Stuggles with SPS

[mcarroll]

Wow, nobody asked for parameters? Is it just becasue he's canadian??? ;)

It's easy to blame your light (or salt mix), and you see folks do that all the time online. But chemistry fundamentals (including nutrients) are where the problems usually are. This is not coincidence.

Regardless of opinions we hold about how corals look, corals fundamentally do not like bright light (unlike clams, for example). Corals are "powered" by dinoflagellates which are relatively terrible at photosynthesis and can't really handle bright light well at all....and of course corals aren't really photosynthetic at all naturally. This is why corals have all the crazy photoadaptive mechanisms they have – to shield dino's from full light intensity and keep them under control. When their adaptatIons fail (eg too much light, too much heat, insufficient phosphorous, etc) a coral often has to bleach to save itself from its resident dino population. (I know clams are different in this regard, they can handle almost unlimited PAR levels...but I've never seen anyone explain why they are so different from corals.)

So while it's possible to under-light a tank for corals, if you're using a reef light and it's sized for the tank, it's not that likely.

You have two AI prime's on a shallow tank. Shouldn't be anything wrong with that setup. (Look around at how many other AI prime folks are growing those types of corals in tanks that are around the same height.)

IMO, the corals you are talking about just haven't taken off yet (as mentioned by another poster) and might even be hampered by other factors that are being glossed over so far.

The corals you are having "slow growth" with are also some of the more delicate corals in your tank, so any factor that is still unstable is going to slow them down. New tanks and new reefers are not often a good fit for delicate corals. In many tanks, slow-growing SPS often get overtaken by zoanthids, mushrooms and other faster growing corals – it's almost the norm. So, unless you are totally settled that new or more lighting will do the trick, I would post your water parameters and continue troubleshooting to make sure something more likely than under-lighting isn't going on. Flow is more important than lighting, just to name another area to investigate.

 

[Matt L]

Wow, nobody asked for parameters? Is it just becasue he's canadian??? ;)

It's easy to blame your light (or salt mix), and you see folks do that all the time online. But chemistry fundamentals (including nutrients) are where the problems usually are. This is not coincidence.

Regardless of opinions we hold about how corals look, corals fundamentally do not like bright light (unlike clams, for example). Corals are "powered" by dinoflagellates which are relatively terrible at photosynthesis and can't really handle bright light well at all....and of course corals aren't really photosynthetic at all naturally. This is why corals have all the crazy photoadaptive mechanisms they have – to shield dino's from full light intensity and keep them under control. When their adaptatIons fail (eg too much light, too much heat, insufficient phosphorous, etc) a coral often has to bleach to save itself from its resident dino population. (I know clams are different in this regard, they can handle almost unlimited PAR levels...but I've never seen anyone explain why they are so different from corals.)

So while it's possible to under-light a tank for corals, if you're using a reef light and it's sized for the tank, it's not that likely.

You have two AI prime's on a shallow tank. Shouldn't be anything wrong with that setup. (Look around at how many other AI prime folks are growing those types of corals in tanks that are around the same height.)

IMO, the corals you are talking about just haven't taken off yet (as mentioned by another poster) and might even be hampered by other factors that are being glossed over so far.

The corals you are having "slow growth" with are also some of the more delicate corals in your tank, so any factor that is still unstable is going to slow them down. New tanks and new reefers are not often a good fit for delicate corals. In many tanks, slow-growing SPS often get overtaken by zoanthids, mushrooms and other faster growing corals – it's almost the norm. So, unless you are totally settled that new or more lighting will do the trick, I would post your water parameters and continue troubleshooting to make sure something more likely than under-lighting isn't going on. Flow is more important than lighting, just to name another area to investigate.

Params:
Alk a bit high at 10-10.5 which is from Red Sea Coral Pro salt that I am slowly switching back to Seaspora Balanced Pro Salt
Salt - 35
Cal - 470
Mag - 1380
PH - 8.2
Nitrate 5-8
Phos - 0.15
Iodine - .003 (was zero and started to dose it, depletes fast on my tank)
These numbers are stable and get them steady

 

[mcarroll]

Glanced over params...doh! Those look fine.....that just leaves everything else besides params and lighting to look at now. ;)

 

[Krux]

How are you testing your PAR on that tank? Did you borrow a light meter?

 

[Harleys and tanks]

How are you testing your PAR on that tank? Did you borrow a light meter?

Yes I am using a PAR meter

 

[Harleys and tanks]

With a couple small adjustments I was able to raise the PAR on the side which has the Acros that need higher light so that they get 250ish for 6 hours and then up to almost 300 for 3 hours and mainly blue, violet. The light on that side is prob 4-5 inches off the surface though and pointed at an irregular angle in order for the acros to all get hit with that PAR and taking any of the heat off of the areas that don't want to get cooked. I have the fluval on the other side of the corals so the tissue gets light all around. Then once the new light arrives, I hope that I can hit the same or a little more PAR for that side with better spread etc, I will move the other two AIs to one side for the spread there and give the same PAR levels they are getting right now so there isn't a lot more change happening to them and keep it as stable as I can.

So with stable params (and I am sure they stay stable because i test twice a week for the major params anyways), light getting closer to what they really need and stable good flow, I hope to at least see some encrusting soon and then maybe they will take off. I will continue with the ICP just for piece of mind after a year of running but also to ensure something isn't way off or gotten in as a contaminant.

Thanks for everyone's help

 

[Featherweight]

My guess is your source water isn't clean enough, or your parameters are not as stable as you think or say they are. Clean source water and stability, and your lights won't matter as much.

 

[wasabi bean]

I would say it is either light or flow as if zoas and acans do really well then it is probably to low for sps that is what i found in my system

 

[hatfielj]

If you're not getting polyp extension, my first guess would be a pest. The most common one these days is white bugs. They are incredibly hard to spot, but I would bet money you've got them. The way to see them is wait until lights out, then shine a flashlight at an angle on an individual frag and watch closely with your face against the glass as close as you can get and focus and just sit there. If you see anything crawling across the acro tissue, it's white bugs. Treat the entire tank with interceptor for 4-5 weeks and you'll be good to go.
You really have to watch the coral in one spot and wait for a few minutes until one runs by. They are smaller than a pin head and can take quite awhile to find. But, if you see even one, you've got a problem in my experience.

 

[KIKe]

I would also say not nearly enough light. Especially if the other stuff, lps, etc is growing. Also agree with alk has to be dead solid. A small alk swing and my acros take a month to start growing good again. Start with way more light then go from there. Just know your LPs might not like it

My acros are alright with swings from 1 to even 2 on kh a day (sometimes I messed up dosing), sometimes they lose colors slightly but will fastly recover when everything is ok. I've had some extreme situations, from 4.2 on kh to 15 kh within two months but none of my tenuis and milles were dead. I'm still surprised everytime I think about this.

 

[CHSUB]

My acros are alright with swings from 1 to even 2 on kh a day (sometimes I messed up dosing), sometimes they lose colors slightly but will fastly recover when everything is ok. I've had some extreme situations, from 4.2 on kh to 15 kh within two months but none of my tenuis and milles were dead. I'm still surprised everytime I think about this.

Not only this, but there is a method that shows great growth and color when the entire amount of Alk is dosed at once in the morning. Any giant change can have an effect, but I'm skeptical if the components of alkalinity are any more important than stability in general.

 

[KIKe]

My acros are alright with swings from 1 to even 2 on kh a day (sometimes I messed up dosing), sometimes they lose colors slightly but will fastly recover when everything is ok. I've had some extreme situations, from 4.2 on kh to 15 kh within two months but none of my tenuis and milles were dead. I'm still surprised everytime I think about this.

Not only this, but there is a method that shows great growth and color when the entire amount of Alk is dosed at once in the morning. Any giant change can have an effect, but I'm skeptical if the components of alkalinity are any more important than stability in general.

Yeah keep them pretty stable is always right. I tried to dose more at night to reduce the ph swing.