Why do people buy expensive ATO?

[exnisstech]

I have a Tunze and it sucks. I have to reset it every day. Highly do NOT recommend.

There must be something wrong. I have a tunze on one tank that has been in use for two years. I've never had to reset it and I've only cleaned the sensor once.

 

[Danyole]

Been using a $50 MagTool ATO for close to 3 years now never had to replace anything and it comes with a controller. Not quite sure what a salinity sensor in my ATO container would do but I don't find manually testing a hassle at all. I have a routine and when i'm too hands off I tend to get bored anyways which is pretty much what happens with all of my FW tanks

 

[SeeSnek]

Asks if people use an expensive ATO... uses a $600+ Neptune Apex system for ATO ;)

 

[Tamberav]

I have a Tunze and it sucks. I have to reset it every day. Highly do NOT recommend.

which one? this isn't normal. Mine is 10 years old now.

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

Considering the price of a one inch frag. What's another $300 spent on a reliable ATO?

If you dig a bit further into the logic of this being an expensive hobby. Why then, purchase a $300 ato over a $600 apex that not only serves as an ATO but much much more?

 

[Tamberav]

Asks if people use an expensive ATO... uses a $600+ Neptune Apex system for ATO ;)

Pretty sure it doesn't do ATO out of the box either :p The Apex Pro does not come with a salinity probe. That is an extra $200

ofc you could do it with a apex solenoid or ATO or breakout box, more addons though.


I would also expect a salinity probe to have a "life expectancy" so that would be like buying a new ATO every few years?

It seems like doing it with salinity would be the most expensive way to have an ATO.

 

[Tamberav]

If you dig a bit further into the logic of this being an expensive hobby. Why then, purchase a $300 ato over a $600 apex that not only serves as an ATO but much much more?

The salinity probe does not come with apex, its an extra $200. So the OP's way of doing it is $800.

A person could purchase and apex and a tunze and be about the same cost wise.

Ofc there are cheaper ways of doing it like a solenoid or breakout box though those are probably on par with cheaper ATO.

The reality is you don't actually save any money with apex being the ATO since it isn't built in.

Maybe the OP still thought apex came with salinity probe as it used to but cuts have been made..

 

[GARRIGA]

If you dig a bit further into the logic of this being an expensive hobby. Why then, purchase a $300 ato over a $600 apex that not only serves as an ATO but much much more?

You're missing the point and wife argument... You buy both because you need both :rolling-on-the-floor-laughing:

 

[Dragen Fiend]

My cheapest is $30 ATO. Single sensor and micro pump. But I wouldn't trust it in a tank that evaporates a lot.


Of course my most expensive one is hydros controller with their ATO kit. Both work equally good. Just more sensors on one then the other. Plus more!

 

[subodhs]

I had some troubles with ATOs for my build that I documented in my build thread. I ended up programming a DOS to do the ATO function for me and thus far has worked flawlessly for my situation. I've been really pleased.

Certainly wouldn't recommend getting an Apex just for an ATO, or even a DOS.... seems like it's really under utilizing the value of the pump for this use case. However, I had a head free and thought I'd give it a try.

I think that your set up is very intriguing. However, I've had trouble with bubbles causing erratic conductivity readings with my Apex, and feel like I'd have to watch it like a hawk if I tried this.

I was wondering if you could elaborate a little more on the programming for your AWC and ATO. I guess that VNEEDSALT and VNEEDRO are virtual outlets? How do you incorporate this into your auto water change program?

Sorry if it's a dumb question, but I'm still a bit new at this.

@petcellar There's no such thing as a dumb question, and I appreciate you asking. This thread has veered off into directions I didn’t anticipate, so to keep things on track (and avoid adding fuel to the fire), I’ll PM you the programming details—it’s just a few lines of code. Feel free to reach out if you need more clarification!

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

The salinity probe does not come with apex, its an extra $200. So the OP's way of doing it is $800.

A person could purchase and apex and a tunze and be about the same cost wise.

Ofc there are cheaper ways of doing it like a solenoid or breakout box though those are probably on par with cheaper ATO.

The reality is you don't actually save any money with apex being the ATO since it isn't built in.

Maybe the OP still thought apex came with salinity probe as it used to but cuts have been made..

This might be my ignorance talking. Why would someone need a conductivity probe in order to operate an ATO.

I would agree that monitoring tank salinity has more benefits than not monitoring. But what benefit does it offer the ATO's ability to replenish evaporated water?

I recently got a backup apex pro that's still sealed in the box. I must've missed the fact that it was viod of the conductivity probe.

But on that note, the newer apex pro comes with a liquid level sensor and a built in FMM directly in the main apex brain. That means you only need to purchase a cheap pump to complete your ATO needs.

My point still remains that, if someone uses the excuse that this is an expensive hobby, why not spend 2/3 more and have a lot more options?

 

[Tamberav]

This might be my ignorance talking. Why would someone need a conductivity probe in order to operate an ATO.

I would agree that monitoring tank salinity has more benefits than not monitoring. But what benefit does it offer the ATO's ability to replenish evaporated water?

I recently got a backup apex pro that's still sealed in the box. I must've missed the fact that it was viod of the conductivity probe.

But on that note, the newer apex pro comes with a liquid level sensor and a built in FMM directly in the main apex brain. That means you only need to purchase a cheap pump to complete your ATO needs.

My point still remains that, if someone uses the excuse that this is an expensive hobby, why not spend 2/3 more and have a lot more options?

He tops off based on salinity of the probe.

My tunze is 10 years old and still works, haven’t even replaced the pump.

My apex EB32 lasted 2 years since they use crap parts in it.

My understanding is the FFM reliability isn’t there, at least it wasn’t last year. They were good for monitoring but not reliable for top off.

Why does apex sell the atk for another $200 if the apex can already do ATO?

FYI I would never buy the ATK, it’s so meh for the cost.


Also,
DONT put all your eggs one ONE basket.

I bought a tunze osmo because it is one of the best at what it does. Also I bought it 10 years ago before the new apex even existed. I would still buy it.. because it is still better than anything Apex has to offer and has its own brain.

If I was to use apex for top off... it would be with the breakout box where I could set up multiple float switches. Then you could technically have it tell you when skimmer cup is full or ATO is empty...

but I am lazy and I don't need all that monitoring anywho since ATO gets filled and skimmer emptied without needing float switches. May be more useful if my sump was in a basement though, easier to forget about something that is out of sight.

 

[Tamberav]

I have cats, I bought a $700 automatic cat box and a $100 addon to automatically refill it with litter.

I would rather manually top off RODI every day then scoop cat **** lol

Now THAT was the best investment.

 

[TaylorPilot]

http://autotopoff.com/
This dude has been making these for atleast 20 years. They just work. I would put a tom's aqua lifter on it and it will work for years and years and years...

 

[vlangel]

I have had ATOs but found it easier to put glass tops on my tank to drastically slow evaporation. I have heard the arguments that the tank does not get enough oxygen exchange but with good flow and the surface water of the tank having a little ripple that is never an issue that I have experienced. In the old days before ATOs tank tops is how we all dealt with evaporation and it helps salt creep too. Yes I have to add water once a week but so do a lot of folks who have reservoirs for their ATOs. It's old school but then so am I, LOL!

 

[56longroof]

Too be honest I wonder the same thing about Apex and similar products. I'm a low tech hands on type although I do have a ATO for the convenience.

 

[Matt Carden]

I've had bad luck with float sensors therefore I setup 12 timers on my reefpi to dose RO for 1.5 minutes. Adjust as necessary.

 

[reefkeep]

I’ve been unlucky with float switches, avaste, Redsea and Tunze. Tunze fails in the off position, best by far but I don’t trust it on my large tank. Redsea’s new on is the worst, it dumped nearly 4 gallons into my tank one day. My solution, I dose 4000 ml of freshwater and then manually turn on the Redsea ATO for a minute at a time every few days. I also monitor levels with Apex.

 

[CoralNewb]

I mean isn't it expensive just because people are willing to pay that much for it? Also, when you break out the prices for components, and the manual labor involved in making one, it adds up...the Tunze's are made in Bavaria I believe. Also, the cabling they use, the plastics they mold with, the resin they use for the clear optical lens, and the connector they use (plus the custom DC/DC power supply with their logo) these all add up in cost. So $200 really isn't unreasonable.

 

[Chrisanthellae]

I've got 4 of the generic AutoAqua optical ATOs that go for under $40 on eBay. No issues. They are tiny and work great. Granted, I've only had them for 4 years, but I have a sample size of 4. I see no reason at this time to pay any more for something else.

I've seen several people in this thread say they use the expensive ATOs because they are reliable, but it's not like we have concrete data that proves one brand is any more reliable than another. I suppose you can go by vibes from user testimonials and reviews but that's far from a reliable measure. Most negative reviews I see on ATOs are due to user error... It does seem like the reviews on Tunze in particular are overwhelmingly positive though, so I guess maybe that says something.

I feel similarly about lighting and pumps. Lots of people buy the expensive lights and pumps because they are somehow better or more reliable? Yet there's tons of threads about AI lenses burning and Nero pumps failing, for example. I'll stick to my trusty amazon lights and jebao pumps!