Trident FAQ (official)

Discussion in 'Neptune Systems' started by Terence, May 7, 2019.

  1. Terence

    Terence Valuable Member R2R Supporter Platinum Sponsor Partner Sponsor 2019

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    OK, so now that the Trident has been released, we wanted to create a new thread with links to the information out there on the Trident as well as answer, to the best of our ability, additional questions from hobbyists. From that feedback, we will update our official FAQ with those questions when it seems like they will be "Frequently Asked."

    We hope that this thread can stay on topic, stay productive and also does not devolve with unhelpful posts from those that may have no real interest in the Trident, and whose only desire is to foment unrest.

    The Trident goes/went on sale at midnight, PDT, 5/8/2019.

    Here are the links:

    Launch video: https://bit.ly/2PX0oPm
    Product page: https://www.neptunesystems.com/products/expansion-modules/trident/
    Official FAQ: https://www.neptunesystems.com/getstarted/trident/faq/
    Trident Support Information Page: https://www.neptunesystems.com/getstarted/trident/
    Neptune Systems Community Trident Forum: https://forum.neptunesystems.com/forumdisplay.php?84-Trident-Marine-Aquarium-Water-Analyzer
    Reagent Ordering: https://www.neptunesystems.com/reagents
    5/7 #LetsTalkReef livestream: https://bit.ly/2vOZcEu
    5/8 Launch Day Update: https://bit.ly/2WHBKVL

    Here are additional questions we have answered already in this thread and, likely, elsewhere.

    What is Trident?
    Automatic, continuous water tester for alkalinity, calcium, and magnesium.

    Do I need an Apex to use a Trident?
    Yes

    How many tests does Trident perform per day?
    The Trident has the option to run as few as 4 test cycles per day up to 24 test cycles per day. The test cycles alternate between testing only alkalinity and testing all three parameters. The 4/2/2 schedule will result in 4 alkalinity tests per day, 2 calcium tests, and 2 magnesium tests.

    Can I test more or less than the minimum schedule or in any different combination?
    No, the provided schedules are necessary to maintain proper operation.

    I don't want to test calcium or magnesium every day, can I turn those tests off?
    No. The Trident alternates between testing all 3 (alk, cal, mag) and single alkalinity tests.

    Installation

    How far from my tank can I place Trident?
    The sample line is 5ft and cannot be cut or extended under any circumstances! We suggest keeping the Trident less than 4ft from the tank or sump.

    Can I cut or extend the sample line tubing?
    The sample line is 5ft and cannot be cut or extended under any circumstances!

    Should I place the Trident above my water line? Below?
    It can be placed wherever the tube reaches but placing it below the waterline can risk a siphon to occur and drain water from your tank should something disconnect the sample tube.

    Reagent Info

    How long in between reagent replacement?
    Reagents will last 2 months when testing on the 4/2/2 schedule.

    What is the reagent shelf-life?
    1 year when sealed.

    Can the reagents get cold? Hot?
    Reagents should be kept at room temperature and not exposed to bright sunlight.

    Is there a reagent subscription plan?
    It's possible if there is interest - let us know!

    Maintenance Info

    What do I need to do to maintain Trident?
    Besides replacing reagents and letting it calibrate with a standard solution every couple of months, it is suggested to perform service on the Trident roughly every 18-24 months.

    Can I perform the servicing myself?
    Yes! You will be able to order a maintenance kit for less than $100. We are still determining all of the necessary included components and since this is quite a bit into the future, we want to get it right and not require too much or too little to be done.

    Are there other servicing options?
    Neptune Systems will offer an advanced replacement servicing option for between $150-$200 - there are not further details at this time.

    Do I have to ship my Trident into Neptune Systems for the this servicing?
    No! If you decide to service the unit yourself, then you do not have to ship the unit in. If we do the maintenance, there will be an advanced replacement option available - details to be released later. BUT NO DOWN TIME!

    Automatic Dosing Control

    Can Trident control my dosing pump to keep everything stable?
    Yes, when paired with one or many Neptune DOS, the Apex will use the Trident data to safely and intelligently adjust dosing based on recent test results.

    Will automatic dosing control work with my 3rd party dosing pump?
    The short answer is no. However, since the Trident is providing the testing data back to the Apex, if you have an "on/off" type dosing pump, you could come up with your own dosing programming to use that data in different ways.

    How does controlled dosing work?
    After each Trident test, The Apex will use the Trident data to update the DOS head linked to each test and make small adjustments to attempt to course-correct and maintain stable parameters. If you typically dose 10ml of alkalinity, enabling controlled dosing will give the Trident the ability to change that dosage by 1-2ml depending on test results. There are safety limits in place to prevent a runaway condition that could harm your tank.

    Do I need 2 DOSs to use dosing control?
    No. You can choose to activate controlled dosing for a single parameter if you'd like. A single DOS can be used to control alkalinity and calcium, leaving magnesium to be manually dosed, for example.

    What happens if Trident controlled dosing isn't working? Will it harm my tank?
    Trident controlled dosing is very clever about not dosing too much or too little additive. Controlled dosing is only activated while the test results are within an expected range. If Trident + DOS control results in numbers that aren't staying stable, controlled dosing will temporarily be shut off and you will receive an alert to intervene. Dosing will go back to your baseline dosing value in the interim.

    Can I use Trident with my calcium reactor?
    At the moment, we don't have a task created to help program direct calcium reactor support, but it can be done through advanced programming. Another method would be to use the calcium reactor for 90% replenishment and use Trident + DOS to dose liquid additives for the remaining 10% of usage. This also adds a bit of redundancy if your calcium reactor ever goes offline.
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2019

  2. killr66tb

    killr66tb Active Member

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    WOW Awesome
     
  3. dputt88

    dputt88 Active Member Build Thread Contributor

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    Can you recommend a responsible way to dispose of the waste.
     
  4. Dr. Reef

    Dr. Reef Always at your service R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    @Terence
    Now can you please tell me when is Trident ver 2 (Nitrates Phos Potassium) coming out?
     
  5. bubbaque

    bubbaque Valuable Member R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Tank 365 Build Thread Contributor

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    Can you tell us more about the needed maintenance procedure in more detail?

    How does it work when we send it in?

    When we get the Trident back are we going to have to wait several days again to recalibrate the machine?

    What would someone need to do if they wanted to do the maintenance theirselves?

    The product seems to be somewhat recently released to testers. How did you come up with 18 - 24 months on the maintenance time?

    When will we know exact cost of this?
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2019
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  6. Dr. Reef

    Dr. Reef Always at your service R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    $599.95
    comes with a 1link cable.
    So if you have 1link module or EB832 or any available 1link port you will be able to run it right out of box.
    If no 1link is available then you will need to buy aquabus cable and power supply.
     
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  7. Dr. Reef

    Dr. Reef Always at your service R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    did you say black line CAN or CANNOT be cut short?
     
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  8. MnFish1

    MnFish1 Valuable Member R2R Supporter Partner Member 2019 Build Thread Contributor

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    I love you - shouldn't the answers be limited to Neptune? - its supposed to be the official 'trident FAQ'. Part of the problem last time was everyone putting out their answers to the questions. - whether right or wrong which resulted in misinformation guesses and wrong information - which negatively affected users and Neptune...

    For Me I would like to know:

    1. what is the monthly cost of maintenance (including the need to send the product in and the reagents).
    2. If someone were to use the product to dose their system - how long from sending in the product for maintenance to the ability to again use it to dose - how long would that usually take.
    3. What is the deal with the level of the trident over the sump - and why? I dont want to mount the trident in a cabinet outside my sump - but the Reefer series leaves little room?

    Thanks appreciate the answers @Terence
     
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  9. MnFish1

    MnFish1 Valuable Member R2R Supporter Partner Member 2019 Build Thread Contributor

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    This is an example - what is the 'black line'
     
  10. Entz

    Entz Member R2R Supporter

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    Maybe I am missing something. If that is the case why isn't 2A/1C/1M an option to extend the testing life of the reagents?

    At least until they get into widespread distribution, the reagents would cost me 19.95$ to ship according to your store (limit 2) + import fees. So the longer they would last the better.
     
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  11. smartwater101

    smartwater101 Active Member R2R Supporter

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    Why was the routine service not mentioned before today? You guys avoided the question ever since the update to Apex made the routine servicing known. The "Triton FAQ" thread was meant as nothing more than a hype train and fanboy gathering.

    And even after the announcement, you still can't give us the actual cost? Can you give us a better idea of when to expect this info?

    Ultimately, it's less about the cost and more about basic disclosure. I wonder if you guys would have even brought it up tonight if someone wouldn't have asked? And the question wouldn't even have been asked if the videos weren't accidentally included in the apex fusion update. (Videos that were immediately removed from YouTube less than a minute after they were posted in the FAQ thread.)

    Cynically, I'd say no. The topic wouldn't even have been touched. Saying you'll update us "in a couple months" is ridiculous. And how convenient that this information isnt on the official site. Will that be updated? Will the other vendors have this info for their official item descriptions?

    It's pretty shady to wait until release to give such fundamental information about long-term costs.

    And, again, it's less about the cost itself (even though its ridiculous) but more about basic disclosure.

    Edit: just to be clear, so people don't think I'm attacking them personally: not every fan is a fanboy. I'm a Apex fan (genuinely). I don't think I'd like setting up another tank without an Apex. But I can't pretend like anti-consumer business practices are okay.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2019
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  12. Dr. Reef

    Dr. Reef Always at your service R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    black line is the sample water (from tank/sump) coming into trident
     
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  13. Dr. Reef

    Dr. Reef Always at your service R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Squad Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    @MnFish1
    $599.95 is on the video linked above.
     
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  14. Zaireguy

    Zaireguy Active Member

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    Hopefully this will be as easy to set up with the dose as i am hoping...
    Cant wait to try the theme they have already set up
     
  15. MnFish1

    MnFish1 Valuable Member R2R Supporter Partner Member 2019 Build Thread Contributor

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    Right - it was more a general comment - that maybe Neptune should be answering rather than everyone with an opinion as to the answer - granted this one was pretty clear - some of the other answers so far have not been as clear:)
     
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  16. ReeferBean

    ReeferBean Valuable Member R2R Supporter

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    It’s 599. It was stated in the announcement but I guess we’ll have to wait until Midnight to know once the retailers have them on their websites for purchase lol
     
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  17. Terence

    Terence Valuable Member R2R Supporter Platinum Sponsor Partner Sponsor 2019

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    To begin, let's try and at least read/watch the information at the top of the post before asking questions. It will become super repetitive and arduous for us and others to keep answering the same questions over and over again.

    Dispose of the waste in the same manner that you would dispose of the waste from your existing test kits.

    No product like this has ever been announced.

    The black tube is the intake/sample line. It cannot be cut. Neither can the waste line. This is in the FAQ above.

    There is no "monthly cost." users will test at the frequency they desire and consume reagents accordingly. The recommended maintenance should not be something to get hung up on. How many other companies actually tell you this upfront in this manner. At any point. We will have a kit available for under $100 or you can send it in to us for slightly more. If you want to do the math and amortize that over 18/24/30 months that is your choice again. This is the RECOMMENDED not required service interval.

    For the recommended maintenance from us, we will have a "hot-swap" type advanced replacement option. If that is not desired, setting the DOS to the mean level of the last days dosing until the new one returns should be just fine. After all, dosing requirements should not rise that much in that timeframe.

    The Trident has 5 feet of sample line tubing. You can mount it above your sump level.

    They are referring to the sample line.

    While we understand your point, we cannot control what the Canadian government and FedEx decide to charge. Our only other option was to not have units for the Canadian market at launch. The testing schedule reasoning was explained in the FAQ and livestream today.

    This is exactly the kind of post I would use as an example of unhelpful in this thread. Calling us shady is a non-starter to respond to what was likely a valid question. But for the sake of the thread I will ignore that and answer anyway.

    Many (most) products do not disclose this at all to their customers in their marketing communications, let alone enumerate the costs, and almost certainly not ahead of launching the product. There are many things we have had to understand and decide on all the way up until today. This is one of them. We are not required to answer every question as they come up in forums - especially when we don't yet have an answer.

    About us pulling down videos, well that was an oversight on our part, those should have been private from the outset.

    As far as whether or not it was going to be brought up, if it would help quell some of that sour cynicism, I will take a pic of my outline tomorrow and post it here.

    We believe we are a very open company when it comes to communications with hobbyists and enjoy engaging in forums like this. However, throwing out negative innuendo like this is not helpful in terms of us trying to get out the information sought. Please ask the questions and we will do our best to answer them.
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2019
  18. ReeferBean

    ReeferBean Valuable Member R2R Supporter

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    Edited as I mistakenly thought you were talking about the waste line.
     
  19. MnFish1

    MnFish1 Valuable Member R2R Supporter Partner Member 2019 Build Thread Contributor

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    Thanks a lot for starting this forum:). Much appreciated @Terence
     
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  20. spifftempo

    spifftempo Member Platinum Sponsor

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    I think you are thinking of the clear waste line. Not the black sample line- it cannot be cut or extended. The FAQ touches on this:
    upload_2019-5-7_22-5-35.png
     
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