would go for the Amaretto....
Susan

scouncil · Apr 15, 2009

What am I doing different, or has this been a gradual build up over a year or some longer period of time?

sleeper · Apr 15, 2009

I dosed chemi-clean and it cleared up my cyano in about 4 days, this wont fix your phos problem but I would definatly cut back on all the frozen mysis. The shrimp will add alot of phosphates to your water as the uneaten food breaks down. Also, you might want to do weekly water changes until you figure something out. Again, this will not solve your problem but It would serve as a band-aid until you find a solution. Hang in there.

Sikryd · Apr 15, 2009

You don't have to tear your reef apart to get them out. Just drain it and refill it. I have 150g stock tank and can drain and refill mine in about 30min. Sometimes its the only way if the fish are too big for the tank.

AlexStinson · Apr 16, 2009

Yeah, i'd rather find a solution that doesn't involve less fish for you. And phosphates may not even be the problem. Unfortunatly I didnt get a chance to check out the corals before we dipped them, but I dont know of any pest that would effect the lps preferentially.

scouncil · Apr 16, 2009

I don't think the fish are too big for the tank and I don't have that many fish (had an ich outbreak about 6-8 months ago and just haven't really added any for a while). I guess I just overfeed.

And Zach is right. The hair algae is getting better with the vodka. Is flake food less phosphates, or just food in general. I should just feed much less. My problem is making sure the smaller fish GET food. I've got 2 larger tangs that eat like pigs, but i'm sure I overfeed. I just kept checking the nitrates and they've been low. I don't even have a phosphate tester kit.

So, weekly water changes (10% weekly or more?), feed much less, get a phosphate test kit (which one is easiest to read?) and keep running a phos absorbant medium. what else?

Sikryd · Apr 16, 2009

I overfeed too, but have a big skimmer to compensate.

That regimen looks good to keep it in check.

Paul_N · Apr 16, 2009

When I went from a FOWLR to a reef, I had Nitrates and Phosphates just coming out of the LR. I would do a 50% water change and the levels would drop drastically and then go back up in a day or two. If it is the phosphates then GFO would be your best bet with large (20%) weekly water changes along with reduced feedings. If your phosphates are indeed that high then you should switch out the GFO weekly also because there is a saturation point with it.

Vodka dosing (yourself and the tank..:wink:) should help with the process also. It will not be a quick process, just be patient.

Good Luck!

fsu1dolfan · Apr 16, 2009

I just wanted to share some of my advice....granted my tank is almost the size of your water changes LOL but my parameters have been rock solid for at least a year and by no means what works for me will work for you but the more input the better, right?
I have chemi-pure elite (which helps control phosphates) and purigen; these two alone help eliminate the need for carbon...small catch with filter floss to get excess debris in water and small protein skimmer....also macros in display tank and refuge (macros love to absorb phosphates).

I had my bout with red slime a couple of times and both times i used Maracyn (http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=4838) don't use the plus version!! When i dosed it i always went under the desired dose...you will hear pros and cons to using this product and while i was nervous using it my red slime was wiped out...then i got a good clean up crew and red slime has never returned!! The major con that i read about was that maracyn tends to wipe out you good bio load...meaning if you use to much you could throw your tank back into a cycle....but by too much you would have to decently overdose the tank! i would always do half the recommended dose, wait two days, and dose again if nescessary....then a 25% water change once dosing is done...This is an extremely quicker way to go but usually seen as a last resort option by some, personally i think its amazing stuff....If anyone else has experience with Maracyn please chime in...i have had nothing but good results

Hope it all works out for you.

scouncil · Apr 16, 2009

50% water change? Can't there be problems with doing that too? Or probably less problems than i'm having now. I'm gonna need help for the 50% water change.... How big is Donny's travelling tank? I don't even have anything that will hold that much water (though i guess i could go out and buy a couple more garbage cans). My tank is a 200 gal with a 75 gal sump/refuge that is maybe running at half that volume at any given time. Should I move any corals out while I'm trying to get the levels down. What is sensitive to high phosphates? My poor tank.....

Should I do the chemipure and then the big waterchange?

sleeper · Apr 16, 2009

I think that would be good but I'm only a year into this hobby. IME the best thing I ever did was to go to weekly 10% water changes. My tank has been the most stable since I made this change. I was doing them every other week and it really did make a huge difference. Plus you don't have to lug around all that much water if you do them more frequently. (just have to drive down to east right weekly unless you have an RODI). I would maybe go ahead and do a water change now and then start and a routine every weekend. Ask Donny or Alex about the chem-pure for the red slime but it worked very well for me.

ironman · Apr 16, 2009

Ok Susan, sorry I missed this thread yesterday. And sorrry I havent been able to make it over there.

There are alot of issues here.
1- stop dosing the Dts, or at least only dose alittle once a week. But till the phosphates are down I would stop all together.
2. Stop feeding flake foods for now. Very high ash content is bad right now.
3. feed frozen foods like mysis and brine, but thaw first and do not add the liquid that they are packed in. strain them through a fish net or something similiar to seperate them. that liquid is high in nutrients.
4. You really need to consider a bigger skimmer if you choose to keep the size fish you have and the amount of coral you have. you simply cant skim enough to compensate for all the food and poop that is being produced. However I dont think brandons is the answer, just something bigger.
5. DO NOT take your fish out, and dont do insane water changes. If you can change 50 gallons of water each weekend that would be better. Yes bigger water changes is the answer. but to big will stress everything and cause worse problems than you already have.

bottom line be careful what you are feeding for awhile, fish can live quite well for periods of time with less food. Do large water changes on a regular basis till water stabilizes. start planning a new sump system that will incorperate a bigger skimmer or plan to down grade the amount of bio load in the tank.

scouncil · Apr 16, 2009

Bio load being fish, not corals, right? I need a bigger skimmer. I can probably handle 50 gallons a weekend. Have to get another garbage can to run the RODI into. Or maybe I have enough buckets to make up the 50 gallons..... The trash can that my RODI runs into is about 33 gallons, I think. What size skimmer? It will have to be plumbed to run outside the sump since I don't have room for a bigger skimmer inside the sump. And Brandon's skimmer is so pretty!!!

ironman · Apr 16, 2009

If you want to spend $1200 on a skimmer it will help, But honestly it would be way overkill, but they do make a smaller one just like it. And actually your coral are also bio load. anything that is living in your tank is bio load. I have a couple 20 gallon tubs but david is borrowing them at the moment. I have a 30 gallon tank that might work to help. I would give you my 44 gallon brute but then I would be unable to change my water.