Small Tangs in Small Tanks

[User1]

I think most long term hobbyists don't view rehoming fish as they grow as a means of sustainability.

This is true. Rehoming is not as simple as playing a container in the tank and telling Mr. Fish hey, enter container. It may be a quick trap and rehome, it may not. It may be days, weeks, or never. If never then you are removing corals, rock, and possibly water to catch which will stress everyone out to include fish.

This is over simplified at the end of the day. It may be easy. It may not. I personally do not buy fish with this criteria unless it is a known upgrade. Even then it has to be a lower risk factor. I had a Lt. Tang a few years back that I picked up. Probably 3" when I got it. Within a year it was pushing 8" in size. That one caught me off guard I must say but this was in my 210 gallon.

Great point regardless of fish type.

 

[Alenya]

Lawnmower Blennies are great when they are young but a lazy ### when they are older

Sounds just like me! *adds to fish list*

 

[KyOsIBa515]

I love when what seems to be a well educated and articulate “hobbyist” tries to play the role of scientist. The on going argument over this genre of fish is based more on anecdotal evidence rather than true scientific data. We are all trying to emulate an ecosystem we to this day still know very little about. A world we have only mapped and been able to study about 20% of. So, with that being said, if every hobbyist followed “best practices” and followed the 6’ rule for keeping tangs it would only be a hobby for the elite while other peasants are left to damsels and clownfish. So I fail to see why a person trying to house a fish in a 40 gallon breeder short term is any different than any LFS housing them in their tanks for sale? Sometimes a tang will sit in those tanks for months and months or longer. People only speculate that it won’t be rehomed...and maybe so. However, for the sake of this argument. You can home a tang short term and have them healthy as can be in a 3’ tank with proper stocking and structure.

 

[Mark Bradley]

My LFS has been running for over 40 years with the same 4 staff members all that time - and I have been using them throughout this period. They will take the Tang back before it gets too big and house it in one of their bigger tanks - then sell it to one of their numerous customers who will want a larger fish than the usual small ones they get in. Doesn’t have to be a difficult process If you plan ahead - Do question the sweeping generalist comments that can also sound quite judgemental!

 

[KyOsIBa515]

My LFS has been running for over 40 years with the same 4 staff members all that time - and I have been using them throughout this period. They will take the Tang back before it gets too big and house it in one of their bigger tanks - then sell it to one of their numerous customers who will want a larger fish than the usual small ones they get in. Doesn’t have to be a difficult process If you plan ahead - Do question the sweeping generalist comments that can also sound quite judgemental!

Most solid LFS will practice this. Mine does as well. If you buy a fish and it outgrows the tank or you. They will give you a credit towards another fish or livestock and they are able to sell a fish at a show price. Win win for everyone really.

 

[Bossman]

I have a Yellow Tang in my Reefer170 - he was bought small, has suitable tank mates, is brightly coloured, is well fed and hasn’t grown hugely. I’ve had him a year so far and if I have him another 6-12 months I’ll be pleased - I know I’ll have to relocate him before he gets too big. I don’t see a problem - as I’ve personally outgrown homes I’ve moved. There are plenty of stories of tanks that are what would be deemed appropriate but where tank mates and husbandry are up for debate. I consider my Tang is lucky to be treated like royalty.

I have a flame fin tomini tang in my Reefer 170. Initially, when I purchased, I planned to rehome him in my reefer425xl that was in progress. But his home is the 170 now. I wouldn't think of taking him out at this point. I have good rock work for him to swim through and hide. I see no behavior that would suggest the tank it too small for this fish. Swims and picks freely, eats well, good color and no issues with his tank mates.

I take the suggestions I see here on R2R with a grain of salt. Recently I saw someone post the need for an 8' tank to keep a tang. I've had members suggest I need a 300 gallon tank for a cleaner wrasse. I have 4 cleaner wrasses in 4 tanks. One is in a 34 gal, 48 gal, 55 gal and my 88 gal. All are doing very well.

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

My LFS has been running for over 40 years with the same 4 staff members all that time - and I have been using them throughout this period. They will take the Tang back before it gets too big and house it in one of their bigger tanks - then sell it to one of their numerous customers who will want a larger fish than the usual small ones they get in.

Of course, that's a win/win for an LFS, sell you a fish, offer store credit at a fraction, sell the larger fish for a lot more.

When I add a fish to my tank, that's their final destination. Most people can't justify purchasing a fish only to get rid of it when it outgrows a tank. That's not a sustainable process.

I can understand if you're planning a future large tank upgrade, but not this revolving livestock in a nano tank, let alone losing all that time and money on growing the fish to get less than what you purchased it for. Just doesn't make much sense to me.

 

[Mark Bradley]

To be fair I’m talking one fish every 18 months - hardly revolving. Because I bought him small and will be selling him bigger my loss won’t be enormous.

 

[KyOsIBa515]

Of course, that's a win/win for an LFS, sell you a fish, offer store credit at a fraction, sell the larger fish for a lot more.

When I add a fish to my tank, that's their final destination. Most people can't justify purchasing a fish only to get rid of it when it outgrows a tank. That's not a sustainable process.

I can understand if you're planning a future large tank upgrade, but not this revolving livestock in a nano tank, let alone losing all that time and money on growing the fish to get less than what you purchased it for. Just doesn't make much sense to me.

Some people do not have the luxury or space to accommodate a tank outside the nano realm. That is perfectly ok too. If people can make do and responsibly rotate the fish at no expense to its health then right on. They got to enjoy a fish they wanted. That argument is almost of that as saying fragging a beautiful coral you watched grow makes no sense.

 

[Fink]

As someone relatively new, I always thought people were joking when they talked about the "Tang Police." This thread proves they are a very real thing...

 

[Uncle99]

To be fair I’m talking one fish every 18 months - hardly revolving. Because I bought him small and will be selling him bigger my loss won’t be enormous.

Your not alone my friend.
We all enjoy the hobby, just a bit differently.
65 Gallon, 3 years

 

[Mark Bradley]

As someone relatively new, I always thought people were joking when they talked about the "Tang Police." This thread proves they are a very real thing...

 

[Letterkenny]

#defundthetangpolice

 

[...]

Tang Police like commented before are people who have understanding of these creatures.

 

[Thales]

I love when what seems to be a well educated and articulate “hobbyist” tries to play the role of scientist. The on going argument over this genre of fish is based more on anecdotal evidence rather than true scientific data. We are all trying to emulate an ecosystem we to this day still know very little about. A world we have only mapped and been able to study about 20% of.

The idea that tangs need swimming room isn't unsupported. What kind of data would you accept? We do know several critical difference between the ecosystem and what we are trying to emulate - one being space; tangs swim long distances daily.

So, with that being said, if every hobbyist followed “best practices” and followed the 6’ rule for keeping tangs it would only be a hobby for the elite while other peasants are left to damsels and clownfish.

I don't see why this is a problem, and it seems to be a question of ethics. If it isn't good to keep an animal a certain way, it shouldn't be kept that way. There also seem to be lots of animals only 'elite' keepers should keep, so I also don't see that as a problem. There are a lot of animals I won't touch because I can't 'give them what they need'. If people can't afford to give an animal what it needs, they shouldn't keep that animal.

So I fail to see why a person trying to house a fish in a 40 gallon breeder short term is any different than any LFS housing them in their tanks for sale? Sometimes a tang will sit in those tanks for months and months or longer.

That's is terrible. Just because that is the way has been done, doesn't mean it is the way it should be done. The supermarket approach to live animals has cruelty built into it, as the fish for sale long term illustrates. I am much more a fan of 'order to collect', and don't really need to impulse buy living things.

People only speculate that it won’t be rehomed...and maybe so.
However, for the sake of this argument. You can home a tang short term and have them healthy as can be in a 3’ tank with proper stocking and structure.

You bet

 

[sfin52]

Really, any appropriately large reef safe plastic container will work. Stock tanks are often bought at agricultural stores (sometimes called feed tanks/containers/vats), but ultimately you're looking for something that is wide, long, and relatively shallow. Normally, a comparable container from home depot or a container store would be very expensive, but you can usually pick these up extremely cheaply- for example I helped a buddy use them as a sump and he bought two 300 gallon stock tanks off off of craigslist for $50 each. You can also buy new for a fraction of what glass would cost. Ultimately, I'm inviting you to think outside the box- it's not sexy, but as a thought experiment, there's no reason you couldn't use a large kiddie pool So long as the dimensions fit your budget, living arrangements and sense of decor, they might be the best option. If you want to see them in action, if you head over to some of the large tank builds, they are pretty commonly used either as sumps or hooked up to sumps as large refugiums or storage vats for live rock.

What no build thread. I was so ready to clink on that badge

 

[LiamPM]

Your not alone my friend.
We all enjoy the hobby, just a bit differently.
65 Gallon, 3 years

With respect - Are you posting a picture of a beat up yellow tang you've had for 3 years that hasn't healed fully to prove you can keep them in small tanks?

Some people do not have the luxury or space to accommodate a tank outside the nano realm. That is perfectly ok too. If people can make do and responsibly rotate the fish at no expense to its health then right on. They got to enjoy a fish they wanted. That argument is almost of that as saying fragging a beautiful coral you watched grow makes no sense.

Then those people dont have the space to accommodate large fish either - I struggle to see whats difficult with that. It almost comes across like spoilt children wanting a toy just because their friend has one. There is zero need for it, but if they can have it i am too.

Most solid LFS will practice this. Mine does as well. If you buy a fish and it outgrows the tank or you. They will give you a credit towards another fish or livestock and they are able to sell a fish at a show price. Win win for everyone really.

I find the complete opposite to be true but i am across the pond in the UK. LFS around by me wont take your fish back because they have no idea how clean or infested your tank may be. They wont risk the damage it could do their stock by taking one back. Of course they could take measures against it but they dont and wont. I agree with them too, makes people only think about housing animals they can for the long run, the way i think it should be.

 

[Mark Bradley]

Some interesting choice or words and phrases - just backs up what I said earlier about tone and inference imo.

 

[LiamPM]

Some interesting choice or words and phrases - just backs up what I said earlier about tone and inference imo.

Im not even sure why you are reading a forum post with tone and inference to be honest - We are all giving opinions back on opinions, there is no tone at all and as for words and phrases i really dont see what got you annoyed?

Growth is an indicator but so is display. I’m sure your fish is great - well done.

Maybe i should have added sarcasm to lighten the tone.

 

[Mark Bradley]

“With respect” - not sure what followed those words displayed any respect at all. When someone starts a phrase with those words you know exactly what’s coming next. Also sounds like anyone who doesn’t share certain opinions are “spoiled children” - presume I fall into this category - bought a fish small, looked after it well, agreed on purchase I could return it, it’s grown at an acceptable rate, is a stunning example - are these what constitutes a “spoiled child”. There’s a big difference between insults and opinions in a constructive debate.