How to Quarantine

[melypr1985]

Do soft corals have any hard surfaces for tomonts to attach? Or is it just LPS and SPS?

Now that might be a bit tricky. Most leathers have a calcerious material that is mixed in with the flesh giving them the "leathery" feel. That material thickens towards the base. There is also the fact that most of these are already attached to a rock or plug which certainly can harbor tomonts. I'm not sure if tomonts would be able to attact on the leather coral's actual flesh but it seems like a risk I wouldn't take.

 

[VJV]

My opinion on softcorals is that there is no reason not to quarantine them. They are extremely hardy so will be able to sustain the less than perfect conditions of a small QT system without any issues so I see no reason not to. As has been said, most, if not all, softies con attached to a hard substrate which can harbor Tomonts so QTing them is a must, IMHO. All upside and no downside.

 

[JBslick81]

Can I treat with erythromycin and copper together? If there are no flukes. For an eye infection? Or do I use the erythromycin first to cure eye, then start copper. Do I need to remove erythromycin with WC before copper? Or how do I remove if need be.

What is the best way to sanitize my new tank? The tank and filter were used for freshwater by are dry now.

 

[foxt]

I suggest 10 days in cupramine @ .55 PPM (bring it up slowly over 3-4 days), and then two tank transfers before going in to the display. That should take care of it. Humblefish doesn't really endorse this yet, but it makes perfect sense if you understand the life cycle of ich and velvet. During the tank transfers, running prazi for those 6 days will also be helpful for flukes and such. If you wanted to be very safe, you could run prazi the entire time but because prazi is reef safe, I am OK taking a bit of a risk there. I've dosed prazi in all of my reef tanks several times without harming a single invert or fish.

Yes, I've been experimenting with just 10 days of exposure time (copper or CP) - but 2 weeks would be better. The fish is transferred while therapeutic levels are still in place, and then observed in the holding tank. Has worked every time so far - on fish with ich, velvet, brook & uronema.

I searched through this thread to see if there is any additional guidance on this, but I didn't find anything. If I understand it correctly, I would ramp copper up to therapeutic levels over 3 days, hold them there for 10 days, then go through two rounds of tank transfers (6 days total), while running prazipro and observing for anything else, and be done with QT? That cuts QT down to 3 weeks vs. 4-6? I'm not looking to cut corners, but I also want to move fish through QT (especially the copper part) as quickly as possible.

Have the two of you reached consensus on this modified approach?

 

[Humblefish]

Can I treat with erythromycin and copper together? If there are no flukes. For an eye infection? Or do I use the erythromycin first to cure eye, then start copper. Do I need to remove erythromycin with WC before copper? Or how do I remove if need be.

If no flukes show during the FW dip, I would assume parasites + a secondary bacterial infection is in play. So, treat with copper (for the parasites) + erythromycin (for the infection); you can safely combine them.

What is the best way to sanitize my new tank? The tank and filter were used for freshwater by are dry now.

Look here: https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/video-how-to-sterilize-a-quarantine-tank.201/

Have the two of you reached consensus on this modified approach?

What I am proposing is this: Once you raise copper (or CP) to full therapeutic, you now have a shield in place which protects your fish from reinfection. Ich trophonts can only remain on a fish for a maximum of 7 days; velvet only lasts 4 days. After that, your QT may still be infected with tomonts but the fish itself should be clear. So why not transfer the fish away from those tomonts and into a disease-free environment? I've successfully tested this theory on 68 different fish with active infections.

Some hard rules:

• The 10 day clock doesn't begin until copper or CP has reached full therapeutic.
• It must remain full therapeutic for the entire 10 days. If it dips even slightly, the 10 day clock restarts once therapeutic has been reachieved.
• Copper is considered the most reliable method for this treatment protocol, because it can be and should be tested daily. Using a professional grade test kit is highly advised when employing this method.
• The fish must be transferred at least 10 feet away (aerosol transmission) and copper/CP cannot be lowered prior to transferring.
• NOTHING from the original treatment tank can be reused for the non-medicated holding tank. The original treatment tank must be considered contaminated with tomonts and should be broken down & sterilized.

Even 10 days of copper/CP exposure is slight overkill when employing this method, since 7 days is the maximum time parasites can remain attached to a fish before dropping off. But I like the little bit of wiggle room at the end just in case.

 

[foxt]

What I am proposing is this: ..........

Thanks for posting that! I can live with those hard rules for a 13 day cycle in copper. Do you also recommend the two tank transfers with prazipro after the copper is done, or is the TTM not needed because the copper took care of the ich? If the two tank transfers aren't necessary, how long should the stay in the holding tank be, and should I run one or two courses of prazipro in it?

 

[Humblefish]

Thanks for posting that! I can live with those hard rules for a 13 day cycle in copper. Do you also recommend the two tank transfers with prazipro after the copper is done, or is the TTM not needed because the copper took care of the ich? If the two tank transfers aren't necessary, how long should the stay in the holding tank be, and should I run one or two courses of prazipro in it?

Ideally, you would treat with Prazipro 2x, 5-7 days apart, whilst the fish is in the holding tank. Since I recommend 2 weeks observation post CP/copper treatment. Remember, bacterial diseases are not treatable with CP/copper or prazi.

 

[foxt]

Ideally, you would treat with Prazipro 2x, 5-7 days apart, whilst the fish is in the holding tank. Since I recommend 2 weeks observation post CP/copper treatment. Remember, bacterial diseases are not treatable with CP/copper or prazi.

Ok, so this is the plan:
1. start fish in newly set up QT with an established bio filter in a HOB
2. ramp up to 2ppm coppersafe over 5 days
3. hold the coppersafe at 2ppm for 10 days
4. on day 15, transfer fish to newly set up HT with an established bio filter in a HOB
5. over the next two weeks of observation in the HT, run two courses of prazipro 7 days apart
6. on day 29, release the fish to DT

Do I have that right?

 

[Humblefish]

Ok, so this is the plan:
1. start fish in newly set up QT with an established bio filter in a HOB
2. ramp up to 2ppm coppersafe over 5 days
3. hold the coppersafe at 2ppm for 10 days
4. on day 15, transfer fish to newly set up HT with an established bio filter in a HOB
5. over the next two weeks of observation in the HT, run two courses of prazipro 7 days apart
6. on day 29, release the fish to DT

Do I have that right?

You got it. Just a) Be sure the HT is at least 10 feet away from the QT. b) Be mindful of any cross contamination (exs. wet hands, WC hoses, feeding apparatus) between the two. Remember, pay close attention to detail and allow no margin for error.

 

[JBslick81]

Thanks for helping me figure this out Humblefish. So if I do have flukes I can dose my DT with prazipro without worrying about the inverts and corals, correct? Should I do a water change in between doses?

Tried to trap some fish today with no luck. My arrow crab climbed right in the box and was blocking the way of all the fish. Moved him to an acclimation box but the fish didn't go near the trap. I will try again tomorrow. LFS owner told me a freshwater dip will kill my chromis and clown. She also said prazipro is not safe for my DT. But I believe I trust your word over hers. But it does say on the bottle not safe for feather worms.

My plan is: catch all my fish. Freshwater dip either my hippo tang or flame to determine flukes.

If flukes, dose prazipro into DT. After 24 hours put angel in QT for erythromycin treatment for the eye condition for 5 days. Then return him to DT once conditions are 100%.

If not flukes I will treat all fish with copper for ten days in QT then transfer to the HT for 14 days and 2 doses of prazipro. Just as the steps listed above.

Should I still treat with erythromycin before the copper to take care of the eye. And if so can I treat all the fish together or should I only treat the angel with erythromycin?

Does this sound good? Again thank you for all your help and all that you do.

 

[foxt]

You got it. Just a) Be sure the HT is at least 10 feet away from the QT. b) Be mindful of any cross contamination (exs. wet hands, WC hoses, feeding apparatus) between the two. Remember, pay close attention to detail and allow no margin for error.

Thanks for all of the help!

 

[Brew12]

o if I do have flukes I can dose my DT with prazipro without worrying about the inverts and corals, correct? Should I do a water change in between doses?

But it does say on the bottle not safe for feather worms.

Yes, you can dose Prazipro into your DT and it is safe, for the most part. It will take out your feather dusters so if you have some you may want to remove them prior to treatment.

LFS owner told me a freshwater dip will kill my chromis and clown.

I've never heard this but my experience has been that a FW dip is much less stressful on fish than you may think. I have done a FW dip on both my clowns and they did just fine. I've never had a Chromis but I have also done FW dips on damsels without problems.

My plan is: catch all my fish. Freshwater dip either my hippo tang or flame to determine flukes.

If you do have a bad fluke issue I would try to do a FW dip on all of the fish prior to adding Prazipro. Not only will this provide faster relief, but it will reduce the damage to the fish caused by the flukes convulsing (for lack of a better term) during the Prazi treament.

 

[Humblefish]

^^ Agree with @Brew12

There have been a few rare cases of Prazipro damaging (or even killing) SPS and anemones. But most of the time these bounce back. Prazipro is inconsistent when it comes to killing feather dusters and bristleworms. But I'd be wary of using it if you had a large population of either, since the resulting die-off could trigger an ammonia spike.

If the angel tests positive for flukes (during the FW dip), I think I would treat him separately in a QT so you can dose erythromycin a day or so after Prazipro. Otherwise, just combine copper + erythromycin for him. If flukes have gotten to his eyes, odds of a secondary infection are high so he will likely also need antibiotics.

 

[Maddlesrain]

I'll be setting up my very first quarantine tank for an order coming in Friday. I'm going to start without medicating and just the observations so I can get the hang of this new set-up and feel a little more comfortable in the process. I have a HOB skimmer thats not in use at the moment, can I use that in place of the recommended filter?

Also, thank you for this write-up! It was very informative and made me feel a bit more confident in this whole ordeal.

 

[Brew12]

I'll be setting up my very first quarantine tank for an order coming in Friday. I'm going to start without medicating and just the observations so I can get the hang of this new set-up and feel a little more comfortable in the process. I have a HOB skimmer thats not in use at the moment, can I use that in place of the recommended filter?

Also, thank you for this write-up! It was very informative and made me feel a bit more confident in this whole ordeal.

I wouldn't use a skimmer for a HT tank. It just isn't necessary for the amount of time a fish should be in there.

 

[melypr1985]

I wouldn't use a skimmer for a HT tank. It just isn't necessary for the amount of time a fish should be in there.

agreed

 

[Maddlesrain]

I wouldn't use a skimmer for a HT tank. It just isn't necessary for the amount of time a fish should be in there.

agreed

Thank you!! I'll add a filter instead.
Just curious, what ill effects would the skimmer have?

 

[Humblefish]

Just curious, what ill effects would the skimmer have?

Would remove medications from the water and/or cause the skimmer to go nuts.

 

[125mph]

I have a fish coming tomorrow (Friday) from Live Aquaria and I'm going to be out on vacation for 10 days.. My sister house sits for me and takes care of the fish and my dogs!

I was going to set up a 29G with some bio and just let him get adapted for two weeks, but then I was thinking, maybe I should do some CP just to get the process started. Does this sound okay?

1. start fish in newly set up QT with an established bio filter in a HOB
2. immediately start CP at 40mg/gal and hold for 14 days. I'll be home by day 12.
3. on day 15, I, transfer fish to newly set up HT with an established bio filter in a HOB
4. over the next two weeks of observation in the HT, run two courses of prazipro 5 days apart
5. on day 29, release the fish to DT

This is another regal angelfish btw

Anything wrong with running CP on the onset? I haven't seen CP cause issues with any of my angels.

 

[Humblefish]

@125mph I've treated Regal Angels in CP without issue. However, does your sister know how to check for ammonia and how to do a WC if the need arises? And how to dose CP into any replacement water so therapeutic level never drops?