Newbie Overflow Issues

[Sarcazian]

Thank you!!! I bought the check valve as well just to be extra safe.....I REALLY don't want to clean up an overflow, hahaha. Funny thing, my next step was looking for instructions on how to do exactly this, so really, thank you very much!

Back to my original problem:

We installed the 1" drain hose which definitely helped, but did not solve the problem. I finally threw up my hands and said, 'this darn thing must be defective.' I called Marine Depot, considering my overflow box is the MarinDepot 800, and asked what the deal is because I MUST be missing something, right? RIGHT?!?

According to my new friend Marine Depot Scott, I need to either get a different return pump or install a flow valve. When I bought all of my tank equipment, I made my selections based off of good reviews rather than just brand name selections, and the Aqueon pump I chose had really good reviews....... Bleh. According to Scott, Aqueon is notorious for incorrectly rating their equipment which seems to be the case for my wonderful little pump. I'll tell you what, I think I would be pretty darn impressed if I needed that kind of flow! That being said, I just purchased the Sicce Synchra Silent 1.5 return pump that, thankfully, has an adjustable flow. Somebody please reassure me that all will be well with this one?!

Sincerely hoping that this solves my problem! Good Lord, I am so far beyond frustrated! I never would have thought this would be such an issue!

Now to write AlgaeBarn and have them hold my second Ultimate Refugium shipment.........

So, the Sicce 1.5 is in your sump for the return? I am not sure if that is enough depending on the pipe width and length. Very good pumps though - I have a 0.5 on my 13.5G, but it's pretty weak with like 3" of pipe.

When I was running my 36G bow I originally started with a Mag 5 (~500GPH) and later upgraded to an Eheim 1260 (~625GPH). If I had to do it again I would just go with a controllable DC pump to truely get what I needed.

Since you mentioned MD, you can see their head pressure (GPH) based on pipe length - https://www.marinedepot.com/danner-supreme-aqua-mag-5-water-pump

Also from the Sicce documentation you can see that the 1.5 should push about 238GPH at about 3.3 feet of pipe.

 

[Apollo7235]

Wow, the Bean system is still around and kicking? I have been out of the hobby since shortly after these started coming out.

To the ops... I had a CPR (I think) overflow on a 36G Bow with a sump that was converted from a wet/dry. I would never run that setup again nor recommend it to my worse enemy.

- The U Pipe was a real PIA.
- It was loud as heck even with adapting things. My wife complained that she was watching TV next to a pool skimmer basket. Okay, I was able to partially fix that with reef central at the time.
- Power outages could lead to issues with the sump over flowing (if not over-sized like mine) or the display overflowing if the U-Pipe broke suction and the main sump chamber was too larger (only happened once).

So, please consider a few things;

1. Test, test, and test again. You want to make sure the water does not overflow or break siphon on you.
2. Consider getting yourself one of those plugs with a water monitor so it shows off the return pump if things are too high. I have never tested this since I went drilled after that tank and now AIO. I would have loved something like that back in the day.
3. Consider getting a bigger overflow with more redundancies.

Aiyaiyai. Are HOB syphon-powered overflows that much of a no-go these days? I really had no idea.

I'll have to look into that water monitor plug! I haven't heard of them until now, but it definitely sounds like a great idea! As far as a bigger overflow, I really just don't see how the one I have shouldn't be sufficient. My DT is only 38 gallons, sump is 20 gallons, my original return pump was rated for around 325gph at 4'-6", and the overflow is rated for 800gph, so really, I feel like the math adds up, but I could be missing something??

After reading this entire thread, personally I'd get a large return pump and a a gate valve on your return line from your pump. Something in the 1000 GPh range or better.

But, that's my problem! My return pump is overpowering my overflow, so getting a bigger one would only increase the problem

 

[Apollo7235]

So, the Sicce 1.5 is in your sump for the return? I am not sure if that is enough depending on the pipe width and length. Very good pumps though - I have a 0.5 on my 13.5G, but it's pretty weak with like 3" of pipe.

When I was running my 36G bow I originally started with a Mag 5 (~500GPH) and later upgraded to an Eheim 1260 (~625GPH). If I had to do it again I would just go with a controllable DC pump to truely get what I needed.

Since you mentioned MD, you can see their head pressure (GPH) based on pipe length - https://www.marinedepot.com/danner-supreme-aqua-mag-5-water-pump

Also from the Sicce documentation you can see that the 1.5 should push about 238GPH at about 3.3 feet of pipe.

Yeah, I'm just super weary of getting another high-powered pump after this whole debacle. They also have this chart:

I would need the water to be pumped about 4'-6" into my DT, so roughly 221.5GPH, which comes out to be ~5.83 X my tank capacity in gallons. I was under the impression that 5-10 X the tank capacity in GPH is what you want when selecting your return pump?

 

[Mical]

Aiyaiyai. Are HOB syphon-powered overflows that much of a no-go these days? I really had no idea.

I'll have to look into that water monitor plug! I haven't heard of them until now, but it definitely sounds like a great idea! As far as a bigger overflow, I really just don't see how the one I have shouldn't be sufficient. My DT is only 38 gallons, sump is 20 gallons, my original return pump was rated for around 325gph at 4'-6", and the overflow is rated for 800gph, so really, I feel like the math adds up, but I could be missing something??


But, that's my problem! My return pump is overpowering my overflow, so getting a bigger one would only increase the problem

But with a gate valve you can dial it back on the return side≥

 

[Apollo7235]

But with a gate valve you can dial it back on the return side≥

Yeah, that was one of my options with the original pump I bought.

I was under the impression that if I did that, the constant pressure on the pump would eventually burn it out?

 

[Mical]

Yeah, that was one of my options with the original pump I bought.

I was under the impression that if I did that, the constant pressure on the pump would eventually burn it out?

I have HOB overflows on both of my tanks - a 120 & 65 both use Mag pumps from MD. I use gate valves on them to regulate the flow and have ZERO issues with pumps. Steady & constant.

 

[Apollo7235]

I have HOB overflows on both of my tanks - a 120 & 65 both use Mag pumps from MD. I use gate valves on them to regulate the flow and have ZERO issues with pumps. Steady & constant.

That’s good to know, thank you! What gate valves do you use, if you don’t mind me asking?

 

[Mical]

That’s good to know, thank you! What gate valves do you use, if you don’t mind me asking?

I use these -> https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/spears-gate-valve-thread-x-thread.html

 

[dvgyfresh]

I just installed a CPR 102 overflow on a 40g and all I can hear is the gurgling sound of water draining trying to make it quieter not sure how

 

[Apollo7235]

I use these -> https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/spears-gate-valve-thread-x-thread.html

Awesome, thank you! This will be my next move if this new pump do this trick.

 

[Apollo7235]

I just installed a CPR 102 overflow on a 40g and all I can hear is the gurgling sound of water draining trying to make it quieter not sure how

The box I have has a spongey kind of foam cylinder around a piece of PVC that has a little vent tube sticking out of it. Apparently the foam is supposed to quiet the thing down. MarineDepot is actually replacing the PVC piece for me because the little vent tube was separated from it and I’m pretty sure we may have glued it back in a little too low so it’s making a little bit of a sucking/gurgling sound now. With the foam sleeve on, it’s definitely much more muted, though.

Not sure about other methods, although I know that @theMeat had mentioned a few options regarding quieting down overflows earlier in this thread:

Do not wish to argue. For the sake of anyone who might come in here to gather info
- on a single drain system you want air going down the pipe with the water. A bigger pipe will allow enough air to be constant, instead of the sound of a toilet flushing again and again when full siphon is established. Water in overflow gets higher, full siphon begins to establish, water going down drain increases, gets low enough to suck air (toilet flushing sound), repeat.
- On a reef ready tank with a single drain it’s risky to put a valve on that drain. With an overflow box there is much less room for error and is a flood waiting to happen.
- A single drain system will make noise. With a bigger pipe the noise will be less. A diy stockman standpipe at the top of bulkhead is about as quiet as it safely gets.

 

[ReeferBob]

Have you considered drilling your tank to accept an overflow that isn't siphon dependent? As long as your tank is not tempered glass, you can drill it.

 

[dvgyfresh]

The box I have has a spongey kind of foam cylinder around a piece of PVC that has a little vent tube sticking out of it. Apparently the foam is supposed to quiet the thing down. MarineDepot is actually replacing the PVC piece for me because the little vent tube was separated from it and I’m pretty sure we may have glued it back in a little too low so it’s making a little bit of a sucking/gurgling sound now. With the foam sleeve on, it’s definitely much more muted, though.

Not sure about other methods, although I know that @theMeat had mentioned a few options regarding quieting down overflows earlier in this thread:

Yea I ordered those , I got the overflow without the sponge / vent tube I’m hoping that’s why it is so loud lol actually traded a yellow tang for the sump / overflow so I guess I can’t be too mad

 

[theMeat]

@dvgyfresh For single drain system this is the quietest solution I know of. Thank me later

 

[theMeat]

@Apollo7235
Your sicce 1.5 pump should be giving you about 3.5 - 4 times tank volume turnover per hour which is imo perfect .
Thanks for following up

 

[Apollo7235]

Have you considered drilling your tank to accept an overflow that isn't siphon dependent? As long as your tank is not tempered glass, you can drill it.

In the future, I will more than likely either drill the tank myself or buy one per-drilled (probably go pre-drilled, honestly), but for now, we already have water in the tank and the sump as well as the overflow and the plumbing to go with it, so we are already pretty invested in the overflow box method at this point or maybe we would reconsider.

 

[Apollo7235]

@dvgyfresh For single drain system this is the quietest solution I know of. Thank me later

This is great, thank you very much!! Once we get this thing up and running we will evaluate and see if this is necessary. The sound of running water actually doesn’t bother me at all. I think it’s soothing, haha, but we’ll have to wait and see what it sounds like and live with it before we make that determination.

@Apollo7235
Your sicce 1.5 pump should be giving you about 3.5 - 4 times tank volume turnover per hour which is imo perfect .
Thanks for following up

Absolutely! Thank you very much for all of your insight! It is very much appreciated!

 

[theMeat]

I just installed a CPR 102 overflow on a 40g and all I can hear is the gurgling sound of water draining trying to make it quieter not sure how

Does the cpr 102 have two drains going down to sump?
Do you have an aqualifter pump on the nipple on top of overflow box?

 

[dvgyfresh]

Does the cpr 102 have two drains going down to sump?
Do you have an aqualifter pump on the nipple on top of overflow box?

It has two drains going down to the sump, I don’t have aqua lifter yet it’s currently being shipped and also I ordered the prefilter sponge /vent tube thing as I don’t have it

 

[theMeat]

It has two drains going down to the sump, I don’t have aqua lifter yet it’s currently being shipped and also I ordered the prefilter sponge /vent tube thing as I don’t have it

Well wadaya know. Since you have two drains in your overflow you can do a herbie style plumbing for pretty much silent operation.
Stockman standpipe is for single drain tanks.
Google herbie, a valve and a couple of elbows gets you going silent

When you get your aqualifter place it on top of overflow box or higher but definitely not lower than the top of the overflow box. Incase pump fails or hose pops off it could get messy/siphon