Copper power with Kanaplex or Ruby Reef Rally?

[th365thli]

Recent events have me decide it best for me to treat my FOWLR display tank. I've just about moved all the inverts into a separate tank to go fallow.

I plan on using Copper Power. For full coverage, would I be able to do Kanaplex or Ruby Rally at the same time? I also have Prazi but I don't suspect flukes just yet, and I read I should do that after Copper treatment?

I'm pretty sure my Purple tang has 3 ich spots. My Hippo keeps scratching at the rocks but I don't see any spots. My Chocolate tang seems to have a growth or wound at the top of it's dorsal fin, hence why I was asking about anti-biotics as well. Is a Copperband Butterfly sensitive to Copper Power?

I've had 2 new fish die on me in this tank, and while the other denizens are healthy, I'm taking no chances.

 

[Big G]

Is a Copperband Butterfly sensitive to Copper Power?

Yes, they usually are quite sensitive. Often they quit eating.

 

[th365thli]

Yes, they usually are quite sensitive. Often they quit eating.

Ugh, this makes things harder. I almost have no choice but to bite the bullet and do it and hope it still eats

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Recent events have me decide it best for me to treat my FOWLR display tank. I've just about moved all the inverts into a separate tank to go fallow.

I plan on using Copper Power. For full coverage, would I be able to do Kanaplex or Ruby Rally at the same time? I also have Prazi but I don't suspect flukes just yet, and I read I should do that after Copper treatment?

I'm pretty sure my Purple tang has 3 ich spots. My Hippo keeps scratching at the rocks but I don't see any spots. My Chocolate tang seems to have a growth or wound at the top of it's dorsal fin, hence why I was asking about anti-biotics as well. Is a Copperband Butterfly sensitive to Copper Power?

I've had 2 new fish die on me in this tank, and while the other denizens are healthy, I'm taking no chances.

I wouldn’t treat with kanaplex unless you see a specific bacterial disease to treat. Rally pro overlaps with copper in efficacy so I would skip that.
I’ve used coppersafe many times on copperbands with no issues other than copperbands are just plain delicate. Copper power would be essentially the same.
Personally, I won’t buy copperbands unless they come from Australia, the mortality rate is just too high for me otherwise.
I would follow up the copper with either Prazipro or general cure.
Jay

 

[th365thli]

I wouldn’t treat with kanaplex unless you see a specific bacterial disease to treat. Rally pro overlaps with copper in efficacy so I would skip that.
I’ve used coppersafe many times on copperbands with no issues other than copperbands are just plain delicate. Copper power would be essentially the same.
Personally, I won’t buy copperbands unless they come from Australia, the mortality rate is just too high for me otherwise.
I would follow up the copper with either Prazipro or general cure.
Jay

Good to know. It likes live oyster now, I'll ride the line getting it weaned on frozen and not treating display too late. The ich seems like the beginning stages, only three spots on the purple.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Recent events have me decide it best for me to treat my FOWLR display tank. I've just about moved all the inverts into a separate tank to go fallow.

I plan on using Copper Power. For full coverage, would I be able to do Kanaplex or Ruby Rally at the same time? I also have Prazi but I don't suspect flukes just yet, and I read I should do that after Copper treatment?

I'm pretty sure my Purple tang has 3 ich spots. My Hippo keeps scratching at the rocks but I don't see any spots. My Chocolate tang seems to have a growth or wound at the top of it's dorsal fin, hence why I was asking about anti-biotics as well. Is a Copperband Butterfly sensitive to Copper Power?

I've had 2 new fish die on me in this tank, and while the other denizens are healthy, I'm taking no chances.

before proceeding. please post pics under white lighting as this is thus far guesses and mixing meds can often not end well. Lets identify what you have first.
Ich is often not limited to three dots and will generally multiply daily. Flukes which is a possibility - Often loss of appetite, flashing, darting, heavy breathing and even appears as fish is yawning. Velvet similar and fish will swim in front of power heads or favor the water surface, along with heavy breathing.

 

[th365thli]

before proceeding. please post pics under white lighting as this is thus far guesses and mixing meds can often not end well. Lets identify what you have first.
Ich is often not limited to three dots and will generally multiply daily. Flukes which is a possibility - Often loss of appetite, flashing, darting, heavy breathing and even appears as fish is yawning. Velvet similar and fish will swim in front of power heads or favor the water surface, along with heavy breathing.

I'll take a video tomorrow when lights are back on, but for now I don't think it's velvet *knock on wood*. No swimming in front of powerheads or external signs.

The three spots on the purple look like ich. I'll see what it looks like tmrw or the coming days. If they disappear I feel like that's more evidence for ich. Flukes is a possibility, the Lavender tang occasionally twitches, same with the Hippo Tang with the Hippo tang flashing on rocks. Both don't have any external signs, though the Lavender looks a little beatup. Tbh some of these fish look beat up from shipping so it's hard to tell if flukes or scrapes or whatever

I figure Copper + Prazi is such a ubiquitous treatment it's a good starting point to cover bases and ensure the Display is healthy.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I'll take a video tomorrow when lights are back on, but for now I don't think it's velvet *knock on wood*. No swimming in front of powerheads or external signs.

The three spots on the purple look like ich. I'll see what it looks like tmrw or the coming days. If they disappear I feel like that's more evidence for ich. Flukes is a possibility, the Lavender tang occasionally twitches, same with the Hippo Tang with the Hippo tang flashing on rocks. Both don't have any external signs, though the Lavender looks a little beatup. Tbh some of these fish look beat up from shipping so it's hard to tell if flukes or scrapes or whatever

I figure Copper + Prazi is such a ubiquitous treatment it's a good starting point to cover bases and ensure the Display is healthy.

Often you wont see flukes with the naked eye.
I again would not mix meds and you can give fish a FW dip to buy some time if flukes present but address protozans first. It can even be sand you see and you will know in the morning as the dots will be gone or have multiplied.

 

[Big G]

Ugh, this makes things harder. I almost have no choice but to bite the bullet and do it and hope it still eats

Using a Hanna Copper Checker, you can slowly raise the copper level to therapeutic while watching for copper sensitivity in an individual fish. Crucial to have a solid QT setup that moderates the copper effects on water quality to avoid a plethora of problems that can quickly snowball with a Copperband.

 

[th365thli]

Often you wont see flukes with the naked eye.
I again would not mix meds and you can give fish a FW dip to buy some time if flukes present but address protozans first. It can even be sand you see and you will know in the morning as the dots will be gone or have multiplied.

For sure, I will follow the advice of Jay which is to treat with copper first then prazi, should symptoms worsen

 

[th365thli]

Using a Hanna Copper Checker, you can slowly raise the copper level to therapeutic while watching for copper sensitivity in an individual fish. Crucial to have a solid QT setup that moderates the copper effects on water quality to avoid a plethora of problems that can quickly snowball with a Copperband.

I don't have a big enough quarantine tank for all my fish which is why I'm treating main display, kind of like a big quarantine.

 

[Big G]

I don't have a big enough quarantine tank for all my fish which is why I'm treating main display, kind of like a big quarantine.

Well that's actually an advantage for the fish's health. Will be much easier to maintain water quality throughout the process. Huge advantage.

 

[th365thli]

Often you wont see flukes with the naked eye.
I again would not mix meds and you can give fish a FW dip to buy some time if flukes present but address protozans first. It can even be sand you see and you will know in the morning as the dots will be gone or have multiplied.

I took a video of the tang. In the middle as it's eating nori you can see the spot on its right flank. Looks like ich to me, especially the way the mucous us "raised" around it. Has a couple on the other side.

Side note, after getting the copperband on raw oysters it seems to like the frozen clams now. It even picks at nori. No dice on frozen mysis yet but I'll keep trying

Purple tang possible ich

youtube.com

 

[th365thli]

 

[th365thli]

@Jay Hemdal what do you think, ich spot? The bubbles are deceiving but the spot is right in the middle of the flank, should be on video as well

 

[Jay Hemdal]

@Jay Hemdal what do you think, ich spot? The bubbles are deceiving but the spot is right in the middle of the flank, should be on video as well

Tough to say. What I always tell people is to watch over time. Ich doesn’t kill until the spots get into the hundreds. This gives you time to prepare and to confirm the diagnosis - watch for this spot to go away and then new spots showing n in new locations, generally increasing in numbers - that is more likely ich then.
If the spot stays there for days, or goes away and no new spots return, then it isn’t ich.

Jay

 

[th365thli]

Tough to say. What I always tell people is to watch over time. Ich doesn’t kill until the spots get into the hundreds. This gives you time to prepare and to confirm the diagnosis - watch for this spot to go away and then new spots showing n in new locations, generally increasing in numbers - that is more likely ich then.
If the spot stays there for days, or goes away and no new spots return, then it isn’t ich.

Jay

Thanks Jay, I just about moved the last of my inverts to a different tank? What do you think about me just treating the main display anyways as a precaution, and hitting myself for not quarantining first.

The fish seem robust, the only one I'm worried about is the copperband, but I have copper power and will slowly ramp up.

 

[th365thli]

The blue hippo keeps scratching itself on rocks and seems to be breathing fast. Lavendar tang sometimes flashes and twitches as well. This has been increasing in frequency for the past 3 days. Decided to act and dosed entire tank prazipro. 175 gallon system, minus rock and sand and equipment, dosed 6 teaspoons good for 120 gallons, slightly conservative

Ive read prazipro is pretty gentle on fish so I decided to do the prazi treatment first. Could be imagining but noticed the lavender tang come out and start shaking a little. Hippo is still sleeping. We'll see if this helps and kills possible flukes.

I chose to do prazi before copper because of the flashing and fast breathing without obvious external signs. It was getting often enough that I decided to take my chances with the prazi first. Plus, the treatment time with prazi is shorter.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

The blue hippo keeps scratching itself on rocks and seems to be breathing fast. Lavendar tang sometimes flashes and twitches as well. This has been increasing in frequency for the past 3 days. Decided to act and dosed entire tank prazipro. 175 gallon system, minus rock and sand and equipment, dosed 6 teaspoons good for 120 gallons, slightly conservative

Ive read prazipro is pretty gentle on fish so I decided to do the prazi treatment first. Could be imagining but noticed the lavender tang come out and start shaking a little. Hippo is still sleeping. We'll see if this helps and kills possible flukes.

I chose to do prazi before copper because of the flashing and fast breathing without obvious external signs. It was getting often enough that I decided to take my chances with the prazi first. Plus, the treatment time with prazi is shorter.

The trouble with that is this - if a protozoan (ich or velvet) takes off during the prazi treatment (which needs to be two treatments, 8 or 9 days apart) you'll then need to start copper during the prazi treatment, and although that can be done, it is more stressful to the fish. Also, I noted you said you were going to "slowly ramp up the copper" - you may not have that luxury.

The rapid breathing on the tang could be protozoans or flukes - so an argument could be made to go wither way. I was thinking the tank has ich based on your comments, but if you are less sure of that, then prazi first would be a safer risk.

Jay

 

[th365thli]

The trouble with that is this - if a protozoan (ich or velvet) takes off during the prazi treatment (which needs to be two treatments, 8 or 9 days apart) you'll then need to start copper during the prazi treatment, and although that can be done, it is more stressful to the fish. Also, I noted you said you were going to "slowly ramp up the copper" - you may not have that luxury.

The rapid breathing on the tang could be protozoans or flukes - so an argument could be made to go wither way. I was thinking the tank has ich based on your comments, but if you are less sure of that, then prazi first would be a safer risk.

Jay

100 percent correct Jay, I almost went either way but settled on prazi due to the gentler nature and current symptoms. I hope I made the right choice