New fish quarantine API general cure directions?

[Arose231]

That's a tough question to answer. Mobile invertebrates are typically safe after about a month. However, corals and any substrate has the potential of harboring ich tomonts for 45+ days, and I give them 60 days to be safe.

@Jay Hemdal some starfish and cleanershrimps

That's a tough question to answer. Mobile invertebrates are typically safe after about a month. However, corals and any substrate has the potential of harboring ich tomonts for 45+ days, and I give them 60 days to be safe.

@Jay Hemdal do you think starfish can carry flukes and it’s eggs?

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

@Jay Hemdal some starfish and cleanershrimps

@Jay Hemdal do you think starfish can carry flukes and it’s eggs?

The eggs of some flukes, (especially Neobenedenia) have sticky threads that attach to any surface, including invertebrates. However, without a fish host, these eggs will hatch and die out in 30 days. Ich tomonts are different, they can adhere to rocks and sand and remain viable for up to 60 days. However, ich tomonts don't attach to starfish or shrimp for nearly that long....30 days is fine for that as well.

 

[Arose231]

The eggs of some flukes, (especially Neobenedenia) have sticky threads that attach to any surface, including invertebrates. However, without a fish host, these eggs will hatch and die out in 30 days. Ich tomonts are different, they can adhere to rocks and sand and remain viable for up to 60 days. However, ich tomonts don't attach to starfish or shrimp for nearly that long....30 days is fine for that as well.

@Jay Hemdal the 35 day copper treatment is done no white spots no mucus plugs but the Foxface is still twitching and the Valentini puffer scratching against rocks even during theraputic copper treatment.
I will do two course of api general cure spaced 7 days apart. You are correct about Prazi pro the gycol all this time has been ineffective and the bacteria is just consuming it before it can get all the flukes in time.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

@Jay Hemdal the 35 day copper treatment is done no white spots no mucus plugs but the Foxface is still twitching and the Valentini puffer scratching against rocks even during theraputic copper treatment.
I will do two course of api general cure spaced 7 days apart. You are correct about Prazi pro the gycol all this time has been ineffective and the bacteria is just consuming it before it can get all the flukes in time.

You might need to dose the GC three times, 7 days apart.

 

[Arose231]

You might need to dose the GC three times, 7 days apart.

@Jay Hemdal if replacing live rock after copper treatment how long would it take new rock to cycle? Have seachem matrix running in filter as backup as well which will keep the cycle going if replacing the rock in main display

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

@Jay Hemdal if replacing live rock after copper treatment how long would it take new rock to cycle? Have seachem matrix running in filter as backup as well which will keep the cycle going if replacing the rock in main display

Sorry, there are too many variables, tough to say. Generally, passive live rock develops more slowly than matrix running in a filter for example. I’d say 6 to 8 weeks?

 

[Arose231]

Sorry, there are too many variables, tough to say. Generally, passive live rock develops more slowly than matrix running in a filter for example. I’d say 6 to 8 weeks?

yea I think will just replace 60 to 70% of the rock which will make the process much faster and there will still be plenty of beneficial bacteria in the tank with the 30% leftover rock and matrix in filter

 

[Arose231]

@vetteguy53081 @Jay Hemdal

I have replaced the live rock copper power level currently at 0.15ppm I will add the new rock now. 0.15ppm will be extremely easy to remove with water changes. This whole thing has been extremely exhausting and expensive I will never dose copper in the main tank ever again. From buying cuprisorb constant water changes to replacing rocks it’s just not worth it at all. The whole 30 day thing is easy but once the treatment is done that long battle with removing most of the copper is just never ending and the only way to do it is by removing the rock afterwards..

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

@vetteguy53081 @Jay Hemdal

I have replaced the live rock copper power level currently at 0.15ppm I will add the new rock now. 0.15ppm will be extremely easy to remove with water changes. This whole thing has been extremely exhausting and expensive I will never dose copper in the main tank ever again. From buying cuprisorb constant water changes to replacing rocks it’s just not worth it at all. The whole 30 day thing is easy but once the treatment is done that long battle with removing most of the copper is just never ending and the only way to do it is by removing the rock afterwards..

I'm not sure I understand - shouldn't you wait until the copper is nearer to zero before adding the new rock?

 

[vetteguy53081]

@vetteguy53081 @Jay Hemdal

I have replaced the live rock copper power level currently at 0.15ppm I will add the new rock now. 0.15ppm will be extremely easy to remove with water changes. This whole thing has been extremely exhausting and expensive I will never dose copper in the main tank ever again. From buying cuprisorb constant water changes to replacing rocks it’s just not worth it at all. The whole 30 day thing is easy but once the treatment is done that long battle with removing most of the copper is just never ending and the only way to do it is by removing the rock afterwards..

Again, do not add live rock to any copper and you want near zero copper level before adding rock. .15 is too low for treatment and too high to allow any rock to be free of copper and leach into tank. If you want to add rock, do a 100% water change and utilize a small pouch of cuprisorb

 

[Arose231]

Again, do not add live rock to any copper and you want near zero copper level before adding rock. .15 is too low for treatment and too high to allow any rock to be free of copper and leach into tank. If you want to add rock, do a 100% water change and utilize a small pouch of cuprisorb

Are you even reading the post?? The treatment has been done. 0.15ppm is extremely low and the cuprisorb will absorb the rest

 

[vetteguy53081]

Are you even reading the post?? The treatment has been done. 0.15ppm is extremely low and the cuprisorb will absorb the rest

I gather you are looking to add rock to the tank and .15 is below therapeutic level yes but the rock is likely no longer containing living cultures and you are experimenting here rather than taking the advise to NOT add rock until you get levels to near zero. Cuprisorb while a great product does not always achieve zero levels and you want to assure if utilizing rock for display that you are not leaching copper into the display tank again
Its your tank, and you are adamant on adding the rock from what it seems despite advise to remove copper first raising question - Are You reading the posts?
Perhaps im misunderstanding your goal here but your attitude here will not invite further assistance

 

[Arose231]

I gather you are looking to add rock to the tank and .15 is below therapeutic level yes but the rock is likely no longer containing living cultures and you are experimenting here rather than taking the advise to NOT add rock until you get levels to near zero. Cuprisorb while a great product does not always achieve zero levels and you want to assure if utilizing rock for display that you are not leaching copper into the display tank again
Its your tank, and you are adamant on adding the rock from what it seems despite advise to remove copper first raising question - Are You reading the posts?
Perhaps im misunderstanding your goal here but your attitude here will not invite further assistance

It doesn’t matter if it’s below theraputic level now the treatment has been done. It doesn’t have to be around 0 even in the ocean there a very small traces of copper.

 

[Arose231]

I'm not sure I understand - shouldn't you wait until the copper is nearer to zero before adding the new rock?

@Jay Hemdal unfortunatley I have already done 175 gallons of water changes out of 125 gallon aquarium this is as low as I could get it for now. I replaced all of the sand and rock

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

It doesn’t matter if it’s below theraputic level now the treatment has been done. It doesn’t have to be around 0 even in the ocean there a very small traces of copper.

You may well have contaminated the new rock. Ocean copper levels are less than 0.00035 ppm and you are at 0.15 ppm.

Amine chelated copper is less apt to bind with calcareous rock, but fresh rock has more of an affinity for copper, I just can’t predict it.

 

[Arose231]

You may well have contaminated the new rock. Ocean copper levels are less than 0.00035 ppm and you are at 0.15 ppm.

Amine chelated copper is less apt to bind with calcareous rock, but fresh rock has more of an affinity for copper, I just can’t predict it.

@Jay Hemdal correct unfortunately I had left the old live rock in there it would just keep leaching more copper back out and be a constant standstill betweeen that and water changes with cuprisorb this was the best resolution

 

[Arose231]

@Jay Hemdal here is a guy who treated his tank with copper and somehow has corals and inverts with still of a copper level at 0.28ppm copper power. Take a look when you get a chance.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

@Jay Hemdal here is a guy who treated his tank with copper and somehow has corals and inverts with still of a copper level at 0.28ppm copper power. Take a look when you get a chance.

I’ve kept shrimp in 1 ppm coppersafe short term. Copper Power is similar.

Best practices is to limit copper levels to 0.05 ppm for tanks housing most invertebrates, with 0.025 ppm for corals and octopus.

 

[vetteguy53081]

It doesn’t matter if it’s below theraputic level now the treatment has been done. It doesn’t have to be around 0 even in the ocean there a very small traces of copper.

Rock is affected and contaminated is what I am saying . Im not referring to treatment level but rather content of copper still present

 

[Arose231]

Rock is affected and contaminated is what I am saying . Im not referring to treatment level but rather content of copper still present

yes agreed on that but at the same time with that little copper level being asbored it can easily be removed with water change and cuprisorb vs the previous 30 days of live rock which would pretty much release forever and be a problem