HIGH END Tenuis Hoarder

[Dhaleillama]

From now on ask what par SPS sitting at veggie you buy from someone else

yea at that point all my coral was from TSA pretty much only, i think I lost 50 frags with my stupidity moving tanks, they were in my last tank over a year at 220par range i believe and I was slowly still going up.

 

[Heres_doe_]

yea at that point all my coral was from TSA pretty much only, i think I lost 50 frags with my stupidity moving tanks, they were in my last tank over a year at 220par range i believe and I was slowly still going up.

Man we live and we learn i slowly buy SPS till i know i can keep them. Start with cheaper ones and slowly make my way up

 

[Dhaleillama]

I also took out a mp40 that the wet side was rusting and replaced the whole unit. But I don’t think that would be the aluminum cause, I figured I’d see iron or something

 

[David S]

Ok folks, got my ICP test back, tank is about 4 months old, was doing great for the first 2+ months and then everything started going down hill. Anything in this test ( other than low salinity ) to be alarmed over?

Yes, you do have elevated AL but the real issue is your Iodine level. It is 16.74 ppb.
It should be at least 60.
Look at post # 1,329 by Shane, in this thread.

 

[Dhaleillama]

Yes, you do have elevated AL but the real issue is your Iodine level. It is 16.74 ppb.
It should be at least 60.
Look at post # 1,329 by Shane, in this thread.

oof. So how do I dose it properly? I have lugols iodine in a dropper bottle for dosing, should I use it?

 

[Acrofiend]

Low pH, low par and no phosphates is what kills my SPS. Also don’t forget your source water. Don’t forget to change the carbon blocks.

 

[Dhaleillama]

Low pH, low par and no phosphates is what kills my SPS. Also don’t forget your source water. Don’t forget to change the carbon blocks.

Source water was perfect other than some silicon slippin through, so I changed all 3 DI resin yesterday. PH usually good and nutrients, par is low around 180 at the top for now

 

[David S]

oof. So how do I dose it properly? I have lugols iodine in a dropper bottle for dosing, should I use it?

Tricky.
First off, dosing Lugol's is kind of powerful and how much would you dose?
You might want to dose a little as you are deficient.
But there really are no reliable hobbyist test kits for Iodine.
What I would suggest is to download Andre Meuller's Reef Assessment Tool.
It's free and here...
https://andremueller.e-junkie.com/product/1647022You plug in any element and it will calculate your make up and maintenance dosage for each element, based on the size of your system.
Andre uses Seachem's Reef Iodide. It's cheap and will probably last forever.
Keep in mind though, Iodine is tricky. So you will want to monitor with subsequent ICP tests.
Eventually, you might consider a homemade test for Iodine. Over here...
https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/using-hanna-checker-hi-707-to-test-for-iodine.743/It's a little complicated, but I've found it to be extremely reliable. It takes the guesswork out of dosing iodine for me.

 

[Dhaleillama]

Tricky.
First off, dosing Lugol's is kind of powerful and how much would you dose?
You might want to dose a little as you are deficient.
But there really are no reliable hobbyist test kits for Iodine.
What I would suggest is to download Andre Meuller's Reef Assessment Tool.
It's free and here...
https://andremueller.e-junkie.com/product/1647022You plug in any element and it will calculate your make up and maintenance dosage for each element, based on the size of your system.
Andre uses Seachem's Reef Iodide. It's cheap and will probably last forever.
Keep in mind though, Iodine is tricky. So you will want to monitor with subsequent ICP tests.
Eventually, you might consider a homemade test for Iodine. Over here...
https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/using-hanna-checker-hi-707-to-test-for-iodine.743/It's a little complicated, but I've found it to be extremely reliable. It takes the guesswork out of dosing iodine for me.

thank you very much for the help.

 

[David S]

thank you very much for the help.

No problem
Hope things work out

 

[Hans-Werner]

I see a few problems:

1) Iodine very low like already mentioned
2) Nitrate very high
3) Alkalinity should be 1 ° lower
4) Phosphate moderate low, could be higher (ca. 0.1 ppm), especially at this alkalinity and nitrate concentration.

This would be my approaches to turn the situation for the better.

 

[Dhaleillama]

I see a few problems:

1) Iodine very low like already mentioned
2) Nitrate very high
3) Alkalinity should be 1 ° lower
4) Phosphate moderate low, could be higher (ca. 0.1 ppm), especially at this alkalinity and nitrate concentration.

This would be my approaches to turn the situation for the better.

I usually keep nitrate around 10ppm, and phosphates .05-.08 range, and alk around 9.0. I feel salinity, iodine, and scorching the coral with 20ish par in one day jump is probably the culprit in the end. And I test 2-3x a week on average. But my calibration was off on my refractometer because I didn't realize to calibrate properly you have to warm the fluid up to 77 degrees and I keep my house around 71 so the reading is far off since my tank is 78 degrees.

 

[SBB Corals]

Ok folks, got my ICP test back, tank is about 4 months old, was doing great for the first 2+ months and then everything started going down hill. Anything in this test ( other than low salinity ) to be alarmed over?

Hello thanks for your post and thanks for posting your test results we always want to try and help here.

1st i think that the tank being so new is very prone to quick tank fluctuations. IT takes month and months sometimes for the tank to become fully saturated with all the elements needed. For example po4 and no3 take a long time to be fully saturated in the system which means that the paraments can swing wildly until the tank is fully saturated with all elements.

Also i wonder how are you making RODI water. Have you checked all your filter components and switched them out? when is the last time you changed your Membrane?

In terms of the triton test- I do see that the iodine is very low. in our Experience anytime iodine is under 30 it can be a killer. Not to say that the iodine at 16 is a killer but if any other parameter is off and the Iodine is low then it can affect the corals more. I think you need to raise your iodine asap to 90. THe problem with iodine is it is very hard to test for. The only accurate iodine test kit is sending in a triton test. THis is why we send in test weekly and every 2 weeks at the least. Iodine once becomes depleted become unsaturated very quickly and will drop fast. If you don't dose it you will be at 0 in no time.

your po4 also seems low. It shows .05. That is very low for my liking. We like po4 at .12-.18. If the range is under .06 po4 can become depleted very quickly and under .05 can mean death in some cases. Our tank we run high par high no3 and high everything LOL so po4 also need to be up as a buffer.

Furthermore your aluminium levels seem very high at 60. Most likely your issues are coming from high levels. Did you check to see why this is high? this is a killer for sure!

It's hard to pinpoint exactly where the issue is but with all those things above off i think its all creating issues with the Aluminium being the most thing that stands out.

I hope you can resolve your issue soon and please post any follow up questions you have!

 

[SBB Corals]

Tricky.
First off, dosing Lugol's is kind of powerful and how much would you dose?
You might want to dose a little as you are deficient.
But there really are no reliable hobbyist test kits for Iodine.
What I would suggest is to download Andre Meuller's Reef Assessment Tool.
It's free and here...
https://andremueller.e-junkie.com/product/1647022You plug in any element and it will calculate your make up and maintenance dosage for each element, based on the size of your system.
Andre uses Seachem's Reef Iodide. It's cheap and will probably last forever.
Keep in mind though, Iodine is tricky. So you will want to monitor with subsequent ICP tests.
Eventually, you might consider a homemade test for Iodine. Over here...
https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/using-hanna-checker-hi-707-to-test-for-iodine.743/It's a little complicated, but I've found it to be extremely reliable. It takes the guesswork out of dosing iodine for me.

Nice article on the Hanna checker for Iodine. we will try this and see if this kit works!

 

[David S]

Nice article on the Hanna checker for Iodine. we will try this and see if this kit works!

You won't be disappointed.
In the numerous times I've sent in ICP tests, I've had only one outlier (about 20 ppb which in itself is not too bad) all others comparisons were within 5 ppb.
Any questions feel free to ask me or you can ask Rick.

 

[Dhaleillama]

Hello thanks for your post and thanks for posting your test results we always want to try and help here.

1st i think that the tank being so new is very prone to quick tank fluctuations. IT takes month and months sometimes for the tank to become fully saturated with all the elements needed. For example po4 and no3 take a long time to be fully saturated in the system which means that the paraments can swing wildly until the tank is fully saturated with all elements.

Also i wonder how are you making RODI water. Have you checked all your filter components and switched them out? when is the last time you changed your Membrane?

In terms of the triton test- I do see that the iodine is very low. in our Experience anytime iodine is under 30 it can be a killer. Not to say that the iodine at 16 is a killer but if any other parameter is off and the Iodine is low then it can affect the corals more. I think you need to raise your iodine asap to 90. THe problem with iodine is it is very hard to test for. The only accurate iodine test kit is sending in a triton test. THis is why we send in test weekly and every 2 weeks at the least. Iodine once becomes depleted become unsaturated very quickly and will drop fast. If you don't dose it you will be at 0 in no time.

your po4 also seems low. It shows .05. That is very low for my liking. We like po4 at .12-.18. If the range is under .06 po4 can become depleted very quickly and under .05 can mean death in some cases. Our tank we run high par high no3 and high everything LOL so po4 also need to be up as a buffer.

Furthermore your aluminium levels seem very high at 60. Most likely your issues are coming from high levels. Did you check to see why this is high? this is a killer for sure!

It's hard to pinpoint exactly where the issue is but with all those things above off i think its all creating issues with the Aluminium being the most thing that stands out.

I hope you can resolve your issue soon and please post any follow up questions you have!

I super appreciate the response. I did find rust on my mp40 wet side so I replaced my entire mp40. I don’t run anything else that could cause it unless my pump is doing it and all my gear when setting up was all new.

I will admit po4 was hard to keep stable even testing 5 days a week because I have 60lbs of fresh Marco rock in my tank that was sucking it up like a sponge.

mover the last 3 weeks I was able to get everything stable and not having to dose on top of normal dosing for KH/cal/mag/no3/po4. For a few weeks I had to add dosing to all of those.

next week should I get another icp test coming? I did add poly filters over the last couple weeks for metal reasons. And I found where folks use lugols iodine and they use 3-5 drops a week so I’m trying that until I can get the Hannah checker and a better dosing chemical for iodine

 

[thatmanMIKEson]

Nice article on the Hanna checker for Iodine. we will try this and see if this kit works!

Please do, i was wondering about this too

 

[Reefahholic]

You plug in any element and it will calculate your make up and maintenance dosage for each element, based on the size of your system.

Just to be clear so somebody doesn’t crash their system.

He is right about plugging in elements, but it can’t be just any elements. The tools are built around Moonshine products mostly, but also a few Brightwell products, and one Seachem product as David mentioned.

 

[Huynhter_Soldier]

Man, I think I just wet myself but for real though.

 

[Reefahholic]

Source water was perfect other than some silicon slippin through, so I changed all 3 DI resin yesterday. PH usually good and nutrients, par is low around 180 at the top for now

That ICP doesn’t look too bad at all for your system’s age. Usually when you start up a new system a lot of elements will be elevated initially. So your analysis is actually quite good.

One thing already pointed out is the Iodine level is low. However this may or may not have contributed. Iodine does help protect the corals from light and it’s a much needed element, but your PAR is on the low end.

The Aluminum level is not really concerning. Most people have somewhat elevated Aluminum levels.

I have to agree with @SBB Corals in that most young systems are just not stable enough in the beginning. It was likely a fluctuation and if you weren’t testing consistently you’d probably never know it. .05 ppm PO4 sounds like a decent number to most, but in a young system it might not be enough. I think .08 and above is better until the system hits saturation and fully stabilizes. Otherwise it can swing too close to zero or become depleted. I’ve had Acro’s RTN at .03 ppm in a new tank. It’s just too low and the biodiversity isn’t there yet. On the flipside I had a Pink Cadillac STN due to a 0.1 ppm PO4 swing. It came form a very low almost depleted environment (yet well established system) and that swing was too much for that particular coral. 23 other Acro’s didn’t blink.

Your NO3 is a little high, but I don’t think it played a role. I’d be more concerned about the ratio and getting dino’s or problematic algae than anything else at this age. :-)