Ammonia going up and bacterial bloom during cycle

[Luan B.]

Hello,

I'm starting a new tank and cycling for about a month now and its a mess... Started with shrimp method and added ammonium chloride to give a boost. Was dosing bacteria in a bottle.

The problem is I'm wrecking my head over this, the shrimp was removed 1 week ago and I've stopped dosing ammonia around the same time but I'm still reading ammonia around 0.01ppm and instead of going down is going up (?) some days wont even move. How is that even possible? Did my cycle stall?

Also a clear slime is covering everything I literally have to remove chunks of it with a turkey blaster, doesn't look normal (picture taken from reddit but is exactly like that, all over the glass, rock, sanbed...

I'm cycling with light off - skimmer on
Phos 0.05
Nitrates 14.5
Alk 8.1
Ph around 8
Salinity 1.026

 

[Lavey29]

Your tank is cycled and because you are running lights your introducing algae and blooms. Do a water change and add first fish.

 

[Luan B.]

Your tank is cycled and because you are running lights your introducing algae and blooms. Do a water change and add first fish.

How is the tank cycled if still reading ammonia? Also my lights are off. Done a water change this morning btw

 

[Lavey29]

How is the tank cycled if still reading ammonia? Also my lights are off. Done a water change this morning btw

If you have nitrate production the tank is cycling. Hobby grade test kits may show some small ammonia reading because of the error rate and or quality of the test kit. If your concerned just add some nitrifying bacteria. .01 ammonia is nothing.

 

[Dan_P]

Hello,

I'm starting a new tank and cycling for about a month now and its a mess... Started with shrimp method and added ammonium chloride to give a boost. Was dosing bacteria in a bottle.

The problem is I'm wrecking my head over this, the shrimp was removed 1 week ago and I've stopped dosing ammonia around the same time but I'm still reading ammonia around 0.01ppm and instead of going down is going up (?) some days wont even move. How is that even possible? Did my cycle stall?

Also a clear slime is covering everything I literally have to remove chunks of it with a turkey blaster, doesn't look normal (picture taken from reddit but is exactly like that, all over the glass, rock, sanbed...

I'm cycling with light off - skimmer on
Phos 0.05
Nitrates 14.5
Alk 8.1
Ph around 8
Salinity 1.026

Any time that meat rots in water, there is a chance for a bacteria bloom.

The 0.01 ppm total ammonia is pretty close to zero and might be zero for the test kit. What are you using to measure ammonia?

The nitrate might actually be nitrite or mix of nitrite and nitrate. How much ammonia were you adding? Did you measure nitrite?

 

[Lavey29]

Nitrite is irrelevant in reef aquaria.

 

[Luan B.]

If you have nitrate production the tank is cycling. Hobby grade test kits may show some small ammonia reading because of the error rate and or quality of the test kit. If your concerned just add some nitrifying bacteria. .01 ammonia is nothing.

Exactly what I was doing but is not going down. When I put the sensor on my stabilised tank shows 0 tho.

Any time that meat rots in water, there is a chance for a bacteria bloom.

The 0.01 ppm total ammonia is pretty close to zero and might be zero for the test kit. What are you using to measure ammonia?

The nitrate might actually be nitrite or mix of nitrite and nitrate. How much ammonia were you adding? Did you measure nitrite?

Testing with a Seneye. Nitrite is showing the exact same amount as ammonia which makes me wonder if that’s right - added in total about 2oz of ammonium chloride

 

[Dan_P]

Nitrite is irrelevant in reef aquaria.

Nitrite interferes with the nitrate test, causing it to appear higher than it really is.

 

[Dan_P]

Exactly what I was doing but is not going down. When I put the sensor on my stabilised tank shows 0 tho.



Testing with a Seneye. Nitrite is showing the exact same amount as ammonia which makes me wonder if that’s right - added in total about 2oz of ammonium chloride

Nitrite is NO2-, not NH3 which the Seneye device measures.

You never measured the ppm of the ammonia added? I am trying to get a sense of how much ammonia was processed.

By the way, what bacteria have you been adding?

It is likely that the aquarium has some capacity to remove ammonia. The information we have so far doesn’t provide a sense of how much capacity.

 

[Luan B.]

Nitrite is NO2-, not NH3 which the Seneye device measures.

You never measured the ppm of the ammonia added? I am trying to get a sense of how much ammonia was processed.

By the way, what bacteria have you been adding?

It is likely that the aquarium has some capacity to remove ammonia. The information we have so far doesn’t provide a sense of how much capacity.

That makes me feel dumb now thinking NH3 was nitrites. Never tested nitrites then

I tried Red Sea mature pro (but the LFS never told me would treat only 100ltrs) so I run out of everything in day 3 pretty much, at that time I manage to get dr Tim ammonium chloride and dosing Fauna Marin Bacto blend since I had a bottle left from previous tank.

Ammonia level at peak was 0.150ppm - now stuck around 0.010 but again I’m not sure how accurate is the seneye

Testing with Salifert is showing something between 0.25 and 0.50 (the one on the right comparing to my matured tank on the left)

I just wonder why ammonia is not going away and sometimes the reading goes up even after water changes and if the bacterial bloom has something to do with it like overtaking good bacteria somehow…

 

[Luan B.]

Photos of the nasty stuff

 

[Lavey29]

Nitrite interferes with the nitrate test, causing it to appear higher than it really is.

Nitrite is just the brief temporary stage in the cycle. It is not harmful to fish. As long as you are showing nitrates production and ammonia is 0 or close to it due to test error ratio then your tank is cycling.

 

[Shirak]

I just wonder why ammonia is not going away and sometimes the reading goes up even after water changes and if the bacterial bloom has something to do with it like overtaking good bacteria somehow…

Hobby test kits are inaccurate and have a +- range of approximately .06ppm or more. So a 0 reading could read 0 to .06 and anything in between, hence the appearance it is going up and down when it is not.

Bacterial bloom from dead shrimp is not messing up the bacteria for the nitrogen cycle. They are still there. Water changes will get rid of excess nutrients and clear the water. Stop adding ammonia...

 

[Dan_P]

That makes me feel dumb now thinking NH3 was nitrites. Never tested nitrites then

I tried Red Sea mature pro (but the LFS never told me would treat only 100ltrs) so I run out of everything in day 3 pretty much, at that time I manage to get dr Tim ammonium chloride and dosing Fauna Marin Bacto blend since I had a bottle left from previous tank.

Ammonia level at peak was 0.150ppm - now stuck around 0.010 but again I’m not sure how accurate is the seneye

Testing with Salifert is showing something between 0.25 and 0.50 (the one on the right comparing to my matured tank on the left)

I just wonder why ammonia is not going away and sometimes the reading goes up even after water changes and if the bacterial bloom has something to do with it like overtaking good bacteria somehow…

Here are some thoughts and opinions.

It seems that you have not added nitrifying bacteria. Bacto Blend does not seem like a product to start a population of nitrifying bacteria in an aquarium, the ones that convert ammonia to nitrite and nitrate. Other bacteria might consume ammonia but not likely make nitrite or nitrate.

The nitrate you are measuring might really be a very small amount of nitrite. If true, the aquarium has only a small capacity to convert ammonia to nitrite and nitrite, maybe enough for a little fish.

Unless the Seneye is calibrated, take the values as approximations.

Let’s have fun with numbers. The Seneye NH3 value peaked at 0.15 ppm, which roughly corresponds to 1.5 ppm total ammonia, the number you obtain from hobby test kits. You observe that it is now stable at 0.01 ppm NH3 which is approximately 0.1 ppm total ammonia. The Salifert test indicates 0.25-0.50 ppm total ammonia or approximately 0.025-0.05 ppm NH3. We have two tests indicating elevated ammonia, not seriously bad though, but could be evidence of a low capability of consuming ammonia. So, aquarium might be ready for a little fish after the current ammonia is gone.

Was the peak 1.5 ppm ammonia converted to nitrate? If it was, there would be about 4x as much nitrate as there was ammonia or 6 ppm nitrate. You reported 14 ppm nitrate. A possible indication of there being nitrite present.

The bacteria bloom is possibly a consequence of rotting meat, dosing Bacto Blend and Dr. Tim’s ammonia. Probably no harm done, just a mess that will clear up in time.

You have two choices, each from different ends of the risk spectrum: assume the aquarium is cycled and add fish, or add nitrifying bacteria and when the ammonia is zeroed out add fish.

 

[Shirak]

@Dan_P Good thoughts but you might want to check up on Bacto Blend.

According to Fauna Marin from their website

"

Fauna Marin Bacto Blend bacteria system for marine aquarium is a special composition of halophilic and phototrophic bacteria cultures that quickly activates and stabilizes all relevant biological nutrient cycles in your reef aquarium.​

• Description
• Product video
• HowTo

BACTO BLEND: our all-rounder!

• Super concentrated mixture of halophilic and phototrophic bacteria
• Perfect bacterial mixture for starting a salt water aquarium
• Contains hydrolytic enzymes and special nitrogen bacteria for reduction of unwanted nutrients
• Reduces sludge and detritus buildup, highly effective against unwanted bacterial deposits
• Improves growth and coloration of fish and corals
• Fresh ocean smell / improves skimmer performance
• Contains NO sulfide or other toxic preservatives
• No foul odor or rotten egg smell
• Live bacteria / effect immediately after dosing
• Highly concentrated for cost-effective dosing
• Developed and produced in Germany

"

 

[Lavey29]

Here are some thoughts and opinions.

It seems that you have not added nitrifying bacteria. Bacto Blend does not seem like a product to start a population of nitrifying bacteria in an aquarium, the ones that convert ammonia to nitrite and nitrate. Other bacteria might consume ammonia but not likely make nitrite or nitrate.

The nitrate you are measuring might really be a very small amount of nitrite. If true, the aquarium has only a small capacity to convert ammonia to nitrite and nitrite, maybe enough for a little fish.

Unless the Seneye is calibrated, take the values as approximations.

Let’s have fun with numbers. The Seneye NH3 value peaked at 0.15 ppm, which roughly corresponds to 1.5 ppm total ammonia, the number you obtain from hobby test kits. You observe that it is now stable at 0.01 ppm NH3 which is approximately 0.1 ppm total ammonia. The Salifert test indicates 0.25-0.50 ppm total ammonia or approximately 0.025-0.05 ppm NH3. We have two tests indicating elevated ammonia, not seriously bad though, but could be evidence of a low capability of consuming ammonia. So, aquarium might be ready for a little fish after the current ammonia is gone.

Was the peak 1.5 ppm ammonia converted to nitrate? If it was, there would be about 4x as much nitrate as there was ammonia or 6 ppm nitrate. You reported 14 ppm nitrate. A possible indication of there being nitrite present.

The bacteria bloom is possibly a consequence of rotting meat, dosing Bacto Blend and Dr. Tim’s ammonia. Probably no harm done, just a mess that will clear up in time.

You have two choices, each from different ends of the risk spectrum: assume the aquarium is cycled and add fish, or add nitrifying bacteria and when the ammonia is zeroed out add fish.

Never hurts to add nitrifying bacteria as stated in my prior post yesterday

 

[lonhater]

Hello,

I'm starting a new tank and cycling for about a month now and its a mess... Started with shrimp method and added ammonium chloride to give a boost. Was dosing bacteria in a bottle.

The problem is I'm wrecking my head over this, the shrimp was removed 1 week ago and I've stopped dosing ammonia around the same time but I'm still reading ammonia around 0.01ppm and instead of going down is going up (?) some days wont even move. How is that even possible? Did my cycle stall?

Also a clear slime is covering everything I literally have to remove chunks of it with a turkey blaster, doesn't look normal (picture taken from reddit but is exactly like that, all over the glass, rock, sanbed...

I'm cycling with light off - skimmer on
Phos 0.05
Nitrates 14.5
Alk 8.1
Ph around 8
Salinity 1.026

What ammonia test kit are you using? .01 on any hobby tester is suspect to me. Even the low range Hannah checker has a +-.05 range

 

[Dan_P]

@Dan_P Good thoughts but you might want to check up on Bacto Blend.

According to Fauna Marin from their website

"

Fauna Marin Bacto Blend bacteria system for marine aquarium is a special composition of halophilic and phototrophic bacteria cultures that quickly activates and stabilizes all relevant biological nutrient cycles in your reef aquarium.​

• Description
• Product video
• HowTo

BACTO BLEND: our all-rounder!

• Super concentrated mixture of halophilic and phototrophic bacteria
• Perfect bacterial mixture for starting a salt water aquarium
• Contains hydrolytic enzymes and special nitrogen bacteria for reduction of unwanted nutrients
• Reduces sludge and detritus buildup, highly effective against unwanted bacterial deposits
• Improves growth and coloration of fish and corals
• Fresh ocean smell / improves skimmer performance
• Contains NO sulfide or other toxic preservatives
• No foul odor or rotten egg smell
• Live bacteria / effect immediately after dosing
• Highly concentrated for cost-effective dosing
• Developed and produced in Germany

"

I did read this description before commenting.

 

[Luan B.]

What ammonia test kit are you using? .01 on any hobby tester is suspect to me. Even the low range Hannah checker has a +-.05 range

Seneye monitor - I've bought for using as a PAR meter but have monitoring features (questionable readings tho)

Testing with Salifert common colour matching test as well

I did read this description before commenting.

I might buy some Dr. Tim One and Only just to be sure - don't really want to stress my clowns for no reason.

Thanks for all replies, apparently nothing but a waiting game at this stage.