GFCI Outlet poll

[drblakjak55]

For safety sake use gfci

 

[MarcF]

I put the GFCI adapter in the wall outlet. Then I plugged in my entire power strip with everything on in into one of the 5 outlets available through the adapter, and the ground probe into another of the outlets (not into the power strip although it should be equivalent). There we are. Fully grounded and GFCI'd.

 

[DBR_Reef]

I think I agree with you - but taking it from someone who had a SW tank in his daughters room. and it caught on fire - with a GFI - yeah - there's that. Im not an electrical expert - I just know - it works both ways. Well - at least I was surprised as to how well they opened every cupboard and cleaned every item - when the insurance came - took 5 days.. So there's that - I have no agenda.

GFI only works for ground faults- if you want better, more complete protection, you need a arc fault and ground fault breaker

 

[DBR_Reef]

I’ve been in this hobby for 20 years. GFI use to be the must haves. I my experience. I would put the return pump on a non-gfi. I had too many close calls cuz something made the breaker pop. Lucky I was always around.

From others and I’ll probably switch I will leave a return pump ( I have 2), on a normal plug in.

My big tank with two circuits is partially GFCI, keeping the return pump and lighting off GFCI.

-plug everything into the GFCI except the return pump, which I'll plug into a regular outlet, but watch it like a hawk and make sure it's well away from wetness. That part may prove tricky. Where do people position their return pump, usually?

Then I would plug my return pump straight to the wall, no gfci.

Ill plug pretty much everything but the main return pump into GFI outlets if available, otherwise, not absolutely necessary (for me)

There is a lot of questionable info in this thread, but this whole "plug everything into a GFI but the return pump" idea needs to be squashed. AC return pumps are one of the most likely sources of a ground fault, they should not be left unprotected. And what benefit is provided by having only the return pump running? With everything else turned off the only benefit of a return pump is circulation, which can be better achieved with a powerhead. If you feel something is essential, plug it into a separate GFI circuit or (if it is DC) put it on a battery backup. Any non-GFI outlet in the vicinity of a tank is a hazard- most outlets are low down are just asking to have water hit them.

Bottom line, GFI and AFCI protection can save your life. It is stupid, probably against code (depending on your reading- is the tank considered a "Indoor wet location"), and possibly a legal liability if anyone but you is injured if a circuit is not protected.

 

[robbyg]

There is a lot of questionable info in this thread, but this whole "plug everything into a GFI but the return pump" idea needs to be squashed. AC return pumps are one of the most likely sources of a ground fault, they should not be left unprotected. And what benefit is provided by having only the return pump running? With everything else turned off the only benefit of a return pump is circulation, which can be better achieved with a powerhead. If you feel something is essential, plug it into a separate GFI circuit or (if it is DC) put it on a battery backup. Any non-GFI outlet in the vicinity of a tank is a hazard- most outlets are low down are just asking to have water hit them.

Bottom line, GFI and AFCI protection can save your life. It is stupid, probably against code (depending on your reading- is the tank considered a "Indoor wet location"), and possibly a legal liability if anyone but you is injured.

I agree. About the only thing I don't have in a GFI are my Vortech pumps. For obvious reasons they are not a shock hazard and they can keep a tank going for several hours.

 

[Matt Carden]

Split power onto 2 circuits with a gfci and grounding probe on each. Use redundant heaters, powerheads, etc. running off each circuit so if one fails the other will hopefully still have at least a heater and powerhead running.

 

[TheHarold]

There is a lot of questionable info in this thread, but this whole "plug everything into a GFI but the return pump" idea needs to be squashed. AC return pumps are one of the most likely sources of a ground fault, they should not be left unprotected. And what benefit is provided by having only the return pump running? With everything else turned off the only benefit of a return pump is circulation, which can be better achieved with a powerhead. If you feel something is essential, plug it into a separate GFI circuit or (if it is DC) put it on a battery backup. Any non-GFI outlet in the vicinity of a tank is a hazard- most outlets are low down are just asking to have water hit them.

Bottom line, GFI and AFCI protection can save your life. It is stupid, probably against code (depending on your reading- is the tank considered a "Indoor wet location"), and possibly a legal liability if anyone but you is injured if a circuit is not protected.

Who said I was running AC return pump? Majority of hobbyists are running DC pumps these days.

I consider relative risk. The change of me dying due to do a faulty device is MUCH lower than me dying while driving to work. In history there was a single hobbyist (known for DIY), years ago (Probably using primarily AC equipment) that died. One.

We can’t fear monger- I’m not too concerned about it. Better off banning all palythoa, given the amount of hobbyists that have been affected by that

 

[Sarah24!]

Hello,

All of my wave makers and returns are dc pumps or u it’s as well. I have one dc pump that is not on the same circuit just so I don’t flood my house Incase my check valves get moved. Running a grounding probe is definitely ideal. Unless they are wired separately (in my home), all the kitchen out let’s are one circuit same with living room. So unless I hire someone to completely change the circuits, they have to run on them. Luckily I have two right next to my tank so I can evenly load it. Regardless, of that if I’m over the limit it will trip the fuse. Which you never know when that happens, so that’s why I always keep 1 return that’s dc on a separate circuit and that single item is backed up. As much as I want heaters, they drain the battery way to fast. I have now gone to a generator it’s it’s going to be more than a couple of hours. Oddly enough my tank is the only thing connected. Should probably reconsider that lol.

 

[zalick]

. . .
In history there was a single hobbyist (known for DIY) . . .
We can’t fear monger . . .

Do you have evidence that his death had anything to do with DIY?

 

[robbyg]

Hello,

All of my wave makers and returns are dc pumps or u it’s as well. I have one dc pump that is not on the same circuit just so I don’t flood my house Incase my check valves get moved. Running a grounding probe is definitely ideal. Unless they are wired separately (in my home), all the kitchen out let’s are one circuit same with living room. So unless I hire someone to completely change the circuits, they have to run on them. Luckily I have two right next to my tank so I can evenly load it. Regardless, of that if I’m over the limit it will trip the fuse. Which you never know when that happens, so that’s why I always keep 1 return that’s dc on a separate circuit and that single item is backed up. As much as I want heaters, they drain the battery way to fast. I have now gone to a generator it’s it’s going to be more than a couple of hours. Oddly enough my tank is the only thing connected. Should probably reconsider that lol.

I assume the dual plug outlet that you are using is a GFI outlet?
It would be a good idea to invest in a transfer switch and hooking up the generator to most of your house. I have been through several Hurricanes and lost power for months after one of them. I learned a lot of lessons during that time.

I use a Gas generator because Gas is the one thing that you can always find after a disaster. We siphoned gas out of cars for the first week. Second is don't go too big with the generator, it will burn through fuel a lot faster. Do you really need AC or Hot Water after a major disaster? Nope! You can survive without them. I have everything in my House wired to the Generator except the ACs, water Heater and Microwave. My stove is Gas and I have a backup grill, so I am good in that department. How close are your neighbors houses? That is a big one because if they are within 80ft or so, you're going to have a lynch mob at your door when that thing is running at 1am. If they are close then I suggest a Honda Eu3000 for those who are willing to be in semi survival mode and a Honda EU7000 for those who are willing to find more gas and want to be in Luxury. A lot of this depends on where you live and how much money your willing to spend. If your in the sticks then you can go with a nice big Loud Diesel generator and a huge tank of fuel. Propane generators are great but the problem is finding a resupply of fuel in the first weeks after a natural disaster.

 

[DBR_Reef]

Who said I was running AC return pump? Majority of hobbyists are running DC pumps these days.

I consider relative risk. The change of me dying due to do a faulty device is MUCH lower than me dying while driving to work. In history there was a single hobbyist (known for DIY), years ago (Probably using primarily AC equipment) that died. One.

We can’t fear monger- I’m not too concerned about it. Better off banning all palythoa, given the amount of hobbyists that have been affected by that

I know I'm not going to change any already made minds, but there were multiple people on this thread saying they were going to put everything except return pumps on gfi, based on the info found here. Just hoping I can prevent them from making that decision Even if you have a DC return pump, any unprotected outlet within the area of the tank is a risk. Drip loops just don't cut it anymore, not when combo gfci afci breakers exist.

Yes, the risks are relatively low, but why take them on when a GFIs are cheap and very reliable. It just doesn't make sense. I consider it dumb just like I consider it dumb to not wear your seat belt when you drive into work. (not saying you don't wear your seat belt)

I would suggest that hobbyist do their best to follow electrical code. The closest applicable NEC code is for fountains, which says any outlet within 20ft has to be gfi, and new construction has to have arc fault. It is NEC code and the safety devices that it requires that has resulted in a decrease in electrical fires in the US even with aging housing stock. Every new code is decried as nanny state interference, but I for one would prefer to not have a house fire.

Data- not fear mongering

 

[Brian_68]

I know I'm not going to change any already made minds, but there were multiple people on this thread saying they were going to put everything except return pumps on gfi, based on the info found here. Just hoping I can prevent them from making that decision Even if you have a DC return pump, any unprotected outlet within the area of the tank is a risk. Drip loops just don't cut it anymore, not when combo gfci afci breakers exist.

Yes, the risks are relatively low, but why take them on when a GFIs are cheap and very reliable. It just doesn't make sense. I consider it dumb just like I consider it dumb to not wear your seat belt when you drive into work. (not saying you don't wear your seat belt)

I would suggest that hobbyist do their best to follow electrical code. The closest applicable NEC code is for fountains, which says any outlet within 20ft has to be gfi, and new construction has to have arc fault. It is NEC code and the safety devices that it requires that has resulted in a decrease in electrical fires in the US even with aging housing stock. Every new code is decried as nanny state interference, but I for one would prefer to not have a house fire.

Data- not fear mongering

AFCI are designed for fire prevention, GFCI are mainly for shock. One of the big drivers for a decrease in home fires due to electrical failure is products approved to standards like UL, CSA etc. Additional good advise would be not to use lights, power strips etc. that have not been approved by a safety agency.

 

[DBR_Reef]

AFCI are designed for fire prevention, GFCI are mainly for shock. One of the big drivers for a decrease in home fires due to electrical failure is products approved to standards like UL, CSA etc. Additional good advise would be not to use lights, power strips etc. that have not been approved by a safety agency.

Very good advice-- I would add that most fires are not appliance related, but wiring related, so a focus on the implementation of AFCI and GFCI should still be pushed. And AFCI/GFCI combo outlets are now available for reasonable prices.

 

[jgvergo]

Yes because in the entire history of reefkeeping, one person (Known for DIY) died of electrocution. I think if we are talking about avoiding relative risk... better to avoid getting into a vehicle, or going swimming at a beach. There is a difference between a recommendation and fear mongering.

Sorry, but your statement the " in the entire history of reefkeeping, one person (Known for DIY) died of electrocution" is something that can never be confirmed. I'll go with the advice every elementary schooler knows...water and electricity are a potentially deadly combination.

 

[Daniel@R2R]

I lost a mature 120 G reef tank due to a GFCI trip while I was on vacation. I definitely would not use one for the life support functions like the return pump, lights and possibly one or more heaters. Since the crash, I have gone with zero GFCI. Has anyone heard of anyone being fatally electrocuted by their fish tank? I have not.

Mike

I don't use one. ;Sorry And the reason stated by @NoFeedback is my reason. I fear that something trivial will trip it and my reef will die as a result.

 

[Brew12]

I don't use one. ;Sorry And the reason stated by @NoFeedback is my reason. I fear that something trivial will trip it and my reef will die as a result.

That is why I use multiple GFCI's so a single trip can't wipe my tank.

I've helped advise many people on here who have lost fish and coral due to failed electrical equipment leaching copper and other contaminants into their tank that could easily have been prevented with a GFCI and ground probe.
Many more tanks than were lost to a properly designed and installed GFCI system.

 

[Daniel@R2R]

That is why I use multiple GFCI's so a single trip can't wipe my tank.

I've helped advise many people on here who have lost fish and coral due to failed electrical equipment leaching copper and other contaminants into their tank that could easily have been prevented with a GFCI and ground probe.
Many more tanks than were lost to a properly designed and installed GFCI system.

Using multiple GFCI's actually is an excellent solution (and one I'm sad to say I hadn't even thought of).

 

[robbyg]

Using multiple GFCI's actually is an excellent solution (and one I'm sad to say I hadn't even thought of).

There are so many things in this hobby, we never think about it until a problem arises or we read about a problem. I am also not using multiple GFI's but I feel a bit more secure because my controller will SMS test alert me if the power goes off. One thing I would advise everyone to do is always buy a top of the line GFI outlet. The first one I installed had a tendancy to trip if there was a brief interruption in mains power and it then returned (Basically even a brown out would trip it). I then bought one that was top of the line and after about ten years it has never tripped once. I test it every six months or so just to make sure it has not developed an issue. Some of my items are not plugged into a GFI outlet, but those items like the Vortechs are pretty much safe items.

 

[zalick]

There are so many things in this hobby, we never think about it until a problem arises or we read about a problem. I am also not using multiple GFI's but I feel a bit more secure because my controller will SMS test alert me if the power goes off. One thing I would advise everyone to do is always buy a top of the line GFI outlet. The first one I installed had a tendancy to trip if there was a brief interruption in mains power and it then returned (Basically even a brown out would trip it). I then bought one that was top of the line and after about ten years it has never tripped once. I test it every six months or so just to make sure it has not developed an issue. Some of my items are not plugged into a GFI outlet, but those items like the Vortechs are pretty much safe items.

What brand would you recommend?

 

[Brew12]

What brand would you recommend?

I personally use Leviton. I also think Eaton, GE, Legrand and Hubbell make fine units. I would avoid any discount or off brands.