HeulittSalmi's JBJ 30r Tank

[HeulittSalmi]

So here's what I have so far for the live rock. I taped out an area on a box that is just about 1/4-3/4 of an inch too thin on the sides just because I'd rather have more room on the sides of the scape than not enough. Also the line at the top of the back of the box is the height of the tank so I'm concerned that it's a little too small in regards to height so I might pick up another pound or five at the LFS when I go to get glue tonight

 

[HeulittSalmi]

Front

Left

Top

Right

 

[HeulittSalmi]

The picture is a little deceitful because the from the top of the rock to the bottom of the tape is around 6-6.5 inches. In total I used around 21 pounds of rock. Should I change anything?

I tried making a few caves for fish to swim too, two high light points, a moderate light point, a few low light points, shadows, and room on the sand. I also Dremeled (spelling) out some of the bottoms of the rock on the left and right side to create some caves/refuge for the goby I'd like to get in the future.

 

[HeulittSalmi]

So I dont think anyone is still following along, but on Thursday 7/13, my tank is officially wet. I bought some water from a local reefer buddy of mine as well as a Golden Torch, a nice duncan, and a small acan frag that will go in the tank once its ready. But I do have a question for anyone reading or #reefsquad. Thursday night, a few hours after the cycle I noticed some ammonia, nitrates and nitrites and by Friday evening they were each at 0, then very minimal on Saturday but returned to 0 on Sunday and this morning. So I guess my question is, was that just a fast cycle or whats going on?

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Are you saying you got it wet a few days ago and it's now cycled?

 

[HeulittSalmi]

Are you saying you got it wet a few days ago and it's now cycled?

Yeah, so I got it wet 4 days ago, noticed small amounts of ammonia, nitrates and nitrites for the first two days and now nothing. I used Live Sand, a few pieces of cured Live Rock, and a friend recommended using NitroMax.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

My assumption is it hasn't had enough time to develop ammonia.

And I'm not seeing anything on nitro max save an amino food suppliment.

It may be that's it processing some ammonia , but I wouldn't call it cycled quite yet.

Did you add somthing to give it ammonia ? Food shrimp ammonia etc?

 

[Brew12]

If your tank actually cycled I would expect to see increasing nitrates. If your nitrates are still zero your tank hasn't cycled yet.

 

[HeulittSalmi]

My assumption is it hasn't had enough time to develop ammonia.

And I'm not seeing anything on nitro max save an amino food suppliment.

It may be that's it processing some ammonia , but I wouldn't call it cycled quite yet.

Did you add somthing to give it ammonia ? Food shrimp ammonia etc?

Ive been ghost feeding everyday, a few small pellets and some frozen food. And I thought it was called NitroMax, but could be wrong. I'll let you know when I get home. According to the guys at the LFS, which I dont go to anymore due to some personal reasons, they said this product was an alternative to BioSpira.

 

[HeulittSalmi]

If your tank actually cycled I would expect to see increasing nitrates. If your nitrates are still zero your tank hasn't cycled yet.

Do yo have any ideas as to why nitrates would show up and then disappear? When they were there it was around 0.25 ppm

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Ive been ghost feeding everyday, a few small pellets and some frozen food. And I thought it was called NitroMax, but could be wrong. I'll let you know when I get home. According to the guys at the LFS, which I dont go to anymore due to some personal reasons, they said this product was an alternative to BioSpira.

It takes time for the food to decompose for it to produce ammonia.

 

[Brew12]

Do yo have any ideas as to why nitrates would show up and then disappear? When they were there it was around 0.25 ppm

Sounds like a testing error. What test kit are you using?

 

[HeulittSalmi]

Sounds like a testing error. What test kit are you using?

Thats what I had thought as well. I used Salifert first, then API, and took the water to two LFS. One LFS said the cycle was over and I questioned them because it seemed way too fast, the other said the amounts of ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate are unusual right now and should spike soon.

It takes time for the food to decompose for it to produce ammonia.

I had figured it could take some time, do you know how long by chance?

 

[Brew12]

Thats what I had thought as well. I used Salifert first, then API, and took the water to two LFS. One LFS said the cycle was over and I questioned them because it seemed way too fast, the other said the amounts of ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate are unusual right now and should spike soon.


I had figured it could take some time, do you know how long by chance?

It's not the speed of the cycle that bothers me, strictly the lack of nitrates. If you add enough bottled bacteria you can completely skip the cycling process. The only way to verify if that is the case is to add ammonia (or something that breaks down into ammonia) and watch for increasing nitrates.

Decaying food will start to produce ammonia almost immediately. The issue is that it is a very uncontrolled process. It may release a small amount of ammonia over a week or two, or it may break down faster and add more ammonia in a day.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

It's not the speed of the cycle that bothers me, strictly the lack of nitrates. If you add enough bottled bacteria you can completely skip the cycling process. The only way to verify if that is the case is to add ammonia (or something that breaks down into ammonia) and watch for increasing nitrates.

Decaying food will start to produce ammonia almost immediately. The issue is that it is a very uncontrolled process. It may release a small amount of ammonia over a week or two, or it may break down faster and add more ammonia in a day.

Why would the lack of nitrates concern you if you belive the tank is now cycled if he used bottled bacteria.
If this is the case why do we not not just put bottled Bacteria and ammonia in a dry rock tank and consider it immedalty cycled?

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

I had figured it could take some time, do you know how long by chance?

It depends on how much is used to be able produce enough to be a able to be read on a hobby grade test.

I don't quite agree that rot and decomposition occurs immediately.

 

[HeulittSalmi]

It's not the speed of the cycle that bothers me, strictly the lack of nitrates. If you add enough bottled bacteria you can completely skip the cycling process. The only way to verify if that is the case is to add ammonia (or something that breaks down into ammonia) and watch for increasing nitrates.

Decaying food will start to produce ammonia almost immediately. The issue is that it is a very uncontrolled process. It may release a small amount of ammonia over a week or two, or it may break down faster and add more ammonia in a day.

So from my knowledge of cycles, which isn't all too great, the Ammonia is released from whatever the source may be, straight Ammonia, food, a dead shrimp etc., and the Ammonia converts to Nitrites via bacteria. Then the Nitrites are transformed into Nitrates after being broken down by other bacteria. So these bottles of bacteria are to help Ammonia and Nitrates down to the less harmful Nitrates. So you're saying you're concerned that there isn't Nitrates because if the cycle had started to occur there would be some form of Nitrates?

Why would the lack of nitrates concern you if you believe the tank is now cycled if he used bottled bacteria.
If this is the case why do we not not just put bottled Bacteria and ammonia in a dry rock tank and consider it immediately cycled?

It depends on how much is used to be able produce enough to be a able to be read on a hobby grade test.

I don't quite agree that rot and decomposition occurs immediately.

So from your perspective, is it time to put in some inverts or a CUC and keep monitoring the levels?

 

[Brew12]

Why would the lack of nitrates concern you if you belive the tank is now cycled if he used bottled bacteria.
If this is the case why do we not not just put bottled Bacteria and ammonia in a dry rock tank and consider it immedalty cycled?

With no nitrates there is no way to know if the bacteria that were added are functioning. Processing of ammonia into nitrates validates the presence of active bacteria.

 

[HeulittSalmi]

With no nitrates there is no way to know if the bacteria that were added are functioning. Processing of ammonia into nitrates validates the presence of active bacteria.

Okay sweet, thats what I was thinking and why I was kind of confused. But its also been four days since I started ghost feeding, would some detectable presence of ammonia be there?

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

So from your perspective, is it time to put in some inverts or a CUC and keep monitoring the levels?

No, I have few concerns really as far as cycling save doing it too fast. I personally don't think there's enough time at This point For the organics to have broken down to levels detectable by our kits yet.

It possible there's enough bacteria in there to process ammonia but there is other considerations like higher alk form the dry rock.

My self, organics ammonia etc aside would still wait a month or close to it before doing any thing. It seems to be what scientis do.

With no nitrates there is no way to know if the bacteria that were added are functioning. Processing of ammonia into nitrates validates the presence of active bacteria.

Likely because nothing has broken down enough in the four days to be read on a test imo.
I'd wager there a pretty good amount of nitrites if not ammonia in the next several days. And nitrates at the end of next week.