Sodium Nitrate Dosing...Help!!

[Reefahholic]

I just bought some Sodium Nitrate. I don’t like how it clumps up. I should have known. Potassium Nitrate was easier to weigh.

 

[Reefahholic]

Are you having any actual issues in the tank? Why do you want 3-5ppm nitrate?

Because that’s the sweet spot.

 

[BigJohnny]

Because that’s the sweet spot.

If you look at that post I wasn't asking you I was responding to the guy asking for advice.

 

[Reefahholic]

Once you start dosing sodium nitrate, which lower phosphates, should you dose some form of phosphate?
Also, how quickly should you test for nitrate after dosing? 214 hours later, 1 hour later?

I test about an hour later (let it get in the system good). Obviously later is better. I have it dialed in. I dose exactly 7 ML’s of my solution and it raises my NO3 perfectly by 1 ppm. I mix up a solution and test it with 1 gallon RODI water initially just to be sure.

 

[Reefahholic]

If you look at that post I wasn't asking you I was responding to the guy asking for advice.

Lol, well I knew what his answer was. Where do you keep your NO3 by the way and why?

 

[SaracensRugby]

Man I don’t check for a bit and look what happens I will go with the “sweet spot” answer. I just dosed 2 hours ago, checked now and looks like I have it up close to 2, from just above zero. One challenge I see is that took 50ml 2 days in a row from the neonitro bottle. I will continue for a few more days, until I run out to get my consumption, but at that rate 1 bottle will last me 5 days.....not cost beneficial. Good thing I got the loudwolf sodium nitrate Randy suggested as well.

 

[Reefahholic]

Man I don’t check for a bit and look what happens I will go with the “sweet spot” answer. I just dosed 2 hours ago, will check now.

Lol

Tried to tell him.

 

[drawman]

Man I don’t check for a bit and look what happens I will go with the “sweet spot” answer. I just dosed 2 hours ago, checked now and looks like I have it up close to 2, from just above zero. One challenge I see is that took 50ml 2 days in a row from the neonitro bottle. I will continue for a few more days, until I run out to get my consumption, but at that rate 1 bottle will last me 5 days.....not cost beneficial. Good thing I got the loudwolf sodium nitrate Randy suggested as well.

Generally you will have to dose more in the beginning and it will get quickly consumed over a 24hr period. Eventually this will level off and you will need to dose less. As others have said watch PO4 closely. When it comes to acros low PO4 can potentially be a lot worse than low NO3.

 

[chipmunkofdoom2]

Once you start dosing sodium nitrate, which lower phosphates, should you dose some form of phosphate?
Also, how quickly should you test for nitrate after dosing? 214 hours later, 1 hour later?

Dosing nitrates won't necessarily lower PO4. It might, if something in your tank can't grow because there isn't enough nitrate present. Once the nitrate becomes present and growth resumes, the specimen could use both nitrate and phosphate. But dosing nitrate itself doesn't cause any reduction in phosphate directly.

Whether you should dose phosphate depends. Aragonite can bind an incredible amount of phosphate. It's likely that your rock and sand has phosphate bound to it already that it will release once conditions become favorable (unless you did an acid bath or related treatment to remove all nitrate and phosphate from your rocks). It's best to test and monitor to know for sure.

 

[Reefahholic]

I haven’t observed any changes in PO4 after dosing NO3.

 

[SaracensRugby]

Ok, want to make sure I do this right so asking what I hope is a painfully obvious set of questions: (See attached image)

1. if I dose 10 ml a day given the associated concentration (at once, or over a couple doses), I should raise my overall tank nitrates up to 3.1ppm (roughly) right? Lets just assume it is a vacuum with no uptake, just trying to ballpark it.
2. Is there any reason why I should not just dose all at once each day?
3. Can I pre-make a 100mL solution of this and let it sit without having to worry about it precipitation, etc?
4. Should you dose daily, or should I dose more to raise nitrates up a little higher than say 5ppm, and skip a day and let them come down in the off day? I have a GHL doser so can set it on whatever schedule I want.

Also per @Randy Holmes-Farley I know I need to multiply the value by .84 since I am using Sodium nitrate vs. potassium nitrate. The Neonitro from Brightwell may be work well, but given a 250ml bottle and the size of my tank it would only last me less than a week. Not worth it......

Thanks!

 

[Makers Marc]

All, need some really specific help on dosing Food grade sodium nitrate into my 180g.

Using the calculators, I mixed 5 tbsps into a 500ml bottle. This should raise my n03 by 0.16ppm per 1 ml dosed.

1. Is there any negative to mixing up such a highly concentrated solution?

2. After mixing, I noticed Randy's post that I should have mixed 16% less, since the calculators are based on potassium nitrate, not sodium.

Can I just dose 84% of the amount for the same end result?

 

[Gareth elliott]

@Makers Marc

.16 seems really kinda low for N. You might have a very difficult time maintaining those low values or verifying via a test kit. I would aim more towards 1ppm as the low end.

 

[Makers Marc]

@Makers Marc

.16 seems really kinda low for N. You might have a very difficult time maintaining those low values or verifying via a test kit. I would aim more towards 1ppm as the low end.

Thats not what I meant. I forgot to add that I am dosing up to 5ppm as needed.

 

[Gareth elliott]

Thats not what I meant. I forgot to add that I am dosing up to 5ppm as needed.

Ok makes a lot more sense

I dont think there will be noticeable difference between 5.8 and 5. I would follow your initial plan.

 

[rock_lobster]

Dosing nitrates won't necessarily lower PO4. It might, if something in your tank can't grow because there isn't enough nitrate present. Once the nitrate becomes present and growth resumes, the specimen could use both nitrate and phosphate. But dosing nitrate itself doesn't cause any reduction in phosphate directly.

Whether you should dose phosphate depends. Aragonite can bind an incredible amount of phosphate. It's likely that your rock and sand has phosphate bound to it already that it will release once conditions become favorable (unless you did an acid bath or related treatment to remove all nitrate and phosphate from your rocks). It's best to test and monitor to know for sure.

That is kind of a contradictory statement. Considering that if your tank is LOW in nitrate with normal phosphate levels, Unless it is completely sterile of any form of marine life then when you add nitrate, phosphate will be dramatically reduced. Especially if you have a chaeto refugium. I've seen this personally many times when starting dosing nitrates the phosphates will plummet from the starved chaeto growth acceleration. Even without chaeto you will see a drop in phosphate in any established reef because there is tons of micro algae, filamentous algae, coral and bacteria that will all be nutrient limited by nitrate. As soon as you add it they will all begin utilizing phosphate at a much greater rate.

I guess you could say it is completely "indirect" but that is quite irrelevant since the result is dosing nitrates will lower phosphates if the tank is truly nitrate limited. Best bet is to be sure and have some sodium phosphate on hand as well if you plan to start nitrate dosing.

 

[Makers Marc]

Ok makes a lot more sense

I dont think there will be noticeable difference between 5.8 and 5. I would follow your initial plan.

Sounds good.

Right now my No3 = 2ppm (Red Sea Pro) Po4=.02ppm. Its been consistent for a month now, testing daily.

Evidently that's not enough for my Acros and Montis as some are paling, others are starting to show minor tip burn.

Alk has been stable from 7.12-7.40 (geo612 and AP Carbon doser)since adding the frags. Only guess is too low nutrients.

 

[Gareth elliott]

What kinda flow do you have?

 

[rock_lobster]

Sounds good.

Right now my No3 = 2ppm (Red Sea Pro) Po4=.02ppm. Its been consistent for a month now, testing daily.

Evidently that's not enough for my Acros and Montis as some are paling, others are starting to show minor tip burn.

Alk has been stable from 7.12-7.40 (geo612 and AP Carbon doser)since adding the frags. Only guess is too low nutrients.

Definitely on the low end of nutrients not terrible but maybe bump them up a little to 5+nitrates and .03+ phos. Probably some other issue going on as well.

 

[chipmunkofdoom2]

That is kind of a contradictory statement. Considering that if your tank is LOW in nitrate with normal phosphate levels, Unless it is completely sterile of any form of marine life then when you add nitrate, phosphate will be dramatically reduced. Especially if you have a chaeto refugium. I've seen this personally many times when starting dosing nitrates the phosphates will plummet from the starved chaeto growth acceleration. Even without chaeto you will see a drop in phosphate in any established reef because there is tons of micro algae, filamentous algae, coral and bacteria that will all be nutrient limited by nitrate. As soon as you add it they will all begin utilizing phosphate at a much greater rate.

I guess you could say it is completely "indirect" but that is quite irrelevant since the result is dosing nitrates will lower phosphates if the tank is truly nitrate limited. Best bet is to be sure and have some sodium phosphate on hand as well if you plan to start nitrate dosing.

It's contradictory at all. There's no mechanism by which adding nitrate directly reduces nitrate. As I said in my post, it's possible that something is nitrate limited and adding nitrates will give it the nutrients it needs to grow. But that's far from a guarantee.

It's not smart to assume that dosing nitrates will reduce phosphates because there's no direct mechanism or pathway to do that. If you'd like to claim that in a lot of cases it does, you're probably right and I don't take issue with that. But we should not be telling people that dosing nitrates will reduce phosphates because it just doesn't.