DIY Manganese Recipe Library

It’s really irritating they don’t just put NSW levels next to the reading.
It varies depending on location. :)
 
Interesting post by @Hans-Werner.

I have been toying with the idea of dosing Mn but unsure of the benefit. Being used quickly in the tank I suppose is one measure that it’s useful to something, but I cannot think of anecdotes where reefers think dosing Mn had positive results. The common perception is it’s good for Gonipora. And it’s on Randy’s list of things to dose.

In iron and manganese you can overdose as much as you want, most or all of it will be out of the water in just a few days. When you take your next water sample in a few weeks or months, concentrations will have dropped back to original levels, this is almost 100 % sure.

Even chasing numbers with daily dosing of iron and manganese makes little sense. You have to dose so much because of the rapid precipitation by bacteria that you will more likely harm your tank than doing good.

Manganese is used by all organisms. I do not know what levels of what forms are needed in reef tanks to give them what they want.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manganese_in_biology
Manganese is an essential biological element in all organisms. It is used in many enzymes and proteins. It is essential in plants.

To piggy back on Hans' comments, I agree that Mn to me represents a real limitation of the "dose and test" approach. Much moreso than most other elements.

After watching ICP-MS on my system for months, sometimes with no Mn input, sometimes with a trace supplement (unknown Mn level), sometimes with water changes (known several ppb/week Mn input) - Mn was always depleted down to nearly the LOD of ICP-MS <0.2ppb.

Also observationally, during this time - I note more microalgae flushes of brown/green on the glass when Mn is being input vs not. That along with other things I've observed makes me think Mn is likely acting as a limiter for some photosynthetic growth.

So - yes my Mn is low. Whether I dose none, a little, or a lot - it's still essentially within plausible measurement error of zero. If I was to be determined and added so much Mn that I actually started to accumulate it to easily measureable levels somehow, then presumably exponentially growing microalgae (diatoms, etc) would multiply until they've depleted something else. That doesn't seem desirable either.

I'm not sure Natural Seawater levels as a guide is helpful in this context either. If I can add 1x or 10x or 30x NSW levels to the tank weekly and it stays just as depleted as it was with no additions, then I don't see how NSW tells me anything about how much should be going in.

Posting this because I don't have good answers. My best guess at this point is that for Mn a "target level" isn't a great idea, a target input rate (ppb/week or day) might be a more sensible approach. I have no idea what that target input rate should be, other than I can use the fact that a 10-15% water change per week on my system with my salt is adding 3-5ppb Mn per week, and that doesn't seem detrimental, and I see organism response. And Hans' point - observe the tank carefully has to be part of it.
 
To piggy back on Hans' comments, I agree that Mn to me represents a real limitation of the "dose and test" approach. Much moreso than most other elements.

After watching ICP-MS on my system for months, sometimes with no Mn input, sometimes with a trace supplement (unknown Mn level), sometimes with water changes (known several ppb/week Mn input) - Mn was always depleted down to nearly the LOD of ICP-MS <0.2ppb.

Also observationally, during this time - I note more microalgae flushes of brown/green on the glass when Mn is being input vs not. That along with other things I've observed makes me think Mn is likely acting as a limiter for some photosynthetic growth.

So - yes my Mn is low. Whether I dose none, a little, or a lot - it's still essentially within plausible measurement error of zero. If I was to be determined and added so much Mn that I actually started to accumulate it to easily measureable levels somehow, then presumably exponentially growing microalgae (diatoms, etc) would multiply until they've depleted something else. That doesn't seem desirable either.

I'm not sure Natural Seawater levels as a guide is helpful in this context either. If I can add 1x or 10x or 30x NSW levels to the tank weekly and it stays just as depleted as it was with no additions, then I don't see how NSW tells me anything about how much should be going in.

Posting this because I don't have good answers. My best guess at this point is that for Mn a "target level" isn't a great idea, a target input rate (ppb/week or day) might be a more sensible approach. I have no idea what that target input rate should be, other than I can use the fact that a 10-15% water change per week on my system with my salt is adding 3-5ppb Mn per week, and that doesn't seem detrimental, and I see organism response. And Hans' point - observe the tank carefully has to be part of it.
Thank you, this is in accordance with my own experience, as you have already pointed out.

I just would add, dosing manganese is not a bad thing. In my experience dosage of manganese should be higher than that of iron. With iron you get unwanted effects of with regular high dosing quite early. My impression was that somehow manganese reduced the negative effects of iron. Manganese is the transition metal with the highest dosage in my trace element additives.

Although it is out of the water so quickly, manganese has effects, as you also describe it. Dosing manganese absolutely makes sense. I cannot describe it better than you did in your last paragraph.

My approach is to dose manganese and other trace metals automatically with the daily calcium dosing.
 
I just would add, dosing manganese is not a bad thing. In my experience dosage of manganese should be higher than that of iron.
I was thinking whether I had any basis to decide whether I like this or not, then I realized the majority of salt mixes agree with you and have more Mn than Fe. Sometimes much more.
 
I was thinking whether I had any basis to decide whether I like this or not, then I realized the majority of salt mixes agree with you and have more Mn than Fe. Sometimes much more.
Yes, most likely because it is such a common impurity in certain salt deposits. However, it is hard for me to see the effects of iron and manganese in water changes. Maybe water changes fill up reserves but after manganese and iron are out of the water again there is only little effect of these metals, maybe some basic supply.

Only in regular daily dosing I get the effects I can see and I can judge and classify for its possible biochemical background like biological redox effects.

It is an interesting biological duality that iron and manganese have the ability to form or to destroy radicals, they are kind of Janus-faced. Frequently both metals kind of cooperate.
 
1000010357.jpg

Whats the difference between these 2? I ordered this sometime ago can it still be used?
@Miami Reef I was just going to start trying to mix this up and noticed it’s slightly different. Any issues?
 

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@Miami Reef I was just going to start trying to mix this up and noticed it’s slightly different. Any issues?
That looks like Choline chloride. We need Manganese chloride or any of the other manganese variants in this thread.
 
That looks like Choline chloride. We need Manganese chloride or any of the other manganese variants in this thread.
@Miami Reef

This is the wrapper I just took off, thoughts? Think they wrapped the wrong product?
 

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@Miami Reef

This is the wrapper I just took off, thoughts? Think they wrapped the wrong product?
Can you send a picture of the chemical inside? I have the correct product from the same company, and I’m curious if our versions differ.

I believe they sent the wrong product.
 
Can you send a picture of the chemical inside? I have the correct product from the same company, and I’m curious if our versions differ.

I believe they sent the wrong product.
@Miami Reef please see attached. Thanks for your attention on this. I’m thinking I need to return it as they labeled the out material wrong.
 

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Dude, thanks man. Had you not jumped in and also had you not had that one post, I would have started dosing this stuff. Thanks man, I’ll pay it forward.
You’re welcome!

Happy reefing!
 
I deleted a Miami post because it referred to a version of a manganese tetrachloride recipe of mine that had an error. I'm trying to get it cleaned up, but here's the correct recipe:

Manganese(II) chloride tetrahydrate is 28% manganese by weight.

Here's a recipe:

Dissolve 1 gram in 1000 mL (grams) fresh water. Manganese = 280 ppm = 280 mg/l = 280 ug/mL.

Add 1 mL (280 ug) of that to 100 mL of fresh water. Mn = 2.8 ug/mL

Add 13.5 mL of that to 100 gallons of tank water. Conc boost to tank = 0.1 ug/L Mn. :)
Can I dose the more concentrated 1000 ml, 280ppm solution? What would be the raise per 100 gallon of tank water if I did?
 
So, my replacement from Amazon came today. I guess. I need to find a new vendor to buy from…
Get Manganese Gluconate. It’s food grade, too.

https://a.co/d/6jkIdh5

Here’s the recipe for manganese gluconate by Randy:

Manganese gluconate is 12.4% manganese by weight.

Dissolve 1 gram of the solid material in 1 L of RO/DI. That solution contains 124 mg of manganese, so the concentration is 124 mg/L or 124 ug/mL.

Adding 1 mL to 100 L of tank water will boost aquarium manganese levels by 124 ug per 100 L or 1.24 ug/L.


Original source:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/diy-for-manganese.1084418/post-13137396
 
I got in the Manganese(II) chloride tetrahydrate today and mixed .5gm in 500ml of ro/di water ( I split the 1gm to 1000ml to make a smaller portion, but I want a stronger dose so I don’t want to dilute it the second time. Please someone tell me if my math is correct.

That concentration should be 280 ug/ml. Dosing 1ml to 100 L of tank water should boost aquarium Manganese level to 2.8 ug/l, right??
 
Can I dose the more concentrated 1000 ml, 280ppm solution? What would be the raise per 100 gallon of tank water if I did?

Sure. 1 mL of 280 ppm (contains 280 ug) added to 100 gallons boosts manganese by 0.74 ug/L.
 

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