The real Black Box light study
- Thread starter Manose
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OP
OP
It has been awhile since I have posted so some updates need to be done.
I am going to ramble a bit here as i'm not sure what to do-
After doing the Noopsyche test many know that I went on to help promote and get them setup with someone here in the USA that could distribute their lights.
Now I can finally say that I am FREE of such responsibility as they're set up with a company here in the states.
Not having to worry about this is a great lift off my shoulders and gave me free time for other projects .
Everyone knows that to do this study I have been having to travel about 1.5 hours away and hope for some help. I need to rethink some things and find away to make this possible at my own residence.
The best thing is to get a tank that is the same size as used in my testing before or come up with a whole new plan and start from scratch.
Here are some options that I have come up with:
1)Get a tank and go at my own pace.
2)Start everything from scratch with new guidelines and procedures.
3)Stop the study
Since many of the trolls and others have told me that my testing is all wrong, I have thought about having this thread closed and not have to worry about having to walk on egg shells any more.
Please let me know your feelings on this as I am not sure what to do.
I am going to ramble a bit here as i'm not sure what to do-
After doing the Noopsyche test many know that I went on to help promote and get them setup with someone here in the USA that could distribute their lights.
Now I can finally say that I am FREE of such responsibility as they're set up with a company here in the states.
Not having to worry about this is a great lift off my shoulders and gave me free time for other projects .
Everyone knows that to do this study I have been having to travel about 1.5 hours away and hope for some help. I need to rethink some things and find away to make this possible at my own residence.
The best thing is to get a tank that is the same size as used in my testing before or come up with a whole new plan and start from scratch.
Here are some options that I have come up with:
1)Get a tank and go at my own pace.
2)Start everything from scratch with new guidelines and procedures.
3)Stop the study
Since many of the trolls and others have told me that my testing is all wrong, I have thought about having this thread closed and not have to worry about having to walk on egg shells any more.
Please let me know your feelings on this as I am not sure what to do.
Feet4Fish
Valuable Member
Definitely don't stop the study. It is great work and if critics think it can be done better than have them do just that. You're work has been great and valued very much by the masses. Personally I would get set it up at your home so you can go at your own pace.
wesman42
Valuable Member
Don't stop the study. Some people think the Earth is flat still. There's always going to be people that, no matter the evidence, will choose to believe in a less than logical option.
Problem you have manose is that if you smacked down par readings and the kessil, radion and Hydra came out on top - nobody would be complaining.
It's a simple as that, I for one love the comparison and think you have done it in a fair way.
I also believe there has been a slight bias towards noopsyche, which is understandable as they provided some of the test models, and as you say you are now free from that, not to say its not a good light!
Whatever you do decide to do going forward, I personally thank you for what you have done up until now.
DO NOT FORGET : this is a hobby, we do it for fun, if you are doing something that isn't fun, or makes you compromise your time in a negative way and other things are suffering for it, dont do it.
It's a simple as that, I for one love the comparison and think you have done it in a fair way.
I also believe there has been a slight bias towards noopsyche, which is understandable as they provided some of the test models, and as you say you are now free from that, not to say its not a good light!
Whatever you do decide to do going forward, I personally thank you for what you have done up until now.
DO NOT FORGET : this is a hobby, we do it for fun, if you are doing something that isn't fun, or makes you compromise your time in a negative way and other things are suffering for it, dont do it.
crusso1993
7500 Club Member
As you know, I believe all the testing that has been done has been done so on a level playing field. It has provided many reefers access to great info they would not have gotten elsewhere. I applaud your efforts, personal money spent and time dedicated to doing this study.
As for continuing, or not, just a couple of things from my perspective;
1.) One thing that matters is if continuing the study will cause undue stress. Stress is a killer, literally, of all good things and always has ill effects on many levels. If, for some reason(s), you'd be unable to continue the test without getting stressed then I say put it on a shelf for a little while. Nothing is worth risking your mental and physical well being. Plus, this way, should you choose to, you can always revisit it after a while.
2.) Piggybacking off of number one; do you really want to give other people that much power over you and what you choose to do in your life? It took me quite a while to realize that people do what they do because of themselves and not becasue of me. I do my very best not to take anything on a personal level other than what I think, say and do. After all, for me, it always gets back to living with integrity. I know that I do. Those that know me, really know me on a personal level, know that I do. What everyone else does is because of themselves and I don't take it personally. I also do my best to not take myself too seriously!
Whatever you end up doing you have my support.
As for continuing, or not, just a couple of things from my perspective;
1.) One thing that matters is if continuing the study will cause undue stress. Stress is a killer, literally, of all good things and always has ill effects on many levels. If, for some reason(s), you'd be unable to continue the test without getting stressed then I say put it on a shelf for a little while. Nothing is worth risking your mental and physical well being. Plus, this way, should you choose to, you can always revisit it after a while.
2.) Piggybacking off of number one; do you really want to give other people that much power over you and what you choose to do in your life? It took me quite a while to realize that people do what they do because of themselves and not becasue of me. I do my very best not to take anything on a personal level other than what I think, say and do. After all, for me, it always gets back to living with integrity. I know that I do. Those that know me, really know me on a personal level, know that I do. What everyone else does is because of themselves and I don't take it personally. I also do my best to not take myself too seriously!
Whatever you end up doing you have my support.
dantimdad
7500 Club Member
@crusso1993 said exactly what needed to be said
As your friend I want you to take it easy and enjoy your tank for a while.
If it comes down to it, we will make arrangements for me to take over the test if you want. I would be more than willing to do so.
As your friend I want you to take it easy and enjoy your tank for a while.
If it comes down to it, we will make arrangements for me to take over the test if you want. I would be more than willing to do so.
Gino
Active Member
In my perspective, you have done a great job. And as others have said, it's a hobby and your doing it because you love it, and want to show the community that there are other options for the people to use, with results in a budget.
I'm upgrading from my actual tank to a new and bigger one. And I pull the trigger and buy 3 more for it. I'm very happy with mine and all I have to do is to learn to set them better to achieve my goals in my tank.
If you want to continue your research, we are here to follow along. But, do it on your own pace and if you're able to do it in a more comfortable position, like in your home for instance, if you have the space for it. Remember that people will always criticize and will always look for faults no matter what. Your research has being done in a hobbiest point of view and with the equipment that a common reefers could have at home.
I think that it been a very honest and well intentioned process in pro of the hobby. And that's what matters. If you decide to continue will be here or if you decide to stop here, will be here as well.
You did an amazing job from your own time and expenses. And that's something that few people are able to do for this hobby.
Maybe the next step could be, managing the settings to achieve a nice reef and watch what they are able to do, during X period of time. Maybe all of us that got the lights could get together and share our experiences, settings, troubleshooting ect... and screw those who still don't believe in the our Chinese Noopsyshe fixture. Let said like a support group. We all, know they are capable, now it's to get the most out off them.
Great job and keep on reefing.
I'm upgrading from my actual tank to a new and bigger one. And I pull the trigger and buy 3 more for it. I'm very happy with mine and all I have to do is to learn to set them better to achieve my goals in my tank.
If you want to continue your research, we are here to follow along. But, do it on your own pace and if you're able to do it in a more comfortable position, like in your home for instance, if you have the space for it. Remember that people will always criticize and will always look for faults no matter what. Your research has being done in a hobbiest point of view and with the equipment that a common reefers could have at home.
I think that it been a very honest and well intentioned process in pro of the hobby. And that's what matters. If you decide to continue will be here or if you decide to stop here, will be here as well.
You did an amazing job from your own time and expenses. And that's something that few people are able to do for this hobby.
Maybe the next step could be, managing the settings to achieve a nice reef and watch what they are able to do, during X period of time. Maybe all of us that got the lights could get together and share our experiences, settings, troubleshooting ect... and screw those who still don't believe in the our Chinese Noopsyshe fixture. Let said like a support group. We all, know they are capable, now it's to get the most out off them.
Great job and keep on reefing.
I have enjoyed the exposure to the black box market you have given us! I for one would not have given them a serious look after some of my exchanges with various vendors through Alibaba and the den of thieves! LOL. Jack Ma has some explaining to do given the name of his portal and some of its lose practices.
That said you have given real choice to those who want to save money on light systems. That is a great service to the hobby! So I just want to say thank you and we'll done!
If you choose to continue I will continue to read and learn.
That said you have given real choice to those who want to save money on light systems. That is a great service to the hobby! So I just want to say thank you and we'll done!
If you choose to continue I will continue to read and learn.
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Thanks again for all the hard work. And this is all I have to add in regards to what you should do
People that crap on this study, and few others that you did, are mostly doing it because they are realizing that perhaps they spent way too much money on their XYZ light fixture, when they could have spent a lot less and gotten same thing. People dont want to be shown that they made a mistake, so they will do whatever they can to make themselves feel better about said mistakes.
In the end for you and rest of the folks who gave these lights a chance, it doesnt matter. You and they know what they got. They got really good lights that can stand up to all the big names for fraction of the cost. Thats the bottom line.
People that crap on this study, and few others that you did, are mostly doing it because they are realizing that perhaps they spent way too much money on their XYZ light fixture, when they could have spent a lot less and gotten same thing. People dont want to be shown that they made a mistake, so they will do whatever they can to make themselves feel better about said mistakes.
In the end for you and rest of the folks who gave these lights a chance, it doesnt matter. You and they know what they got. They got really good lights that can stand up to all the big names for fraction of the cost. Thats the bottom line.
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Gino
Active Member
Amen brother...
symon_say
Active Member
You definitely should keep doing it.
There are a lot more people that are grateful from your work, than people that trash your work, but they tend to be noisier.
Your data no matter if it's not "the most accurate" is a base line for decision making, given that all test are done equally.
Keep the good work and don't listen to those voices, if they don't trust you, they should run their own accurate test.
There are a lot more people that are grateful from your work, than people that trash your work, but they tend to be noisier.
Your data no matter if it's not "the most accurate" is a base line for decision making, given that all test are done equally.
Keep the good work and don't listen to those voices, if they don't trust you, they should run their own accurate test.
Jonreefer
Valuable Member
ignore the trolls. I think they forget that this is only fishtanks. They are not needing data that is like lab precision. Even if numbers are off by 10% who cares this isn't that tight of a subject with needing that precise of results. I have come to the conclusion that there are ALOT of people in this hobby who think they are a scientist and need to act like all work done needs to be to that standard. I think it might make them feel more important than they are and if you dont do something how they want it your results are no good. Also like others said majority I bet are the ones who feel for spending a huge dollar for some Chinese lights with a new name on it and now are mad and want to make themselves feel justified to spend $700+ for 1 light fixture.
I am 100% in favor of keeping this going if it and it is and is legitimate which I believe the numbers are,,, However, I am going to address the 600 lb. Gorilla in MY room... My concern is that this study started like a ball of fire and then fizzled out with no bang other than the NOOP's were the next best thing to sliced bread. And... then we discover he or a friend has become the distributer of the NOOP's. What a coincidence... If you continue to read the thread about when and why this thread fizzled out you can draw your own conclusions. The OP was pretty consistant in responding to other threads they had open and and pretty much went silent after the NOOP promo got rolling. FWIW I am not denying that it is a potential choice for the right application and I would try them myself. However, I cant be the only reefer reading between the lines on this.., Am I?
OP
OP
Say what you want about between the lines but I ALWAYS was totally unbiased in my study. If you are inferring that I was paid or compensated for my study on the Noopsyche light then you are way out of bounds in my book.
I only went to help Noopsyche after the study and have all the emails and correspondents to prove it. I did my job for them and got them with a USA distributor so my goal for them was finished.
The number one thing I have to ask is do we want to continue to look at other black box lights and give them a fair evaluation or look elsewhere?
Lots of great stuff in the thread, and helping to bring more lights to market is a good thing without a doubt, but due to that involvement it's probably better if someone else takes over the reigns. Just to avoid this sort of speculation even if it's false.
What people quickly forget is that OP was using his own money to purchase all of the lights. He didnt get a single light donated, even though he tried. As has been said many times, to me at least it looks like he tested noopsyche same way, with same equipment as all other BBs. I am not sure why folks think there was bias, something malicious or any reading between the lines needed. Sure, NP provided lights for study, but all other companies had that that offered to them as well. I am 100% certain that study and numbers shown would have been same if he paid for NP lights in the 1st place and had no dealings with them afterwards. He even tested some other lights that people were really interested in, but only difference is that he didnt have any dealings with them once numbers were posted (he did post links where they can be purchased several times). It just happened that there was more buzz and interest about NP lights, and things unexpectedly took off. Hell, it was me that suggested to noopsyche that they they should look into BB study that was just getting under way, in case they were interested in donating some lights.
As for someone else picking this up and continuing with it, it is easier said than done. I doubt there is a single person out there that would want to spend their own money on something like this, which as mentioned was precisely what manose did.
As for someone else picking this up and continuing with it, it is easier said than done. I doubt there is a single person out there that would want to spend their own money on something like this, which as mentioned was precisely what manose did.
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