EB832 Death Screen?

[Reefer Reboot]

So I'm skimming through R2R when out of the blue my tank starts turning on and off. Tried a little troubleshooting and found that all of the 120v plugs would oscillate, 3 seconds off, 19 seconds on. When I turned off my return pump and display lights the other six outlets would stay on. So I unplugged the return pump and display light, turned the now empty 120v plugs back on and it started to oscillate again. (24 volt systems remain operational at all times.) Next, after verifying the latest updates and a little web searching, I turned it all off, unplugged everything from the EB832, rebooted the control base unit, reinstalled the EB832 and made sure the circuit breaker on the back was still set. Now none of the 120 v plugs will supply power. The LED indicator lights turn on showing that it is receiving the commands to turn on. Also on the Fusion screen I now have a red exclamation point on the EB832 tile which reads zero watts, amps and volts.

I'm sure I'll have to open a ticket with Neptune but was wondering if any one else has other troubleshooting ideas or experiences like this. I saw a couple of posts on the Neptune forum like this so I think It's toast. (Rant time, seriously, not even three years and they die! Just had to get that out.)

 

[robbyg]

When you plug it in now is the 24V still there or has that also died?
If that is gone then I suspect the power supply inside had some bad capacitors and the DC voltage was not clean so it caused the oscillations and then finally died. Stuff happens, just be thankful you were home when this happened. BTW what was powering your controller? Another Powerbar?

 

[Reefer Reboot]

The 24V systems still work as well as all the probes, Dos, PAR meter, etc. It is only the 120VAC plugs that are nonresponsive. The Base unit is plugged into a surge protection device at the wall outlet and I only have the one EB832 power supply.
Yeah, stuff does happen. Don't get me wrong, I do like the Apex system, they just seems to have an unusual amount of "stuff" happening to the EB832 power supplies.
Guess I'll just chock it up to operating cost and get another one to keep the tank running before seeing about getting this one fixed or replaced.

 

[rkpetersen]

The EB832 is painfully unreliable. Multiple modes of failure.
In less than 4 years, I've had to replace 2.
My LFS sees people bringing in failed ones on a regular basis as well.

 

[DarthSimon]

I always have a backup EB832.... Not a bad practice for the future guys....

 

[Reefer Reboot]

Back up indeed! Yep, and that's a shame because I feel like they have some good ideas with their system. From a business point of view, this unnecessarily drags down their reputation. The fact that they bundle so many critical power and communication items into one unit might make for a cleaner looking setup and be more profitable at the onset but how many customers do they ultimately end up losing in the long run due to this? As paying customers we have every right to tell them when they are missing out on "opportunities for improvement". So, with that in mind, instead of just complaining about it, I would like to offer up a possible solution to be considered. First, split up all the power supplies by voltage (120v, 24v, link ports) into their own modules. (I would envision dividing them up into twos, i.e. two 120v plugs per module. That way if one fails you don’t lose them all.) Then make up a modular rack/rail mounting system where the power and AquaBus ports go through the mounting system which will connect all the modules together. This alone will make for a cleaner setup by eliminating several wires. Each module would initially come with their own rack mounting rail and all the rails would be able to connect to each other when mounted on whatever a person puts their controller on. Then each module (EB832, DOS, FMM, PAR, etc.…) would simply attach to the rail. That way if/when a module failed it would be as simple as pulling the dead one off and putting the replacement one on. The rest of the system would continue to work. As it is now, if the EB832 goes out you end up losing more than one voltage system.

(;HilariousFor legal purposes, I put this idea out there for anyone to use. No compensation required or desired. I just want to see a better system for the hobbyists.;Hilarious)

 

[rkpetersen]

Back up indeed! Yep, and that's a shame because I feel like they have some good ideas with their system. From a business point of view, this unnecessarily drags down their reputation. The fact that they bundle so many critical power and communication items into one unit might make for a cleaner looking setup and be more profitable at the onset but how many customers do they ultimately end up losing in the long run due to this? As paying customers we have every right to tell them when they are missing out on "opportunities for improvement". So, with that in mind, instead of just complaining about it, I would like to offer up a possible solution to be considered. First, split up all the power supplies by voltage (120v, 24v, link ports) into their own modules. (I would envision dividing them up into twos, i.e. two 120v plugs per module. That way if one fails you don’t lose them all.) Then make up a modular rack/rail mounting system where the power and AquaBus ports go through the mounting system which will connect all the modules together. This alone will make for a cleaner setup by eliminating several wires. Each module would initially come with their own rack mounting rail and all the rails would be able to connect to each other when mounted on whatever a person puts their controller on. Then each module (EB832, DOS, FMM, PAR, etc.…) would simply attach to the rail. That way if/when a module failed it would be as simple as pulling the dead one off and putting the replacement one on. The rest of the system would continue to work. As it is now, if the EB832 goes out you end up losing more than one voltage system.

(;HilariousFor legal purposes, I put this idea out there for anyone to use. No compensation required or desired. I just want to see a better system for the hobbyists.;Hilarious)

The problem with the EB832 isn't that it includes too many features. All of them can be easily built into a stable secure device the size of the EB832. The problem is that the device is made with relatively cheap components and poorly built as well. People have disassembled EB832s and what you find inside is scary. I love my Apex systems but I would pay for a higher quality EB. Especially because replacing a failed one and then getting your system back to rights is massively stressful and time-consuming.

 

[DWill]

I’ve not experienced any problems with any part of my Apex system. But it’s only been up and running about 10 weeks.

That said, I know problems are coming. I agree with the comments about build quality. I’ve haven’t looked at the inside of any component of the Apex, I when they fail outside of the warranty period. But… given the low quality of the exterior of the components I can only imagine what’s on the inside.

I was keenly aware of the low build quality going in though, it’s fairly well documented on social media. So, I budgeted funds to buy a pre-owned Apex and power bar as backup. So while it won’t be plug and play necessarily my tank won’t be down for too long when my Apex fails.

The other precaution I took is using a different system for my return pump, lights and flow pumps. All are are or soon will be Echotech products running through Mobius. Mobius itself has its own issues but at least not all of my tank runs on one system.

 

[Reefer Reboot]

While I agree with the less than desirable quality of the components within the EB832s, in today's world unfortunately, lower price takes precedence over true quality. This requires replacements of said items, which in the long run creates a true higher cost. So until the quality improves we are stuck with either replacing said items on a regular basis or going with another manufacturer (where we most likely will experience the same issues). It is to this end that I feel a truly modular system where all differing components are separated would be a great improvement. Why replace so much when only a portion has gone bad? Just to create landfill fillers? To each their own, but to me it just seems a bit irresponsible on economic and ecological fronts. Just my opinion.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Try unplugging all plugs on eb8 and unplugging eb832
Plub eb8 back in and press little yellow nipple in and plug in components and see if it woke up

 

[AcanthurusRex]

There is a high-side regulator that powers the ICs that measure current. I believe this failed on mine. It looks like another off the shelf component similar to the 24VDC supply. Never fixed it.

 

[Reefer Reboot]

Try unplugging all plugs on eb8 and unplugging eb832
Plub eb8 back in and press little yellow nipple in and plug in components and see if it woke up

Already tried that, just got worse but thanks for the input.

There is a high-side regulator that powers the ICs that measure current. I believe this failed on mine. It looks like another off the shelf component similar to the 24VDC supply. Never fixed it.

Good to know. Once I replace this one I'll dissect it in my "free time".

 

[roman1]

I have two dead ones having the same issues

 

[User1]

I have a eb832 for 2 years without a hitch. Power surge came into our neighborhood and wrecked a lot of havoc with homeowners TVs, appliances, and other things. I lost solar inverter, 2 refrigerators, etc. Anyway the eb832 worked great even after that but not at first. At first after the surge nothing worked on the bar but then I found the yellow tab and reset it after disconnecting everything. Few months later though it did give out, I sent it in for repair, and then fixed it for 50 bucks I think it was. Seemed ok to me.

During that episode and going back to my previous life in the military with redundancy built in to aircraft I did the match and bought a spare. I also picked up a spare return pump, heater, and even a light. Should anything happen I am prepared. Can leave them boxed up (as I did with the light) or choose to install them but sitting idol (second energy bar). Pumps I installed and all are the same so can be reconfigured should something happen between the two returns and skimmer.

My better half looked at me and said ok, redundancy makes sense and then proceeded to order a second wine fridge...go figure but she had a point Anyway I can't speak for the public on the eb's reliability but mine has been running pretty good as of late but the long and short of it is this.

Anyone with a reef tank should have spare parts readily available be it energy bar, light, heater, or other critical life component.

 

[HuneyBear]

Back up indeed! Yep, and that's a shame because I feel like they have some good ideas with their system. From a business point of view, this unnecessarily drags down their reputation. The fact that they bundle so many critical power and communication items into one unit might make for a cleaner looking setup and be more profitable at the onset but how many customers do they ultimately end up losing in the long run due to this? As paying customers we have every right to tell them when they are missing out on "opportunities for improvement". So, with that in mind, instead of just complaining about it, I would like to offer up a possible solution to be considered. First, split up all the power supplies by voltage (120v, 24v, link ports) into their own modules. (I would envision dividing them up into twos, i.e. two 120v plugs per module. That way if one fails you don’t lose them all.) Then make up a modular rack/rail mounting system where the power and AquaBus ports go through the mounting system which will connect all the modules together. This alone will make for a cleaner setup by eliminating several wires. Each module would initially come with their own rack mounting rail and all the rails would be able to connect to each other when mounted on whatever a person puts their controller on. Then each module (EB832, DOS, FMM, PAR, etc.…) would simply attach to the rail. That way if/when a module failed it would be as simple as pulling the dead one off and putting the replacement one on. The rest of the system would continue to work. As it is now, if the EB832 goes out you end up losing more than one voltage system.

(;HilariousFor legal purposes, I put this idea out there for anyone to use. No compensation required or desired. I just want to see a better system for the hobbyists.;Hilarious)

You know your idea sounds pretty good. To bad it’s basically been in use for many years already. It’s called a PLC and they run almost every factory today. They take up a lot of space because of the the modular parts like you said. Controllers are basically PLC-lite. They just made stuff smaller for practicality. Ghl was actually a full PLC company originally.

I don’t understand how you have a system that you have to keep spare complete or almost complete systems because of chances of failure. When I was looking at controllers I talked to a lot of my club members and the ones that had them had a lot to say about them and showed me the piles of dead parts and all of their extra stuff. I looked elsewhere and never looked back.

 

[User1]

I don’t understand how you have a system that you have to keep spare complete or almost complete systems because of chances of failure.

Oh, I don't know let me try and help you out.

Do you own a car? Do you have a spare tire? Do you carry jumper cables?
Do you scuba dive? Do you have a secondary regulator? Spare air? Whistle? Flag?
Do you rent a home? Own a house? If do, do you keep spare lightbulbs? Toilet paper?
Do you sky dive? Have an emergency chute?
Heard of NASA? Yeah, they are big on redundancy.
Aircraft? Yeah - takes two engines to cross the Pacific or Atlantic with passengers.
Military? Yeah, we love spares too. Things like WRISK kits fundamental and I won't even go into air frames or personal gear.

So to your point about not understanding how anyone can have a system that you "have" to keep a spare is rather silly. A properly designed system will have some form of spare parts or redundancy built in. It can be in they system but not in use as a hot spare or it can be in a box for hot swap. If you don't I'd wager your chances of a failure are 75% if not higher and a total loss.

C19 alone should have made people pay attention due to supply chain difficulties, transportation priority changes, and various levels of lock down / shelter in place making overnight replacements scarce.

Note: This does not mean double of everything. What it does mean is that critical components be it a heater, pump, light, water, salt, or a container large enough to hold live stock should a tank fail be considered in case the hobbyist not being able to replace it in due time.

Don't take this the wrong way but this is pretty much common sense to me.

 

[Waters]

Oh, I don't know let me try and help you out.

Do you own a car? Do you have a spare tire? Do you carry jumper cables?
Do you scuba dive? Do you have a secondary regulator? Spare air? Whistle? Flag?
Do you rent a home? Own a house? If do, do you keep spare lightbulbs? Toilet paper?
Do you sky dive? Have an emergency chute?
Heard of NASA? Yeah, they are big on redundancy.
Aircraft? Yeah - takes two engines to cross the Pacific or Atlantic with passengers.
Military? Yeah, we love spares too. Things like WRISK kits fundamental and I won't even go into air frames or personal gear.

So to your point about not understanding how anyone can have a system that you "have" to keep a spare is rather silly. A properly designed system will have some form of spare parts or redundancy built in. It can be in they system but not in use as a hot spare or it can be in a box for hot swap. If you don't I'd wager your chances of a failure are 75% if not higher and a total loss.

C19 alone should have made people pay attention due to supply chain difficulties, transportation priority changes, and various levels of lock down / shelter in place making overnight replacements scarce.

Note: This does not mean double of everything. What it does mean is that critical components be it a heater, pump, light, water, salt, or a container large enough to hold live stock should a tank fail be considered in case the hobbyist not being able to replace it in due time.

Don't take this the wrong way but this is pretty much common sense to me.

While I agree that a lot of components are considered no brainers as to keeping spares (heaters for example), I don't believe that Apex components should need to be doubled up just due to their high probability of failure. While I see your argument, in an ideal world I would buy two of everything and have an exact duplicate tank set up in a spare room ready to be swapped out....but that isn't feasible. At some point you have to be able to trust the quality of the equipment that you are using. So that being said, if an aquarist doesn't want to keep duplicates of expensive items should they not keep and use something like an Apex, which is a luxury and not a requirement? Based on how many Apex failures I have had over the years, I am starting to think they should just sell everything in a two pack lol. The EB8232 doesn't need to be that complicated....I have surge protectors that are 20 years old and still working

 

[Dub]

Oh, I don't know let me try and help you out.

Do you own a car? Do you have a spare tire? Do you carry jumper cables?
Do you scuba dive? Do you have a secondary regulator? Spare air? Whistle? Flag?
Do you rent a home? Own a house? If do, do you keep spare lightbulbs? Toilet paper?
Do you sky dive? Have an emergency chute?
Heard of NASA? Yeah, they are big on redundancy.
Aircraft? Yeah - takes two engines to cross the Pacific or Atlantic with passengers.
Military? Yeah, we love spares too. Things like WRISK kits fundamental and I won't even go into air frames or personal gear.

So to your point about not understanding how anyone can have a system that you "have" to keep a spare is rather silly. A properly designed system will have some form of spare parts or redundancy built in. It can be in they system but not in use as a hot spare or it can be in a box for hot swap. If you don't I'd wager your chances of a failure are 75% if not higher and a total loss.

C19 alone should have made people pay attention due to supply chain difficulties, transportation priority changes, and various levels of lock down / shelter in place making overnight replacements scarce.

Note: This does not mean double of everything. What it does mean is that critical components be it a heater, pump, light, water, salt, or a container large enough to hold live stock should a tank fail be considered in case the hobbyist not being able to replace it in due time.

Don't take this the wrong way but this is pretty much common sense to me.

I hear the argument but see it only as an excuse to accept shoddy equipment. Would you accept a light bulb that only lasted 2 weeks, a car that was scrap at the end of 6 months? NO!! You would not!! One expects a reasonable use out of a product. I don’t believe 1 or 2 years useful life is a reasonable life for electronic gear maybe car tires that take a great deal of abuse but not electronic gear being used as it was designed to be used unless the design was to fail! GET REAL FOLKS!!

 

[User1]

I hear the argument but see it only as an excuse to accept shoddy equipment. Would you accept a light bulb that only lasted 2 weeks, a car that was scrap at the end of 6 months? NO!! You would not!! One expects a reasonable use out of a product. I don’t believe 1 or 2 years useful life is a reasonable life for electronic gear maybe car tires that take a great deal of abuse but not electronic gear being used as it was designed to be used unless the design was to fail! GET REAL FOLKS!!

We agree on reasonable use or expected life of a product. However that doesn't negate the spare. As I noted above spares are spares and redundancy is a design. It seems the perspective you have is maybe related to this product. That is fine and I'm not here to change that. However, the use case still exists regardless of the brand. If it doesn't that that hobbyist is taking a chance or willing to accept that risk level.

While I agree that a lot of components are considered no brainers as to keeping spares (heaters for example), I don't believe that Apex components should need to be doubled up just due to their high probability of failure. While I see your argument, in an ideal world I would buy two of everything and have an exact duplicate tank set up in a spare room ready to be swapped out....but that isn't feasible. At some point you have to be able to trust the quality of the equipment that you are using. So that being said, if an aquarist doesn't want to keep duplicates of expensive items should they not keep and use something like an Apex, which is a luxury and not a requirement? Based on how many Apex failures I have had over the years, I am starting to think they should just sell everything in a two pack lol. The EB8232 doesn't need to be that complicated....I have surge protectors that are 20 years old and still working

Yes, I agree. There are a few here who keep spares of everything. I do not. For example I do not keep a secondary head unit. Pick and choose what works but have something. My reply is that having spares or redundancy is not uncommon as one may think.

I have a spare energy bar. I run 2 x Cor 15 and 1 x Cor 20 pumps. Pumps are 1 x 15 and 1 x 20 for return pumps. 1 x 15 powering skimmer. I can swap any of them as they use the same connectors. The 20 is plugged into its own circuit not the energy bar. Three different ways of protecting flow in the tank which is critical and it doesn't matter what brand of pump one uses.

That is what I'm talking about.

Edit: I do understand the concerns around reliability and cost. I'm just trying to remove the brand from it. Some cases I do agree are extreme such as NASA, etc. All good and hope everyone has an amazing day.

 

[Dub]

We agree on reasonable use or expected life of a product. However that doesn't negate the spare. As I noted above spares are spares and redundancy is a design. It seems the perspective you have is maybe related to this product. That is fine and I'm not here to change that. However, the use case still exists regardless of the brand. If it doesn't that that hobbyist is taking a chance or willing to accept that risk

We agree on reasonable use or expected life of a product. However that doesn't negate the spare. As I noted above spares are spares and redundancy is a design. It seems the perspective you have is maybe related to this product. That is fine and I'm not here to change that. However, the use case still exists regardless of the brand. If it doesn't that that hobbyist is taking a chance or willing to accept that risk level.



Yes, I agree. There are a few here who keep spares of everything. I do not. For example I do not keep a secondary head unit. Pick and choose what works but have something. My reply is that having spares or redundancy is not uncommon as one may think.

I have a spare energy bar. I run 2 x Cor 15 and 1 x Cor 20 pumps. Pumps are 1 x 15 and 1 x 20 for return pumps. 1 x 15 powering skimmer. I can swap any of them as they use the same connectors. The 20 is plugged into its own circuit not the energy bar. Three different ways of protecting flow in the tank which is critical and it doesn't matter what brand of pump one uses.

That is what I'm talking about.

Edit: I do understand the concerns around reliability and cost. I'm just trying to remove the brand from it. Some cases I do agree are extreme such as NASA, etc. All good and hope everyone has an amazing day.

Yes, I agree. There are a few here who keep spares of everything. I do not. For example I do not keep a secondary head unit. Pick and choose what works but have something. My reply is that having spares or redundancy is not uncommon as one may think.

I have a spare energy bar. I run 2 x Cor 15 and 1 x Cor 20 pumps. Pumps are 1 x 15 and 1 x 20 for return pumps. 1 x 15 powering skimmer. I can swap any of them as they use the same connectors. The 20 is plugged into its own circuit not the energy bar. Three different ways of protecting flow in the tank which is critical and it doesn't matter what brand of pump one uses.

That is what I'm talking about.

Edit: I do understand the concerns around reliability and cost. I'm just trying to remove the brand from it. Some cases I do agree are extreme such as NASA, etc. All good and hope everyone has an amazing day.

I probably shouldn’t be committing on this thread as my tank is small and my Apex investment is modest. I do agree that redundancy is wise and the more investment one has in the hobby the more redundancy one might need. Much like insurance. I also agree that most people only report their problems not their success. That being said it seems to me that when one product stands out from the crowd with complaints maybe it does have issues one should be concerned about. For that reason I have not purchased a EB832 to go with my Apex controller as my observations are that the preponderance of controller problems revolve around the EB832.