Ruby Rally in DT

[Gabbone]

Hi,

I suspect my two clownfish have gill flukes and I finally bought Ruby Rally from a European Supplier.

All the symptoms are there but above all: fast breathing, head shake and frequent "yawn". Besides that, they eat a lot, swim not erratic, and their response is active to stimulus. The whole symptoms started a couple of weeks ago and in the last days seems to be more frequent. However, they look very very healthy overall. My other wrasses and royal gamma are fine. No symptoms are present.

Keep in mind that my tank is well oxigenated, surface agitation, skimmer on and the fish are not gasping for air at the surface or swimming close to the surface in need for air.

I decided to treat my 30G AIO Display Tank with Ruby Rally for 3 days. I do not have a QT. They say it's totally reef safe for corals, inverters, fish, algae etc. I also have a BTA.

How to use RALLY ™?
Turn off protein skimmers and UV sterilizers, also remove carbon filtration and any absorbent media that would remove RALLY ™ from the water. Dose on days 1, 2, and 3 for normal infections. For severe infection further dosing may be required. Add one ounce of RALLY ™ per 10 gallons of total water volume including the filtration system for reef tanks.

I would like to know if the protein skimmer needs to be OFF for 3 days straight. And if you have any other recommendation I'll be very happy.

This is the product:

Thank you!

 

[MnFish1]

Hi,

I suspect my two clownfish have gill flukes and I finally bought Ruby Rally from a European Supplier.

All the symptoms are there but above all: fast breathing, head shake and frequent "yawn". Besides that, they eat a lot, swim not erratic, and their response is active to stimulus. The whole symptoms started a couple of weeks ago and in the last days seems to be more frequent. However, they look very very healthy overall. My other wrasses and royal gamma are fine. No symptoms are present.

Keep in mind that my tank is well oxigenated, surface agitation, skimmer on and the fish are not gasping for air at the surface or swimming close to the surface in need for air.

I decided to treat my 30G AIO Display Tank with Ruby Rally for 3 days. I do not have a QT. They say it's totally reef safe for corals, inverters, fish, algae etc. I also have a BTA.

How to use RALLY ™?
Turn off protein skimmers and UV sterilizers, also remove carbon filtration and any absorbent media that would remove RALLY ™ from the water. Dose on days 1, 2, and 3 for normal infections. For severe infection further dosing may be required. Add one ounce of RALLY ™ per 10 gallons of total water volume including the filtration system for reef tanks.

I would like to know if the protein skimmer needs to be OFF for 3 days straight. And if you have any other recommendation I'll be very happy.

This is the product:

Thank you!

I would generally recommend prazipro/praziquantel for flukes. However, if you want to use rally pro -here are the instructions:

Rally PRO DIRECTIONS FOR USE:​

STEP 1:
Turn off protein skimmer and UV sterilizer. Remove carbon filtration or any absorbent media. (phosphate absorbents are okay)

STEP 2:
Determine the total water volume including filtration system.

STEP 3:
FRESHWATER: Add 1 ounce (30 ml) of Rally™ PRO per 10 gallons (38 liters) of total water volume. If the pH is above 8.0, add 1 ounce (30 ml) per 20 gallons (76 liters) of total water volume.
SALTWATER: Add 1 ounce (30 ml) of Rally™ PRO per 20 gallons (76 liters) of total water volume.

So for saltwater the recommendations of 30 ml per 20 gallons as compared to freshwater. The skimmer should be off - though many people just stop collecting skim mate when using prazipro rather than turning the skimmer completely off. I'm not sure whether Ruby Rally will act in the same manner - you could check with the company or perhaps someone else will answer. In any case if you do turn off your skimmer, I would add an airstone. this is one of the reasons its recommended that the product be used in a hospital tank (though supposedly safe for Display tank use.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi,

I suspect my two clownfish have gill flukes and I finally bought Ruby Rally from a European Supplier.

All the symptoms are there but above all: fast breathing, head shake and frequent "yawn". Besides that, they eat a lot, swim not erratic, and their response is active to stimulus. The whole symptoms started a couple of weeks ago and in the last days seems to be more frequent. However, they look very very healthy overall. My other wrasses and royal gamma are fine. No symptoms are present.

Keep in mind that my tank is well oxigenated, surface agitation, skimmer on and the fish are not gasping for air at the surface or swimming close to the surface in need for air.

I decided to treat my 30G AIO Display Tank with Ruby Rally for 3 days. I do not have a QT. They say it's totally reef safe for corals, inverters, fish, algae etc. I also have a BTA.

How to use RALLY ™?
Turn off protein skimmers and UV sterilizers, also remove carbon filtration and any absorbent media that would remove RALLY ™ from the water. Dose on days 1, 2, and 3 for normal infections. For severe infection further dosing may be required. Add one ounce of RALLY ™ per 10 gallons of total water volume including the filtration system for reef tanks.

I would like to know if the protein skimmer needs to be OFF for 3 days straight. And if you have any other recommendation I'll be very happy.

This is the product:

Thank you!

This is ruby rally, a weaker solution and yes you CAN run skimmer, just take the collection cup off. I dont agree with their direction and recommend addition of 1oz per 25 gallons and has always been effective at this solution once a day for the first 3-5 days then evey other day for 10 day period

 

[threebuoys]

In the U.S., Rally has been replaced by Rally Pro. The formulation of Rally Pro has been modified to eliminate formalin as an ingredient. You may want to check the date on your bottle, and perhaps contact the company to determine what ingredients are in the European version.

@MnFish1 shared the instructions for the Pro version. The switch over in the U.S. occurred several years ago. I'm not sure what the instructions were for the original. As he stated, our go-to product for flukes is praziquantel if you can get it.

 

[MnFish1]

This is ruby rally, a weaker solution and yes you CAN run skimmer, just take the collection cup off. I dont agree with their direction and recommend addition of 1oz per 25 gallons and has always been effective at this solution once a day for the first 3-5 days then evey other day for 10 day period

Just so we're all on the same page - the directions for Ruby Rally Pro (which is more concentrated) for saltwater is 1 oz/20 gallons, and for the less concentrated Ruby Rally , the directions for saltwater say 1oz/10 gallons. Is part of the reason you like the lower dose because of adjustment for tank volume or toxicity potential, etc? Or is it just that 1 oz/25 gallons is just as effective when you've used it? I just wanted to know the rationale why not follow the directions on the bottle.

 

[Gabbone]

Hi guys and thanks for answering;

The Rally I've found here its not the PRO version;

How to use RALLY ™?

Turn off protein skimmers and UV sterilizers, also remove carbon filtration and any absorbent media that would remove RALLY ™ from the water. Dose on days 1, 2, and 3 for normal infections. For severe infection further dosing may be required. Add one ounce of RALLY ™ per 10 gallons of total water volume including the filtration system for reef tanks.

Ingredients:
The RALLY ™ Science

The RALLY ™ label lists three active ingredients: acriflavine, aminoacridine and formalin that have been proven effective in parasite control in aquaculture operations and tropical fish farms. Virtually all hobby aficionados are familiar with formalin, most are probably at least aware of acriflavine, and the pharmaceutically well informed probably know about aminoacridine. However, scant few truly understand the chemical structure and properties of these compounds, and fewer still the molecular mechanisms whereby they impart their biological effects. Consequently, almost no one knows or understands why RALLY ™ is more effective than the sum of its parts: the simultaneous but independent addition of acriflavine, aminoacridine and formalin in amounts comparable to a dose of RALLY ™ will not have as great or as enduring an effect as RALLY ™. Why?

The reagents in RALLY ™ are sequentially blended by an empirically refined methat that provides for minor but important chemical modifications of acriflavine and aminoacridine by formalin. The formalin is combined with acriflavine and aminoacridine in a controlled chemical reaction that reduces the concentration necessary for disease control by over ten fold. By way of analogy, the formalin modified acriflavine and aminoacridine molecules can be thought of as sea urchins whose spines secrete an ultra super-glue: when the urchins enter the molecular domains where they are active, the spines secrete the glue, and the urchins are permanently bound within the domain where they impart their effect. Normally, acriflavine and aminoacridine passively migrate into and out of (or are expelled from) the pertinent molecular domains, necessitating the continual presence of high concentrations to obtain the desired effect. The formalin modified acriflavine and aminoacridine migrate into their active domains and, because of the formalin modification, never migrate out and cannot be expelled. Consequently, they are effective as a water treatment at controlling a variety of tropical aquarium diseases at very low dosages that have no harmful effects on biofiltration or any other fish or living organisms in a reef, marine or freshwater aquarium.

The end result is that RALLY ™ is an extremely effective water treatment for the control of many external parasites including dinoflagellates (e.g., marine velvet, clownfish disease), flukes and gram-negative bacterial (e.g., bacterial fin/tail rot, superficial sepsis, etc.). RALLY ™ is, at best, marginally effective against l. multifiliis and C. irritans, but extremely useful in preventing the secondary bacterial infections that often accompany severe ich infestations. RALLY ™ is not harmful to fish, invertebrates, corals, etc., nor does it affect the symbiotic algae vital to corals or other beneficial bacteria. Beta site tests in shops around the United States have shown the combined use of RALLY ™ and KICK-ICH™ are not harmful to fish, invertebrates, corals or biological filtration.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi guys and thanks for answering;

The Rally I've found here its not the PRO version;

How to use RALLY ™?

Turn off protein skimmers and UV sterilizers, also remove carbon filtration and any absorbent media that would remove RALLY ™ from the water. Dose on days 1, 2, and 3 for normal infections. For severe infection further dosing may be required. Add one ounce of RALLY ™ per 10 gallons of total water volume including the filtration system for reef tanks.

Ingredients:
The RALLY ™ Science

The RALLY ™ label lists three active ingredients: acriflavine, aminoacridine and formalin that have been proven effective in parasite control in aquaculture operations and tropical fish farms. Virtually all hobby aficionados are familiar with formalin, most are probably at least aware of acriflavine, and the pharmaceutically well informed probably know about aminoacridine. However, scant few truly understand the chemical structure and properties of these compounds, and fewer still the molecular mechanisms whereby they impart their biological effects. Consequently, almost no one knows or understands why RALLY ™ is more effective than the sum of its parts: the simultaneous but independent addition of acriflavine, aminoacridine and formalin in amounts comparable to a dose of RALLY ™ will not have as great or as enduring an effect as RALLY ™. Why?

The reagents in RALLY ™ are sequentially blended by an empirically refined methat that provides for minor but important chemical modifications of acriflavine and aminoacridine by formalin. The formalin is combined with acriflavine and aminoacridine in a controlled chemical reaction that reduces the concentration necessary for disease control by over ten fold. By way of analogy, the formalin modified acriflavine and aminoacridine molecules can be thought of as sea urchins whose spines secrete an ultra super-glue: when the urchins enter the molecular domains where they are active, the spines secrete the glue, and the urchins are permanently bound within the domain where they impart their effect. Normally, acriflavine and aminoacridine passively migrate into and out of (or are expelled from) the pertinent molecular domains, necessitating the continual presence of high concentrations to obtain the desired effect. The formalin modified acriflavine and aminoacridine migrate into their active domains and, because of the formalin modification, never migrate out and cannot be expelled. Consequently, they are effective as a water treatment at controlling a variety of tropical aquarium diseases at very low dosages that have no harmful effects on biofiltration or any other fish or living organisms in a reef, marine or freshwater aquarium.

The end result is that RALLY ™ is an extremely effective water treatment for the control of many external parasites including dinoflagellates (e.g., marine velvet, clownfish disease), flukes and gram-negative bacterial (e.g., bacterial fin/tail rot, superficial sepsis, etc.). RALLY ™ is, at best, marginally effective against l. multifiliis and C. irritans, but extremely useful in preventing the secondary bacterial infections that often accompany severe ich infestations. RALLY ™ is not harmful to fish, invertebrates, corals, etc., nor does it affect the symbiotic algae vital to corals or other beneficial bacteria. Beta site tests in shops around the United States have shown the combined use of RALLY ™ and KICK-ICH™ are not harmful to fish, invertebrates, corals or biological filtration.

Not for ich and although it states Parasite control but will address velvet and RRR works slower opposed to coppersafe and chloroquine Phosphate. You are Reading manufacturer claim and not always precise. Same applies to many Seachem Products - Manufacturer claim.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Just so we're all on the same page - the directions for Ruby Rally Pro (which is more concentrated) for saltwater is 1 oz/20 gallons, and for the less concentrated Ruby Rally , the directions for saltwater say 1oz/10 gallons. Is part of the reason you like the lower dose because of adjustment for tank volume or toxicity potential, etc? Or is it just that 1 oz/25 gallons is just as effective when you've used it? I just wanted to know the rationale why not follow the directions on the bottle.

Both

 

[threebuoys]

Hi guys and thanks for answering;

The Rally I've found here its not the PRO version;

How to use RALLY ™?

Turn off protein skimmers and UV sterilizers, also remove carbon filtration and any absorbent media that would remove RALLY ™ from the water. Dose on days 1, 2, and 3 for normal infections. For severe infection further dosing may be required. Add one ounce of RALLY ™ per 10 gallons of total water volume including the filtration system for reef tanks.

Ingredients:
The RALLY ™ Science

The RALLY ™ label lists three active ingredients: acriflavine, aminoacridine and formalin that have been proven effective in parasite control in aquaculture operations and tropical fish farms. Virtually all hobby aficionados are familiar with formalin, most are probably at least aware of acriflavine, and the pharmaceutically well informed probably know about aminoacridine. However, scant few truly understand the chemical structure and properties of these compounds, and fewer still the molecular mechanisms whereby they impart their biological effects. Consequently, almost no one knows or understands why RALLY ™ is more effective than the sum of its parts: the simultaneous but independent addition of acriflavine, aminoacridine and formalin in amounts comparable to a dose of RALLY ™ will not have as great or as enduring an effect as RALLY ™. Why?

The reagents in RALLY ™ are sequentially blended by an empirically refined methat that provides for minor but important chemical modifications of acriflavine and aminoacridine by formalin. The formalin is combined with acriflavine and aminoacridine in a controlled chemical reaction that reduces the concentration necessary for disease control by over ten fold. By way of analogy, the formalin modified acriflavine and aminoacridine molecules can be thought of as sea urchins whose spines secrete an ultra super-glue: when the urchins enter the molecular domains where they are active, the spines secrete the glue, and the urchins are permanently bound within the domain where they impart their effect. Normally, acriflavine and aminoacridine passively migrate into and out of (or are expelled from) the pertinent molecular domains, necessitating the continual presence of high concentrations to obtain the desired effect. The formalin modified acriflavine and aminoacridine migrate into their active domains and, because of the formalin modification, never migrate out and cannot be expelled. Consequently, they are effective as a water treatment at controlling a variety of tropical aquarium diseases at very low dosages that have no harmful effects on biofiltration or any other fish or living organisms in a reef, marine or freshwater aquarium.

The end result is that RALLY ™ is an extremely effective water treatment for the control of many external parasites including dinoflagellates (e.g., marine velvet, clownfish disease), flukes and gram-negative bacterial (e.g., bacterial fin/tail rot, superficial sepsis, etc.). RALLY ™ is, at best, marginally effective against l. multifiliis and C. irritans, but extremely useful in preventing the secondary bacterial infections that often accompany severe ich infestations. RALLY ™ is not harmful to fish, invertebrates, corals, etc., nor does it affect the symbiotic algae vital to corals or other beneficial bacteria. Beta site tests in shops around the United States have shown the combined use of RALLY ™ and KICK-ICH™ are not harmful to fish, invertebrates, corals or biological filtration.

Sounds like you have the older version of the product. That version is no longer offered in the U.S. In a conversation I had with a Ruby Reef representative several years ago, the removal of formalin from the formula was confirmed. Formalin is a very toxic chemical that requires special handling and which has raised concerns for some in the hobby.

 

[threebuoys]

Also, as @vetteguy53081 mentioned, the Rally products will not deter ich. Ruby Reef recommends their product Kick-ich which is not reef safe. We recommend CopperSafe or CopperPower for ich, if you should need it and if you can get it.

 

[Gabbone]

Can hikari ich-x or polyp lab medic be an alternative to Kick-ich, if I can only dose my DT?

 

[MnFish1]

Sounds like you have the older version of the product. That version is no longer offered in the U.S. In a conversation I had with a Ruby Reef representative several years ago, the removal of formalin from the formula was confirmed. Formalin is a very toxic chemical that requires special handling and which has raised concerns for some in the hobby.

Additionally, the shelf life is usually a year (according to their website)

 

[Gabbone]

I might go all in make a one-time purchase from USA despite the shipping cost.

Keeping in mind I can only dose in DT (corals, fish, anemone, inverts), which one are the products that I absolutely need to have with me??

What do I need/don't need or add extra?

Kind regards
Gabriele

 

[Uncle99]

Can hikari ich-x or polyp lab medic be an alternative to Kick-ich, if I can only dose my DT?

Outside of copper, hyposalinity and TTM, nothing else has any creditable proof of working on ick.

So it’s a leap of faith.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Can hikari ich-x or polyp lab medic be an alternative to Kick-ich, if I can only dose my DT?

Alternatives and not solutions. Most anything that states reef safe is reef safe but ineffective

 

[Gabbone]

Ok got it. So what would you recommend me?

I might go all in make a one-time purchase from USA despite the shipping cost.

Keeping in mind I can only dose in DT (corals, fish, anemone, inverts), which one are the products that I absolutely need to have with me??

What do I need/don't need or add extra?

Kind regards
Gabriele

I just got an answer from the supplier regarding the normal Rally we have here in Europe.

PRO version has been released in the US recently…Rally has been used in Europe for the last 10years w/o any negative public release nor any impact to reefers…
The latest changes in naming is mostly marketing related game… Re formalin, I am not aware that any of such thing has been part of the previous Rally and if, it has been negligible…It is similar case like plastic parts being found in women´s pregnant body incl. new non born kids…Hope that clarifies the matter. We do use Rally all the time in very expensive reef aquariums with the top notch corals & fish w/o any negative impact, on the contrary.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Ok got it. So what would you recommend me?




I just got an answer from the supplier regarding the normal Rally we have here in Europe.

PRO version has been released in the US recently…Rally has been used in Europe for the last 10years w/o any negative public release nor any impact to reefers…
The latest changes in naming is mostly marketing related game… Re formalin, I am not aware that any of such thing has been part of the previous Rally and if, it has been negligible…It is similar case like plastic parts being found in women´s pregnant body incl. new non born kids…Hope that clarifies the matter. We do use Rally all the time in very expensive reef aquariums with the top notch corals & fish w/o any negative impact, on the contrary.

Coppersafe is safest chelated version and is effective with ich. Often, it is recommended coppersafe for 30 days and optional, a 15 day regimen with PraziPro which addresses and worms and flukes for total protection of fish

 

[Uncle99]

Ok got it. So what would you recommend me?




I just got an answer from the supplier regarding the normal Rally we have here in Europe.

PRO version has been released in the US recently…Rally has been used in Europe for the last 10years w/o any negative public release nor any impact to reefers…
The latest changes in naming is mostly marketing related game… Re formalin, I am not aware that any of such thing has been part of the previous Rally and if, it has been negligible…It is similar case like plastic parts being found in women´s pregnant body incl. new non born kids…Hope that clarifies the matter. We do use Rally all the time in very expensive reef aquariums with the top notch corals & fish w/o any negative impact, on the contrary.

Not clear on what your trying to treat.
Need to be specific.
Can you remove and house your fish?

 

[Gabbone]

Ok sorry for the confusion; I'll try again.

I live in Europe and I have no easy access to USA medicines to treat my fish. In Europe treatments for fish are very mild and they do not really have strong components. It's more natural extracts.

I don't have a quarantine tank, so all I can do is dose in my main display tank where I have fish, inverts, corals and anemone.

I was thinking to make a one-time purchase directly from USA even if it's really expensive with shipping cost, to get the "must have in-house medicines". I was asking if you could provide me a list of medicines I must have at home to treat and cover the most basic issues with fish such as bacterial infections, parasites, ich, gill flukes, velvet keeping in mind I can only dose in my DT.

For example:
Ruby Rally PRO, PraziPro, Coppersafe Fritz, Hydroplex, Ich-x etc...

 

[Uncle99]

Ok sorry for the confusion; I'll try again.

I live in Europe and I have no easy access to USA medicines to treat my fish. In Europe treatments for fish are very mild and they do not really have strong components. It's more natural extracts.

I don't have a quarantine tank, so all I can do is dose in my main display tank where I have fish, inverts, corals and anemone.

I was thinking to make a one-time purchase directly from USA even if it's really expensive with shipping cost, to get the "must have in-house medicines". I was asking if you could provide me a list of medicines I must have at home to treat and cover the most basic issues with fish such as bacterial infections, parasites, ich, flukes keeping in mind I can only dose in my DT.

For example:
Ruby Rally PRO, PraziPro, Coppersafe Fritz, Hydroplex, Ich-x etc...

In tank treatments likely will likely have limited effects, if any at all.

I gave up treating my fish as I have limited availability to appropriate meds.

I resigned that if my fish were going to die, then that’s what was going to happen, maybe the ones that lived become stronger. Sounds cold but no choice.

I’m also totally useless in medicating anything and in the past, killed more fish in QT then ever died from infection.

So I did absolutely nothing but keep everything stable.

In the end, I lost 1 of 11 fish and now the remaining fish are 5 years old.

I was lucky likely, everyone told me all my fish would die.

If you can’t treat them separately, Iam not sure what choices you have but watch and wait.

I don’t recommend the hope for the best approach, but sometimes, it’s all we can do.