RODI Water Saver Upgrade Help

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DaFlava

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So trying to make sure I actually installed this upgrade kit properly. My original setup was a 4-Stage RODI 100 GPD w/ a PSI Booster CDP 8800 which I had set to 90 PSI. Here's how I have it setup which I believe is correct and I'm getting waste/product like I would with my continued 90 PSI at the gauge. I personally don't see much of a waste or product difference after the upgrade but maybe it is me. I haven't done like a bucket timed comparison on waste/product. I originally saw a noticeable boost in product when I added the PSI Booster going from 60 PSI to 90 PSI.

Each membrane I believe is rated for 100 GPD so essentially I believe this means it's now a 200 GPD setup?
I've never seen the DI Resin Filter fill up much more than an inch or two before and after this upgrade, is that normal?

On the membranes the product lines are connected to the furthest out connections and the waste is the furthest in.

Screen Shot 2021-07-31 at 12.15.52 PM.png
 
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Biglew11

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Yes this would be the correct setup. You should get the same amount of waste as you did with the single ro membrane, but if you were to time it, you should have close to 2times the product output.

The only difference in my setup is that I have my booster pump between the last carbon block and the ro membrane. That way I don't have to worry about something large in the inlet lines destroying my booster. Or the plastic sediment containers bursting on me. The ro housings are definitely designed to handle the high pressure. I'm also running around 90 psi.
 
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DaFlava

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Yes this would be the correct setup. You should get the same amount of waste as you did with the single ro membrane, but if you were to time it, you should have close to 2times the product output.

The only difference in my setup is that I have my booster pump between the last carbon block and the ro membrane. That way I don't have to worry about something large in the inlet lines destroying my booster. Or the plastic sediment containers bursting on me. The ro housings are definitely designed to handle the high pressure. I'm also running around 90 psi.
I just did a quick 5 min test, I observed the opposite.

90 PSI No Saver - 5 min 1/2g product, 1 1/2g waste
90 PSI w/ Saver - 5 min little over 1/2g product, 1g waste

So to me it looks like it just cut my waste which I assumed it would. Went from 3:1 to 2:1 waste to product
 

outhouse

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I run 3 ro membranes just like that. You may have to play with waste water restrictor to tune it properly. I only run this way because my tds is so low. If you have high tds it's not recommended. Saved me at of wzter
 

lakai

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Your setup is wrong.

This is the correct sequence.

Source > sediment > carbon blocks >
boosterpump > Membrane 1 > Out 1 \____ Y fitting Outline into DI
Waste1 into > Membrane 2 > Out 2 /
Waste 2 > regulator > Waste Line
 
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Biglew11

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Make sure both membranes are seated properly you should have nearly double the product output.

Are you sure you have the right flow restrictor rated for a 100 GPD system?

As a test you can disconnect the two product lines from the y and test the tds of the output. The tds at the second membranes should be close to or a tad higher than the first membrane if one of them is close to the incoming tds, then it's probably bypassing the membrane.
 
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DaFlava

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Your setup is wrong.

This is the correct sequence.

Source > sediment > carbon blocks >
boosterpump > Membrane 1 > Out 1 \____ Y fitting Outline into DI
Waste1 into > Membrane 2 > Out 2 /
Waste 2 > regulator > Waste Line
So outside moving the booster between the carbon filter and membrane 1 am I missing something else? I'm not following I guess.
 
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DaFlava

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Make sure both membranes are seated properly you should have nearly double the product output.

Are you sure you have the right flow restrictor rated for a 100 GPD system?

As a test you can disconnect the two product lines from the y and test the tds of the output. The tds at the second membranes should be close to or a tad higher than the first membrane if one of them is close to the incoming tds, then it's probably bypassing the membrane.
So my original RODI kit never had a flow restrictor is this required? Only other pieces outside the PSI Booster is this valve which is on the waste line, never used it as if i close it I just get waste no product so not sure the point of it. If I do get a flow restrictor where would it go?

This was the unit I bought before they moved over to BRS which was a 100G GPD 4-stage unit. I just upgraded the water saving kit which was a 200 GPD kit and added the PSI 8800 booster.
1627858067907.png
 

Biglew11

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a flow restrictor is required. looking at that picture it looks like there would be a capillary tube type restrictor in the yellow tube between the 2tees. you want the short yellow line to the left of the tee's to be at the output of the second membrane, and place another straight line between the waste of the first to the input of the second membrane.

that valve is for flushing the membrane, if it is between the 2 membranes and in the closed position you would be restricting flow to the second membrane.
the black line between the 2 membranes with nothing in between, the black line off the top membrane is where your flow restrictor would go. this would be the yellow line with tee's in the first picture. place the short yellow tube into the output of the second membrane.

1627903751516.png
 
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Shirak

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So trying to make sure I actually installed this upgrade kit properly. My original setup was a 4-Stage RODI 100 GPD w/ a PSI Booster CDP 8800 which I had set to 90 PSI. Here's how I have it setup which I believe is correct and I'm getting waste/product like I would with my continued 90 PSI at the gauge. I personally don't see much of a waste or product difference after the upgrade but maybe it is me. I haven't done like a bucket timed comparison on waste/product. I originally saw a noticeable boost in product when I added the PSI Booster going from 60 PSI to 90 PSI.

Each membrane I believe is rated for 100 GPD so essentially I believe this means it's now a 200 GPD setup?
I've never seen the DI Resin Filter fill up much more than an inch or two before and after this upgrade, is that normal?

On the membranes the product lines are connected to the furthest out connections and the waste is the furthest in.

Screen Shot 2021-07-31 at 12.15.52 PM.png
Technically not a 200gpd unit now if you run in water saver mode where they are in series with waste 1 going to input 2 as in diagram. RO 2 typically will not produce as much RO because waste water 1 has higher TDS and there is some pressure loss. You will however have less waste overall.
If you wanted to run 200gpd you would split the blue line after carbon in the diagram and input to each RO so they run in parallel. You then have two waste lines. You would produce a lot more RO faster. The overall waste/RO ratio would be the same as a single membrane however.
 
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DaFlava

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Okay so getting a little confused here, I assume one of my major problems for still producing alot of waste with the saver upgrade is not having a flow restrictor... not sure why that wouldn't be with a kit if it's required but anyways ordered a 800ML one which I saw was rated for if your running 100GPD membranes. PSI booster position seems to be subjective either before the RODI unit or between carbon > 1st membrane.

So overall is this better? Or am I more confused lol
RODI 2.png
 
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DaFlava

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restrictor goes between the two T fittings where the flush valve is. The flush valve assembly goes on the waste line after the 2nd RO membrane.

There should be a flow restrictor already in that flush valve assembly.
I can move that, guess more like this? The flush valve area never had a restrictor unless it's built into that valve fitting but maybe not rated properly?
RODI.png
 

Shirak

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I can move that, guess more like this? The flush valve area never had a restrictor unless it's built into that valve fitting but maybe not rated properly?
RODI.png
Yes

It may be in the small piece of tubing between the two T fittings. They are tiny pieces of tubing that slip into the tube and the fitting. I would take apart that small length of tube and see if there is something like this in there.

1627908395226.png
 
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DaFlava

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So I've gotten a 800ML flow restrictor and my product output has increased. This is what I was previously seeing with my setup and finally outcome.

*5 Minute Test*
90 PSI No Saver - 5 min 1/2g product, 1 1/2g waste 1:3 ratio
90 PSI w/ Saver - 5 min little over 1/2g product, 1g waste 1:2 ratio
90 PSI w/ Saver w/ restrictor - 5 min 1g product, 2g waste 1:2 ratio (FINAL SETUP)

Does this seem right? My product did double but my waste didn't really seem to go down as much I'd have thought or maybe I'm just over thinking it!

1628043154450.png
 

Shirak

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1:2 is pretty good. Usually it's around 1:3 or 1:4 for a single membrane. If you push it much beyond 1:2 the rejection rate will go down and the membrane will clog up as stuff that can't get through the membrane are not flushed with enough flow and then RO production will go down and ratio will go back up.

Hence the Flush valve which is supposed to help clear stuff off the membrane. With a rejection rate of 1:2 it's probably something you should do on a regular bases for a 5 or 10 seconds.

How well the 2nd membrane performs and influences the overall output of RO/Waste will depend greatly on your source water. If it's fairly high to start with lots of hard minerals like Ca, the 2nd membrane is much less effective than the first.
 

Biglew11

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with 2 membranes in water saver mode your product will almost double, the waste output would stay the same.

if you made 1 gallon of ro with 4 gallons of waste on a single membrane, then you could make 2 gallons of ro with 4 gallons of waste in water saver mode.

these are just rough numbers as your source water will determine how effective the second membrane works. the waste water going into the second membrane will have slightly higher tds than the water going int the first.
 
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