Radion low par

[slingfox]

Old technology. Much better options available now.

I've seen you say this multiple times, just curious what is the old tech in Radions ?

The Radions were originally released in 2011. They have gone through multiple generations with many believing the peak was the Gen4 which came out in 2016. Radions are built on a platform that is 15+ years old. LED and aquarium lighting technology has advanced significantly during that time.

I have been waiting to see if a Gen7 or more major refresh would come out since the Gen6 were released almost 4 years ago. I understand why coral growers get Radions (ie, they can get them at significant discount to retail and they output a very well-known light spectrum, etc). For hobbiest, I believe there are better options whether from a pure tech or value per dollar perspective. That said, Radions are proven lights so can’t really go wrong with them.

 

[rtparty]

The Radions were originally released in 2011. They have gone through multiple generations with many believing the peak was the Gen4 which came out in 2016. Radions are built on a platform that is 15+ years old. LED and aquarium lighting technology has advanced significantly during that time.

I have been waiting to see if a Gen7 or more major refresh would come out since the Gen6 were released almost 4 years ago. I understand why coral growers get Radions (ie, they can get them at significant discount to retail and they output a very well-known light spectrum, etc). For hobbiest, I believe there are better options whether from a pure tech or value per dollar perspective.

What technology is in both the 1st and 6th gen? What makes it “old” and what do “new” lights have that Radions don’t?

 

[slingfox]

What technology is in both the 1st and 6th gen? What makes it “old” and what do “new” lights have that Radions don’t?

The specific LEDs being used in the lights themselves in terms of light output per unit of power as well as spectrum. Reflector technology. Coatings. Cooling. The app. Every major component of a light can be improved. I used to be very into hydroponics and the LED technologies there still blow away anything in the reefing hobby. The cycle of innovation in lighting there is absolutely insane. I know that is not possible with reefing given the size of the hobby and how much people are willing to spend but I have zero doubt 15 years since the Gen1 and 4 years since the Gen6 that there is ample room for improvement on the Radion platform.

It is not a mystery why Radion lights aren’t innovating as much as the could. The family which founded Ecotech Marine in 2003 sold their ownership to Bertram Capital’s aquarium industry roll up in 2021. M&A multiples then were at all time highs and when you come under PE ownership investment in R&D tends to decline rather than increase. That deal was done out of Bertram Growth Capital Fund IV which was a 2020 vintage fund. That means the aquarium roll up Ecotech is part up is waiting to be sold when the time is right. No point in investing heavily in R&D for products which are still selling well even if the tech is outdated.

Perhaps Ecotech will come out with a Radion X line soon and I will be proven wrong. I hope so since I love to see new tech coming out!

 

[rtparty]

The specific LEDs being used in the lights themselves in terms of light output per unit of power as well as spectrum. Reflector technology. Coatings. Cooling. The app. Every major component of a light can be improved. I used to be very into hydroponics and the LED technologies there still blow away anything in the reefing hobby. The cycle of innovation in lighting there is absolutely insane. I know that is not possible with reefing given the size of the hobby and how much people are willing to spend but I have zero doubt 15 years since the Gen1 and 4 years since the Gen6 that there is ample room for improvement on the Radion platform.

It is not a mystery why Radion lights aren’t innovating as much as the could. The family which founded Ecotech Marine in 2003 sold their ownership to Bertram Capital’s aquarium industry roll up in 2021. M&A multiples then were at all time highs and when you come under PE ownership investment in R&D tends to decline rather than increase. That deal was done out of Bertram Growth Capital Fund IV which was a 2020 vintage fund. That means the aquarium roll up Ecotech is part up is waiting to be sold when the time is right. No point in investing heavily in R&D for products which are still selling well even if the tech is outdated.

Perhaps Ecotech will come out with a Radion X line soon and I will be proven wrong. I hope so since I love to see new tech coming out!

The LEDs have certainly changed over the years. The spectrum has changed many times. The cooling is different from G1 to G6. There’s only so much you can do with a fan blowing over a heatsink. I have no actual data but I’d say the G5 change of the fan made it louder even though they claimed it would be quieter. My G5s seemed louder than the G4. There was no app control on G1. I don’t remember the exact year the Reeflink came out but that was the first time you could wirelessly control them. Trying to remember back to the G1s but I’m positive I had to hook them up to a computer to set and program. Something “new” technology lights still use. The reflectors and optics are completely different today than G1 as well.

What generations of Radions have you used?

I’ve used 1-6 all over my own tanks including Blue and Pro versions so I could see first hand the differences.

Ecotech was not a family start up or family run business. I don’t know all the details but it was 4 friends (2 may have been brothers. I don’t recall) and it was these 4 who sold out to Bertram. 1 or 2 stayed on for a while but are all gone I believe.

I highly doubt we see a G7. Everyone that was there designing the lights is gone and I doubt PE brought in top dollar engineers to R&D anything new. Like you said, PE is looking to sell off and move on

 

[slingfox]

The specific LEDs being used in the lights themselves in terms of light output per unit of power as well as spectrum. Reflector technology. Coatings. Cooling. The app. Every major component of a light can be improved. I used to be very into hydroponics and the LED technologies there still blow away anything in the reefing hobby. The cycle of innovation in lighting there is absolutely insane. I know that is not possible with reefing given the size of the hobby and how much people are willing to spend but I have zero doubt 15 years since the Gen1 and 4 years since the Gen6 that there is ample room for improvement on the Radion platform.

It is not a mystery why Radion lights aren’t innovating as much as the could. The family which founded Ecotech Marine in 2003 sold their ownership to Bertram Capital’s aquarium industry roll up in 2021. M&A multiples then were at all time highs and when you come under PE ownership investment in R&D tends to decline rather than increase. That deal was done out of Bertram Growth Capital Fund IV which was a 2020 vintage fund. That means the aquarium roll up Ecotech is part up is waiting to be sold when the time is right. No point in investing heavily in R&D for products which are still selling well even if the tech is outdated.

Perhaps Ecotech will come out with a Radion X line soon and I will be proven wrong. I hope so since I love to see new tech coming out!

The LEDs have certainly changed over the years. The spectrum has changed many times. The cooling is different from G1 to G6. There’s only so much you can do with a fan blowing over a heatsink. I have no actual data but I’d say the G5 change of the fan made it louder even though they claimed it would be quieter. My G5s seemed louder than the G4. There was no app control on G1. I don’t remember the exact year the Reeflink came out but that was the first time you could wirelessly control them. Trying to remember back to the G1s but I’m positive I had to hook them up to a computer to set and program. Something “new” technology lights still use. The reflectors and optics are completely different today than G1 as well.

What generations of Radions have you used?

I’ve used 1-6 all over my own tanks including Blue and Pro versions so I could see first hand the differences.

Ecotech was not a family start up or family run business. I don’t know all the details but it was 4 friends (2 may have been brothers. I don’t recall) and it was these 4 who sold out to Bertram. 1 or 2 stayed on for a while but are all gone I believe.

I highly doubt we see a G7. Everyone that was there designing the lights is gone and I doubt PE brought in top dollar engineers to R&D anything new. Like you said, PE is looking to sell off and move on

I have only been in the hobby long enough to use one brand of lights (AI Blades). I have seen many tanks on Radions and love the spectrum as well as the results that are possible. However, I have been reluctant to pay top price for a light which seems due for a refresh.

I will soon get the ATI Straton X (arriving in one week). Those are priced identically to the Radion XR30 excluding the discount you can get on Radions if you are patient. Unlike Ecotech, ATI has been releasing new light models are a breakneck pace. That means the Straton X may be superseded by the Straton X2 in 12-18 months!

 

[ttbuc40]

I could be wrong but sounds like someone got a 100w Radion Pro and then made it a 65w light by running it at AB+ spectrum which happens the be the native spectrum of the Radion Blue running at 100w.

Nah I have the blues

 

[rtparty]

I have only been in the hobby long enough to use one brand of lights (AI Blades). I have seen many tanks on Radions and love the spectrum as well as the results that are possible. However, I have been reluctant to pay top price for a light which seems due for a refresh.

I will soon get the ATI Straton X (arriving in one week). Those are priced identically to the Radion XR30 excluding the discount you can get on Radions if you are patient. Unlike Ecotech, ATI has been releasing new light models are a breakneck pace. That means the Straton X may be superseded by the Straton X2 in 12-18 months!

I wouldn't assume that ATI is releasing new lights because they are "making them better." They may be making them better but they are also trying to find a winning formula while lowering costs to maximize profits. The Stratons look like amazing lights and one I would love to get my hands on but they are never available in the States, the few units that make it here sell instantly, ATI software is still rubbish from what I hear from those who have them, and until the new Straton X they have been extremely hard to mount over aquariums. Mounting and software have always been an achilles heel for ATI. It was my number one complaint when I was sent the original LED Powermodule like 15 years ago to test for them. I had to write the software tutorial myself and posted in on Reef Central. I also found a serious issue within the controller that ATI NA and Germany both said didn't exist until I sent video proof. An issue that plagued many of those units and I again had to write the fix for them.

Don't take that wrong. I really like ATI and their lights but for 2 decades I have watched them fumble release after release. Hopefully the X changes that as I would absolutely consider them for a new build

 

[X-37B]

I was measuring underwater so approximately 18" from lightsource is where I was getting 120 par. It is a 48" x 24" tank with 2 xr15's. I think I'll try the narrow lense kit as my sps are pretty centered on the top level of the rocks.

I run xr15 gen 5 blues on my
50g 30×24×16. I run ab+@ 80%.
Running 2 @100% produce 150 par. Adding the 3rd got par to 250 @80%. The overlapping of the 3 worked well.

On my old 80 48×24×16 I ran the same units ×4 and it will grow anything you want.
200 par on the 1.5" rack so only 12.5" of water depth.

 

[Hooz]

It never ceases to amaze me how people spend thousands of dollars on lights, then drop $60 on plastic, 3D printed light "shades" with little actual engineering behind them that block half of the actual light put out by the expensive fixture. I get that glare is a thing but, man... There are other ways to combat the glare.

Radion G6 advertises a "120 degree" spread, but in real life it is closer to an actual 100 degrees. The factory mount at 8-9" is the "optimal height" for those lights.

2x XR15s on a 48x24x24 tank will never get you SPS level PAR. Adding a third (and appropriately spacing them out) might get you close, though. Doing 4x XR15s and the narrow lenses will get you there. At that point you're talking real money, and there are a TON of other, "better" options that you could've bought.

 

[X-37B]

It never ceases to amaze me how people spend thousands of dollars on lights, then drop $60 on plastic, 3D printed light "shades" with little actual engineering behind them that block half of the actual light put out by the expensive fixture. I get that glare is a thing but, man... There are other ways to combat the glare.

Radion G6 advertises a "120 degree" spread, but in real life it is closer to an actual 100 degrees. The factory mount at 8-9" is the "optimal height" for those lights.

2x XR15s on a 48x24x24 tank will never get you SPS level PAR. Adding a third (and appropriately spacing them out) might get you close, though. Doing 4x XR15s and the narrow lenses will get you there. At that point you're talking real money, and there are a TON of other, "better" options that you could've bought.

I have to run shades on my xr15's as I cant handle the light directly.
Par is not affected by mine. The diffuser takes around 8% but its there to keep water off the lens.

I agree there are much better options and I would never spend the money on new ones. All 5 gen 5 15's were bought used for 1/2 the price with mounts. About what they are actually worth, lol.
One died but was still under warrenty so they sent me a new one.

 

[c4haskett]

The first set up I ever did about 5 years ago, I went with Radions. To this day, I regret this purchase the most. I got similar par results as you. On top of that, they always stopped following the schedule. One light would be on and one off. After trying several other lights, I have landed on Noopsyche.

 

[X-37B]

The first set up I ever did about 5 years ago, I went with Radions. To this day, I regret this purchase the most. I got similar par results as you. On top of that, they always stopped following the schedule. One light would be on and one off. After trying several other lights, I have landed on Noopsyche.

That is the strangest glitch on Radions I know about. I have been running 4 for gen 5's for 5 years and never experienced the problem. Maybe I got the good one, lol.
Noops are great lights for the cost. They are gen 4 Radion clones. I ran one on a 20g then gave it to another reefer in need.

 

[c4haskett]

That is the strangest glitch on Radions I know about. I have been running 4 for gen 5's for 5 years and never experienced the problem. Maybe I got the good one, lol.
Noops are great lights for the cost. They are gen 4 Radion clones. I ran one on a 20g then gave it to another reefer in need.

That's odd you never experienced that. It's a well documented problem. Lucky for you though! I'm happy with the Noops. They work well. What sold me was the spectrum. I love the sky blue look they have.