Velvet, round 2.

[_chiefxr33f]

So my luck has been atrocious the last week or two. Last weekend, my nano tank that was housing my YT until he grew out some more had a malfunction and my Green BTA melted causing all sorts of chaos to my levels. The YT developed ich. Theres a flame angel, 1 bangaii, and 1 small maroon clown in with him. None of them were affected. I did a water change and he improved, but it came back pretty bad. (this is for sure ich and not velvet). We go get a hospital tank and pump and everything so that I can isolate and medicate. Move all of my rock and get him out and into the bag- has a heart attack and dies 3 seconds in. Devastating.

I did a fallow in my display and thought I was all clear. My sailfin, damsel, 6 line wrasse and dragonface pipe were all survivors. All was good for a bit, so I added a powder blue.

Boy I underestimated velvet immunity.
I finally decided enough is enough. I pulled every frag out of my tank so they wouldn't get lost, and pulled half of the rock out. I'm a half hour into a minnfinn treatment before I pull all of the fish out and put them in my QT.

Here is where the questions begin.
I know that eels are not tolerant of copper, so is there any other alternatives that i can treat ALL of my livestock with in my QT?

I am planning on doing a 6 week fallow period with only coral and inverts. Will this be enough?

I almost sold all of my tanks and gear and laid down on the highway. Would this cure velvet?

Thanks! <3

 

[_chiefxr33f]

So due to the fact that I have an eel in the system, my LFS told me to go with formalin/ich-x. What levels of concentration/dosing, and frequency of dosing/water changes have any of yall found success treating velvet with this method?

 

[Hairyteeth]

Im sure the #fishmedic will
Be here soon

 

[_chiefxr33f]

Im sure the #fishmedic will
Be here soon

Still new, forgot that we have these wonderful rescue hashtags.
#fishmedic halllllppppp

 

[Hairyteeth]

You should change the category to fish disease and tag it with emergency….call in the doctors!

@Jay Hemdal @vetteguy53081

 

[vetteguy53081]

I know that eels are not tolerant of copper, so is there any other alternatives that i can treat ALL of my livestock with in my QT?
Eels are somewhat tolerant but I often recommend General cure.

I am planning on doing a 6 week fallow period with only coral and inverts. Will this be enough?
6-8 weeks recommended and I recommend 60 days

I almost sold all of my tanks and gear and laid down on the highway. Would this cure velvet?
Not understanding this question. Hyposalinity does not work for velvet leaving treatment to be coppersafe at 2.15 - 2.25ppm with air stone added for aeration and Do monitor ammonia levels with a reliable test kit

Please add a video of at least 30 seconds under bright white light intensity for assessment and confirmation of velvet as it may also be amyloodinum. If velvet, some signs you will see are fish will scratch body against hard objects, lethargic behavior, Loss of appetite and weight loss, Rapid, labored breathing, Fins clamped against the body, and typically stay at the surface of the water, or remain in a position where a steady flow of water is present in the aquarium.
Ich always shows spots at first. They are less visible in some species, and long term, the spots coalesce into mucus, but it is never seen in just the gills.

So my luck has been atrocious the last week or two. Last weekend, my nano tank that was housing my YT until he grew out some more had a malfunction and my Green BTA melted causing all sorts of chaos to my levels. The YT developed ich. Theres a flame angel, 1 bangaii, and 1 small maroon clown in with him. None of them were affected. I did a water change and he improved, but it came back pretty bad. (this is for sure ich and not velvet). We go get a hospital tank and pump and everything so that I can isolate and medicate. Move all of my rock and get him out and into the bag- has a heart attack and dies 3 seconds in. Devastating.

I did a fallow in my display and thought I was all clear. My sailfin, damsel, 6 line wrasse and dragonface pipe were all survivors. All was good for a bit, so I added a powder blue.

Boy I underestimated velvet immunity.
I finally decided enough is enough. I pulled every frag out of my tank so they wouldn't get lost, and pulled half of the rock out. I'm a half hour into a minnfinn treatment before I pull all of the fish out and put them in my QT.

Here is where the questions begin.
I know that eels are not tolerant of copper, so is there any other alternatives that i can treat ALL of my livestock with in my QT?

I am planning on doing a 6 week fallow period with only coral and inverts. Will this be enough?

I almost sold all of my tanks and gear and laid down on the highway. Would this cure velvet?

Thanks! <3

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

So my luck has been atrocious the last week or two. Last weekend, my nano tank that was housing my YT until he grew out some more had a malfunction and my Green BTA melted causing all sorts of chaos to my levels. The YT developed ich. Theres a flame angel, 1 bangaii, and 1 small maroon clown in with him. None of them were affected. I did a water change and he improved, but it came back pretty bad. (this is for sure ich and not velvet). We go get a hospital tank and pump and everything so that I can isolate and medicate. Move all of my rock and get him out and into the bag- has a heart attack and dies 3 seconds in. Devastating.

I did a fallow in my display and thought I was all clear. My sailfin, damsel, 6 line wrasse and dragonface pipe were all survivors. All was good for a bit, so I added a powder blue.

Boy I underestimated velvet immunity.
I finally decided enough is enough. I pulled every frag out of my tank so they wouldn't get lost, and pulled half of the rock out. I'm a half hour into a minnfinn treatment before I pull all of the fish out and put them in my QT.

Here is where the questions begin.
I know that eels are not tolerant of copper, so is there any other alternatives that i can treat ALL of my livestock with in my QT?

I am planning on doing a 6 week fallow period with only coral and inverts. Will this be enough?

I almost sold all of my tanks and gear and laid down on the highway. Would this cure velvet?

Thanks! <3

I think the first thing is to get a firm diagnosis here - can you post a video of the existing fish taken under white light? Hosting on YouTube works well.

If this is ich, you have a choice between copper or hyposalinity. Velvet only responds to copper. Eels often just go off feed during copper, but most start back up when the treatment is done.

MinnFinn is a type of peroxide. It only works in some cases, (dips are rarely 100% effective) and then, you need to move the dipped fish into a non-infected tank, or they just get reinfected.

6 weeks is the low end for a fallow period. It may work at temperatures above 82. Eight weeks is a safer option.

 

[_chiefxr33f]

I almost sold all of my tanks and gear and laid down on the highway. Would this cure velvet?
Not understanding this question. Hyposalinity does not work for velvet leaving treatment to be coppersafe at 2.15 - 2.25ppm with air stone added for aeration and Do monitor ammonia levels with a reliable test kit

I was saying that velvet is making me want to go play in traffic with a blindfold on.

Thank you for all of the advice!!!!
24 hours in to QT and ALL of my fish are alive, the ich-x has my powder blue down to a couple of white spots left on top of the skin, but alot of bumps underneath his skin. Fins look greatly improved. I am going to do a 30% water change and I will take some photographs for you all before re dosing.

 

[_chiefxr33f]

I think the first thing is to get a firm diagnosis here - can you post a video of the existing fish taken under white light? Hosting on YouTube works well.

If this is ich, you have a choice between copper or hyposalinity. Velvet only responds to copper. Eels often just go off feed during copper, but most start back up when the treatment is done.

MinnFinn is a type of peroxide. It only works in some cases, (dips are rarely 100% effective) and then, you need to move the dipped fish into a non-infected tank, or they just get reinfected.

6 weeks is the low end for a fallow period. It may work at temperatures above 82. Eight weeks is a safer option.

I used the minn finn as a pre-treatment, removed them all while it was still active in the system and got them over into my separate qt system. I wanted as much to fall off as possible before putting them in qt.
I am going to go into august with no fish in the display. coral only.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I was saying that velvet is making me want to go play in traffic with a blindfold on.

Thank you for all of the advice!!!!
24 hours in to QT and ALL of my fish are alive, the ich-x has my powder blue down to a couple of white spots left on top of the skin, but alot of bumps underneath his skin. Fins look greatly improved. I am going to do a 30% water change and I will take some photographs for you all before re dosing.

IchX generally does not do much and if you see improvement, I am glad but also concerned in the manner that the bumps which they often get is due to an irritation but at times mixed in with ich and questions if ich is actually gone.
How is fish breathing . . . . normal or labored. Coppersafe is the one thing that does clear these bumps at 2.25ppmfor 3-4 weeks with four preferably and in a separate tank

 

[_chiefxr33f]

IchX generally does not do much and if you see improvement, I am glad but also concerned in the manner that the bumps which they often get is due to an irritation but at times mixed in with ich and questions if ich is actually gone.
How is fish breathing . . . . normal or labored. Coppersafe is the one thing that does clear these bumps at 2.25ppmfor 3-4 weeks with four preferably and in a separate tank

The fish are all breathing fine. My gramma and damsel are a bet lethargic, but still moving around. Clowns dont care. The three tangs all huddle in the corner when i walk into the room. The water was still pretty cloudy when I did the WC and they were not being cooperative for pictures. But all of the fish are alive and free swimming.

 

[_chiefxr33f]

So using I/O and pure RODI water with an assumed 0 ppm copper, i dosed 2 fl oz of copper power tonight after a good water change. My total volume is around 55 gallons including sump. I ordered a hanna checker and it will be here tomorrow.

all in or nothing at all.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

So using I/O and pure RODI water with an assumed 0 ppm copper, i dosed 2 fl oz of copper power tonight after a good water change. My total volume is around 55 gallons including sump. I ordered a hanna checker and it will be here tomorrow.

all in or nothing at all.

What does the CP label say the dose required for 55 gallons? IIRC, their label opts for a low dose, 1.75 ppm? You should calculate for 2.25 - so if you are off a bit in either direction, you’ll still be between 2 and 2.5 ppm.

I just tried a couple of online CP calculators - I may have made a mistake, but one gave a dose 7 times higher than the other!

 

[_chiefxr33f]

So using I/O and pure RODI water with an assumed 0 ppm copper, i dosed 2 fl oz of copper power tonight after a good water change. My total volume is around 55 gallons including sump. I ordered a hanna checker and it will be here tomorrow.

all in or nothing at all.

What does the CP label say the dose required for 55 gallons? IIRC, their label opts for a low dose, 1.75 ppm? You should calculate for 2.25 - so if you are off a bit in either direction, you’ll still be between 2 and 2.5 ppm.

I just tried a couple of online CP calculators - I may have made a mistake, but one gave a dose 7 times higher than the other!

I dosed for about 40 gallons. I will move into precision checking this afternoon!

 

[_chiefxr33f]

First two checks after initial dose and subsequent redose were 1.02 and 1.82. dosed again and spiked it to 3.62. All of the fish are actually loioking great and are still eating except for the snowflake. But i fattened him up pretty good on f/t krill before this started. So hes good.

I did a water change and brought it back down to 2.8ppm, so i'm gonna ride with that for a day or two before I do anything else.

Side note: I have a separate biocube 32 that has been running for a while now, and I got a VERY pretty approx 3 1/2 - 4" YT from petco for 150 bucks today. Super healthy. He will hang in there for a while with the couple of clowns that are currently in there. Massive score though. If he gets sick at least I have a full QT system set up for him now

 

[_chiefxr33f]

Alllllright so heres where we stand as of today.
Got my copper back down to 2.48-2.52 ppm copper. Salinity is 1.026 still. Unsure if i should be heading towards hyposalinity or not.

My scopas tang had bumps for 24 hours and they disappeared. The PBT is still covered in bumps but is swimming actively (not frantically) and is eating in turn with the other tangs on both nori and TDO.

My Royal Gramma is not doing well. It will swim and move, but is incredibly lethargic.

Other than that- everybody is tolerating the treatment well so far. Including my snowflake eel, who ate THREE krill yesterday! He is still eating like a pig. I'm so glad I listened to you guys.

How long should I keep this tank at 2.5ppm?

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Alllllright so heres where we stand as of today.
Got my copper back down to 2.48-2.52 ppm copper. Salinity is 1.026 still. Unsure if i should be heading towards hyposalinity or not.

My scopas tang had bumps for 24 hours and they disappeared. The PBT is still covered in bumps but is swimming actively (not frantically) and is eating in turn with the other tangs on both nori and TDO.

My Royal Gramma is not doing well. It will swim and move, but is incredibly lethargic.

Other than that- everybody is tolerating the treatment well so far. Including my snowflake eel, who ate THREE krill yesterday! He is still eating like a pig. I'm so glad I listened to you guys.

How long should I keep this tank at 2.5ppm?

30 days is the typical full treatment.

The gramma may have some other underlying issue and they tolerate copper pretty well.

The eel may still go off feed a few days into the treatment.......

 

[_chiefxr33f]

24 days in:
The Bad:
Lost the gramma. Probably an injury.
Lost my pipe fish, definitely an injury.
My eel probably killed the gramma and pipefish

The Good:
-ALL of my (surviving) fish are velvet and anything-else-i-can-see free, but are still in QT with copper at 2.5ppm.
-My eel has been eating like a pig the entire time. Literally does not care.
-We are ALMOST there!

Didn't want to inundate yall with dailies, so i figured id wait a bit and just share the success.
I really appreciate the help i've received on here.

Also, the population of... "bugs" in the water has exploded. Idk if these are just different copepods or what- but i'm thinking to test if the velvet is really gone, i'll add a green mandarin and let him go to town for a week or two.