Why cant u keep sps?

90's reefer

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Very interesting read.
I used 50% live 50% caribsea dead.
I dose mb7 every 3 weeks, 10ml in my 120, 5ml in my frag system.
I used some turbo start when I setup the 120, biospira too.
Never had a cycle.
Currently I dose 5ml of kz flatworm stop for coral health.
I have been dosing 5ml daily for over 6 months now.
I also dose a small amount of carbon which is a mix of vinegar, sugar, and iron. 8ml a day and it is just to feed the bacteria and corals and not to control no3 or p04.
I also run close to NSW levels.
I know experienced reefer who have continual issues with dead rock tanks.
They never had issues with live rock tanks.
I am going to send out for the bacterial test in a few weeks to see what my bacterial levels and strains are.
 
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Perry

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I am surprised how people can spend loads of money on small frags, but feel a method like zeovit is too expensive...hmmm
My journal shows nearly a year worth of confusion, coral death, and headaches/heartaches. I began dosing bacteria and carbon source, and started to turn a corner. I still dose daily, under recommendations, slightly, and can show results of my tank going from death, to life. I outlined a specific coral in my journal that came back from the dead, and is now my favorite coral in the tank. My tank started from dry rock, fwiw.
 

drawman

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I am surprised how people can spend loads of money on small frags, but feel a method like zeovit is too expensive...hmmm
My journal shows nearly a year worth of confusion, coral death, and headaches/heartaches. I began dosing bacteria and carbon source, and started to turn a corner. I still dose daily, under recommendations, slightly, and can show results of my tank going from death, to life. I outlined a specific coral in my journal that came back from the dead, and is now my favorite coral in the tank. My tank started from dry rock, fwiw.
As an aside it's kind of cool to see tropic marin's aproach. Keep PO4 in a certain range and carbon dose bacteria for the coral. How well it works who knows but seems plausible.
 

Perry

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As an aside it's kind of cool to see tropic marin's aproach. Keep PO4 in a certain range and carbon dose bacteria for the coral. How well it works who knows but seems plausible.

I dose in the am, acros are definitely extra extended as if they are trying to consume the bacteria. I also believe that algae is being outcompeted for po4, as the bacteria is consuming it, as is corals, then skimmer removes excess, leaving algae less opportunity. A slow process, heck, a true zeovit run tank can take a year to fully convert. That said, not a miracle in a day, in a bottle, but slowly, it goes to work.
 
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ycnibrc

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no able to lower po4 - hanging around 0.1 and 0.2 ppm. i am using 1.5kg of zeolite and set the skimz zar 157 to 2 and dosing 0.5 ml of start3 day and night
Zeolite absorbed amonia which will reduce nitrate. How old is your tank? U can message me your tank parameters and history then i can help u better
 
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ycnibrc

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I dose in the am, acros are definitely extra extended as if they are trying to consume the bacteria. I also believe that algae is being outcompeted for po4, as the bacteria is consuming it, as is corals, then skimmer removes excess, leaving algae less opportunity. A slow process, heck, a true zeovit run tank can take a year to fully convert. That said, not a miracle in a day, in a bottle, but slowly, it goes to work.
The key to zeovit success is dont give up. Your tank will go through a big biological change around 6-12 months and after that it will get better. You will go through an ugly phase but dont panic.
 

Perry

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Hi Anthony,
I run a hybrid system, I don't have any desire to run stones, or even bio media, I have mangroves for deeper nutrient removal. I use AF bacteria and carbon source daily. I use their version of coral snow 3 times per week as well. I use KZ FWS and Coral Booster daily. Additional coral feedings using RU Salty oyster feast, and reef roids. I also use AF Reef salt. It mixes around 7.0dkh, this is how I replenish micro elements. No filter socks, I run active carbon. 10 fish fed well in 60 gallons
 
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ycnibrc

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Hi Anthony,
I run a hybrid system, I don't have any desire to run stones, or even bio media, I have mangroves for deeper nutrient removal. I use AF bacteria and carbon source daily. I use their version of coral snow 3 times per week as well. I use KZ FWS and Coral Booster daily. Additional coral feedings using RU Salty oyster feast, and reef roids. I also use AF Reef salt. It mixes around 7.0dkh, this is how I replenish micro elements. No filter socks, I run active carbon. 10 fish fed well in 60 gallons
I dont use zeolite anymore. When your tank is matured there’s no need for amonia absorption. I only suggested because he has high nitrate. Which ever method workings for you keep doing it.
 

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As an aside it's kind of cool to see tropic marin's aproach. Keep PO4 in a certain range and carbon dose bacteria for the coral. How well it works who knows but seems plausible.
Lou Ekus of TM did a video interview where he describes all this. Very interesting. In short, he suggests that corals can easily get all the nitrate they need directly from the water. But phosphates are consumed indirectly by eating the bacteria that ate the phosphates. Seems plausible.
 

Perry

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Lou Ekus of TM did a video interview where he describes all this. Very interesting. In short, he suggests that corals can easily get all the nitrate they need directly from the water. But phosphates are consumed indirectly by eating the bacteria that ate the phosphates. Seems plausible.

And the video interview you tagged in my journal is most definitely worth a watch :) When you posted, it sort of confirmed what my gut was already saying. Haven't looked back, and things just keep getting better :)
Thanks again Scott!
 
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What about using natural seawater. Do you guys believe that water alone will have the bacteria to seed and maintain different types.
 
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ycnibrc

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What about using natural seawater. Do you guys believe that water alone will have the bacteria to seed and maintain different types.
Depends where’s the water coming from. If its from the reef area then im sure the bacteria is useful however if its from somewhere else then the bacteria might not be specifically beneficial for corals. I believe the water from a place such as indonesia or barrier reef is much different from like Huntington Beach ca :)
 

Mywifeisgunnakillme

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I am a fan of dosing bacteria for sure! I think fresh bacteria additions increases vitality of the little buggers. Them old bacteria cells get worn out and scarred up, mutated, and can't divide and repopulate good nor eat my fish poop as well!

This is true with every micro critter I've played with brewing beer, cider, and hooch for twenty plus years. Old cultures suck...

A professor in a microbiology class showed us a pic of an old yeast cell--and they are literally tons of scars from dividing so many times (google it you'll see). Young cells he said were much better and thats why brewers dont reuse yeast more than a few generations.... yeast and bacteria, tomato versus tomahto when it comes to cell division...

Anyway, dosing the right bacteria makes sense to me.... if the wrong yeast or bacteria gets into and takes over a brew too much--it sucks! Same probably true for reef tanks!

Plus, when i got dinos a few months back i read outcompete 'em with bacteria and phyto and the like. I dosed the ever living you know what of bacteria and phyto and dinos went puff! Bye bye.

Saw some dinos last week so added more bacteria phyto and dinos went puff again!

So if corals like bacteria, get that phosphate without extra fish poop in my tank, that's just another reason to dose fresh and good stuff if you ask me!!!
 
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ycnibrc

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Pro bio vs mb7 vs zeobak? Anybody see any major difference in choosing a source or just pick one and stick to it per instruction?
Its best for you to chose one and stick with it. Every system or method can be successful only if reefer willing to commit to run it. And just like the new tank syndrome it will be ugly for 6-9 months however it will get better after.
Nowadays people wanted instant gratification so they give up before the system complete their course.
 

Big E

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As an aside it's kind of cool to see tropic marin's aproach. Keep PO4 in a certain range and carbon dose bacteria for the coral. How well it works who knows but seems plausible.

I used TM bacto balance for 2 years and it wouldn't keep the P04 levels balanced. Over time it would continue to rise and I would have to intervene with GFO . N03 was kept stable.

I didn't dose any bacteria at the time.

That leads me to think it may be better to go with their Elimi-NP in some instances. It doesn't incorporate the PO4 and N03 in the solution.


A lot may depend on each tank and the amount you feed the fish and your actual fish load.

Imo, they should make a carbon dosing product that only incorporates just N03

-------------------------------------------------------

My goal is a little different in that corals are always fine but over time the P04 rises and those higher levels tend to slow growth. In higher I mean closer to .30 and above. Also with those high levels you get too much algae growth and it can choke out frags.

Right now I'm trying SunnyX old formula but with vinegar(he used vodka) and MB7. So far it's doing fine with N03 but again P04 is up in the .20 range and slowly rising. I'm really not sure if there's enough P04 eating bacteria in MB7 or another brand would work better. Or I may need to up the amount of bacteria I dose.

Any thoughts/opinions?
 
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sepulvd85

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Depends where’s the water coming from. If its from the reef area then im sure the bacteria is useful however if its from somewhere else then the bacteria might not be specifically beneficial for corals. I believe the water from a place such as indonesia or barrier reef is much different from like Huntington Beach ca :)
Lol very true. Its the same ocean water that birtch aquarium uses for their aquarium but you do bring a good point
 
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ycnibrc

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I used TM bacto balance for 2 years and it wouldn't keep the P04 levels balanced. Over time it would continue to rise and I would have to intervene with GFO . N03 was kept stable.

I didn't dose any bacteria at the time.

That leads me to think it may be better to go with their Elimi-NP in some instances. It doesn't incorporate the PO4 and N03 in the solution.


A lot may depend on each tank and the amount you feed the fish and your actual fish load.

Imo, they should make a carbon dosing product that only incorporates just N03

-------------------------------------------------------

My goal is a little different in that corals are always fine but over time the P04 rises and those higher levels tend to slow growth. In higher I mean closer to .30 and above. Also with those high levels you get too much algae growth and it can choke out frags.

Right now I'm trying SunnyX old formula but with vinegar(he used vodka) and MB7. So far it's doing fine with N03 but again P04 is up in the .20 range and slowly rising. I'm really not sure if there's enough P04 eating bacteria in MB7 or another brand would work better. Or I may need to up the amount of bacteria I dose.

Any thoughts/opinions?
For me i treat nitrate and phosphate like alkalinity. How much is your corals consume it plus mechanical export like skimmer and others then how much nutrients u add to your rank through food and fish waste and photosynthesis by product. When u find a neutral zone with a set feeding schedule then u will have a base line of your tank nutrients level. I test my phosphate and nitrate multiple time per day to see the consumption rate just like alkalinity then I know how much feeding equal to nutrients level.
if u only test it 1 time then its not very accurate because your corals will reduce it.
 

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Hi Anthony,
Quick question - coralbooster, can I hook it up to a dosing pump and dose it everyday by reducing the dose into half ? I know the flatworm stop cannot be plugged into a dosing pump, unless i have some stir plate.

Right now I am dosing 10 ml of FW Stop everyday, and coralbooster needs to be dosed every other day. So was wondering if the coral booster need not be stirred, then I can dose 5 ml every day, instead of 10 ml every other day by a dosing pump?

Thank you.
 
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ycnibrc

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Hi Anthony,
Quick question - coralbooster, can I hook it up to a dosing pump and dose it everyday by reducing the dose into half ? I know the flatworm stop cannot be plugged into a dosing pump, unless i have some stir plate.

Right now I am dosing 10 ml of FW Stop everyday, and coralbooster needs to be dosed every other day. So was wondering if the coral booster need not be stirred, then I can dose 5 ml every day, instead of 10 ml every other day by a dosing pump?

Thank you.
Unless u need to refrigerate u can dose. Just figure out your tank dosage and divided to your schedule. For my tank i dose MWF and TUE THU SAT for bbalance and pohl extra
 
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