Dinoflagellates – Are You Tired Of Battling Altogether?

ScottB

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Ost? What do you guys think? Scope is kinda crappy sorry... Only on my sand bed. Trying to read up and figure out what to do but sounds like maybe my tank is a bit too clean (biocube 32) Thinking of doing very little other than manual removal and maybe some pods and phyto along with some MB7 and no water changes. This a good start? Lots of opinions out there

20200108_200509.jpg 20200108_200506.jpg
Sorry not ostreopsis. They are almond shaped.

I don’t have a link to @taricha Dino id thread on the road right now. I can see the small circle inside but can’t recall if that is procentrum or coolia.
 

pinkfloyd1312

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yea i have been looking around and i agree it's definately not almond shaped so i'm now leaning amph which would make a lot of sense since they seem to be bound to the sand and not the rocks. they don't look round enough to be the coolia to me but what do i know....
 

DesertReefT4r

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Yeah! So I beat amphidinium dinoflagellates, had to remove all my sand but its gone. Only problem is that now after a few weeks my tank is developing the snotty type of dinoflagellates. Going to bust out the microscope again to ID it just fearing what I think I will find. I ordered a UV sterilizer this morning, done with this issue. No4 has been hanging at 20 ppm and po4 at 0.21 ppm so thats not the cause this time around.
 

ScottB

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Yeah! So I beat amphidinium dinoflagellates, had to remove all my sand but its gone. Only problem is that now after a few weeks my tank is developing the snotty type of dinoflagellates. Going to bust out the microscope again to ID it just fearing what I think I will find. I ordered a UV sterilizer this morning, done with this issue. No4 has been hanging at 20 ppm and po4 at 0.21 ppm so thats not the cause this time around.
Amphidinium is the worst. Anything else goes into the water column and should get zapped by the UV.
i had just about wrapped up another ostreopsis outbreak when I left 6 days ago. Hoping it is staying away. Left pretty dirty feeding instructions so I am hopeful.
 

taricha

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AmScope M150C-I 40X-1000X All-Metal Optical Glass Lenses Cordless LED Student Biological Compound Microscope
This (and similar) are great scopes. If a scope says it offers 1000x or more magnification and isn't metal body and glass optics, it's really poor for our purposes.
my scope I use has 400x maximum - 40x objective, 10x lens. Put smartphone camera on it and zoom in...
Amphidnium LG.jpg

it's plenty to see what you're looking for and more. (common large cell amphidinium)

Sorry not ostreopsis. They are almond shaped.

I don’t have a link to @taricha Dino id thread on the road right now. I can see the small circle inside but can’t recall if that is procentrum or coolia.
That looks prorocentrum to me.
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/dinoflagellate-identification-guide.671466/
 

taricha

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high pH was a treatment for dinos in the old days. I just tried to explain why it might work.

pH changes might also alter the bioavailability of some trace metals such as iron. I think trace elements might be why dinos lose out in competition to other organisms when nutrients are high.
Thought about this a couple of times in the past few years.
Is this diagram a decent way to think about the shift in Fe form when changing pH (elevating to the right) and oxidizing with h2o2 or ozone (toward the top)?
Iron diagram.jpg
 
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ScottB

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Thanks Scott. Do we have a recommended treatment?
Sorry, yesterday was a travel day...

Yes, we do. It is the pretty standard dino protocol proven to work for almost all (amphidinium is trickier). In short we are trying to dirty up the water a bit so that other organisms outcompete. Also killing dinos with UV.

1) Raise PO4 and NO3 to .1 to .15 AND 10 to 15 by dosing. (NeoNitro and NeoPhos are good ready-mix solutions)
2) Run a UV. 1 watt per 3 gallons. Run it kinda slow, like 3X turnover) Important: Run it to & from the DISPLAY, not the sump. PITA, but works 100X better
3) Run some activated carbon to soak up the toxins they produce.
4) As often as possible, stir the dinos up to get them into the water and thru the UV
5) I like to stick a bunch of filter floss to my glass in high flow and high light areas. They will cling there instead of corals. Rinse each night.
6) Don't dose aminos.
7) Watch your ALK if you are dosing two-part. Coral consumption falls rapidly in dino outbreaks.
8) Skip water changes until you are clean for 2-4 weeks.

I recommend Hanna ULR for testing phosphates and Red Sea for nitrates.
 

Qasimja

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so i have a 150g tank been having issues with dinos for a few months it mostly stays on the sand and releases when the lights go off but comes right back when the lights turn on so far ive been managing it by stirring the sand bed , weekly dark periods and changing my filter socks every 2 days but this is getting tiring i want to try and run UV will this unit work?

uv
 

Bmwm235i

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so i have a 150g tank been having issues with dinos for a few months it mostly stays on the sand and releases when the lights go off but comes right back when the lights turn on so far ive been managing it by stirring the sand bed , weekly dark periods and changing my filter socks every 2 days but this is getting tiring i want to try and run UV will this unit work?

uv
I bought a jeabo 55w for $95 for my 120g.. not something I'd hook up to my tank long term but for fighting Dino's it's proven its self very well. I have a Aqua UV in my sump, this is my permanent UV. The key was having a UV take from the display and empty back into the display. I would say that uv you linked is underpowered for your 150. Try shooting for 1w per 3 gallons. A 55w would fit your system well.
 

ScottB

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so i have a 150g tank been having issues with dinos for a few months it mostly stays on the sand and releases when the lights go off but comes right back when the lights turn on so far ive been managing it by stirring the sand bed , weekly dark periods and changing my filter socks every 2 days but this is getting tiring i want to try and run UV will this unit work?

uv
For a 150G, you need at least 50 watts for effective dino killing. And by golly are the good ones expensive!

For DINO alone, I would go with the Jaebo for much less and install as described by @Bmwm235i

That said, there are some sand based dinos that do not go into the water column; instead they retreat into the sand at night. If you could get a 400X image or video to confirm, it might save you some money, time and grief.
 

Qasimja

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I bought a jeabo 55w for $95 for my 120g.. not something I'd hook up to my tank long term but for fighting Dino's it's proven its self very well. I have a Aqua UV in my sump, this is my permanent UV. The key was having a UV take from the display and empty back into the display. I would say that uv you linked is underpowered for your 150. Try shooting for 1w per 3 gallons. A 55w would fit your system well.
Thanks can you link me to that model if you can
 
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DesertReefT4r

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Sorry, but that looks like amphidinium to me, so UV is not going to help much. Is this growing on the sand primarily? Good news is that it is not toxic and shouldn't kill anything. Just looks annoying.
No more sand. I had amphidinium in my sand before I removed all the sand a few weeks ago. This new dino looks different and stays on the rock, glass and powerhead cords.
20191102_185259.jpg

This is the dino that was in the sand, pretty sure it was amphidinium.


This is whats in the tank now, acts different forming string snot whxih is different than before when dinis only stayed on the sand. Still amphidinium or js this ostreopsis? 20200112_170146_resized.jpg
 

ScottB

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No more sand. I had amphidinium in my sand before I removed all the sand a few weeks ago. This new dino looks different and stays on the rock, glass and powerhead cords.
20191102_185259.jpg

This is the dino that was in the sand, pretty sure it was amphidinium.


This is whats in the tank now, acts different forming string snot whxih is different than before when dinis only stayed on the sand. Still amphidinium or js this ostreopsis? 20200112_170146_resized.jpg
The "beak" look made me think amphids, but the movement pattern matches ostreopsis. Where pointy end acts like a tether that it floats around.
@taricha for the confirmation.
 

DesertReefT4r

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The "beak" look made me think amphids, but the movement pattern matches ostreopsis. Where pointy end acts like a tether that it floats around.
@taricha for the confirmation.
Yeah these have a more almond shape to them and what was in the sand (amphidinium) was more oval shaped. New stuff is spreading really fast as well, rock is totally covered today. I tried to syphon it out with a filter sock but the dinos just go right through it, need smaller micron socks. Its also in my sump now too so its moving into the water colum for sure. Im no expert, starting to become one though, but to me it looks like ostreopsis is what I am dealing with now. Placing an order with BRS for filter socks tonight, waiting on my UV but I should have gotten a higher watt unit I think. Ordered a 9w in tank UV so hopefully it will help at least. The smell is really bad as well right now, way worst then amphidinium. What I dont get is how dinos bloomed again. I have green hair algae growth, green and some brown film algae, corlline growth, macro algae is doing good in the fuge, dosing the crap out of bacteria, adding small pieces of healthy live rock, feeding heavy, feeding the tank live phytoplankton, no Reef Roids for months, no3 is over 10ppm and po4 is over 0.15ppm. Was it from dosing Bionic alk and doing a 10g water change, added trace elements?
 
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