Unexplained PH drop, down to one fish left!

[Raul6741]

After a Day out, I came home to my reef tank being awkwardly still as I gazed on the tank. I noticed that all of my fish were on the bottom, gasping for air laying on their side the tank consisted of one yellow watchmen go be a breeding pair of black storm clowns, a royal gramma, pistol shrimp and a neon dotty back. The tank is the fluval flex 29. I pulled the fish immediately and put them in a 5 gallon bucket of new water higher ph. I did a 75 percent emergency water change. At this time I was down to my last two fish (clown pair). Tested ph and it was rising… hours later released fish back in after drip acclimation and ph is back to the 7.6 range and I am down to one clown. The water post change was 8.2 from the store. I then dosed alkalinity ph buffer by seachem and 2 hours later still at 7.6. My last clown is gasping for air. How do I move on from this? I know he won’t survive the night. Completely water change again? Why did the ph crash again after the 75 percent change and dosing buffer! Attached is a pic of the water tested at store. I’ve had the breed pair and most of the fish for about 3 years. Super sad to lose them all im tempted to shut the tank down and leave the hobby…

 

[Reef Jedi]

Not sure what happened to cause this but it sounds like there is a build up of carbon dioxide. One of the best ways to help raise ph is to make sure you are getting good surface agitation and fresh air into the house. Something is causing a bind of co2 and typically that is brought in by air in the house. With heat rising outside it can be typical for co2 levels in the house to rise and without surface agitation that can lead to a build up in the water. How long has this tank been running and did you change anything recently?

 

[Raul6741]

Not sure what happened to cause this but it sounds like there is a build up of carbon dioxide. One of the best ways to help raise ph is to make sure you are getting good surface agitation and fresh air into the house. Something is causing a bind of co2 and typically that is brought in by air in the house. With heat rising outside it can be typical for co2 levels in the house to rise and without surface agitation that can lead to a build up in the water. How long has this tank been running and did you change anything recently?

No power outages. No heater im in south Florida and tank is on warm side of house. Probably needs a chiller in future lol. No signs of equipment malfunction. I have a power head and two return pumps. Only major change that happened recently was that I moved. I put all fish in bucket with bubbler and tank in covered truck with sand still under inch of water. This was just over a week ago. I also used 50 percent of the original water to put back in the tank post move.

 

[Reef Jedi]

No power outages. No heater im in south Florida and tank is on warm side of house. Probably needs a chiller in future lol. No signs of equipment malfunction. I have a power head and two return pumps. Only major change that happened recently was that I moved. I put all fish in bucket with bubbler and tank in covered truck with sand still under inch of water. This was just over a week ago. I also used 50 percent of the original water to put back in the tank post move.

Did you keep the same sand in the bottom when you moved? Or did you use new sand?

 

[Reef Jedi]

No power outages. No heater im in south Florida and tank is on warm side of house. Probably needs a chiller in future lol. No signs of equipment malfunction. I have a power head and two return pumps. Only major change that happened recently was that I moved. I put all fish in bucket with bubbler and tank in covered truck with sand still under inch of water. This was just over a week ago. I also used 50 percent of the original water to put back in the tank post move.

Oh I re read your post. My best guess is when transporting the sand it stirred up a bunch of organic matter and created an organic matter mess that is releasing co2. This can happen when it’s exposed to air as well. If you have any bacteria handy I would add it immediately. Fritz or microbacter7 to help break down the organic matter. It sounds like it could also be mini cycling and with out adding new bacteria it’s built up co2 levels that the fish can’t tolerate. The clowns are hardy but it sounds like bacteria needs to be added. Doesn’t help it’s midnight over there so a trip to the LFS to get some won’t happen till the morning if you don’t have it on hand.

 

[Raul6741]

Did you keep the same sand in the bottom when you moved? Or did you use new sand?

Kept the same sand!

 

[Raul6741]

Oh I re read your post. My best guess is when transporting the sand it stirred up a bunch of organic matter and created an organic matter mess that is releasing co2. This can happen when it’s exposed to air as well. If you have any bacteria handy I would add it immediately. Fritz or microbacter7 to help break down the organic matter. It sounds like it could also be mini cycling and with out adding new bacteria it’s built up co2 levels that the fish can’t tolerate. The clowns are hardy but it sounds like bacteria needs to be added. Doesn’t help it’s midnight over there so a trip to the LFS to get some won’t happen till the morning if you don’t have it on hand.

Would sucking most the sand out and replacing help? The rocks still have bacteria and so does the media.

 

[Reef Jedi]

Would sucking most the sand out and replacing help? The rocks still have bacteria and so does the media.

I feel like this may be a double edge sword as there is still good bacteria in the sand however it being stirred up I think caused some of these co2 issues. Do you have any bacteria you can add tonight?

 

[Raul6741]

I feel like this may be a double edge sword as there is still good bacteria in the sand however it being stirred up I think caused some of these co2 issues. Do you have any bacteria you can add tonight?

 

[Raul6741]

Nope I got nothing. I moved the clown to a floating quarantine bin and put the air stone in there he’s upright and breathing still heavy tho. Lights off as well. I also caught a glimpse of my presumed dead watchman goby alive and breathing who quickly pulled back into his hole. The morning will tell how things go I’ll test water again and possibly do a water change if needed

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I actually don’t believe pH caused this problem.

It may be a coincidental effect of the real issue, or it may be unrelated.

I dont see a way that CO2 rises by itself except from some serious household device malfunction. I assume you were not using an unvented indoor propane or other fossil fuel heater this time of year.

Low pH may be associated with low O2 and/or high hydrogen sulfide, both of which seem more likely to me. They could arise from stirring up sediments to a large extent.

Carbon monoxide is another possibility. A malfunctioning hot water heater or furnace could be a cause. Do you have a CO alarm in the home?

 

[Raul6741]

I actually don’t believe pH caused this problem.

It may be a coincidental effect of the real issue, or it may be unrelated.

I dont see a way that CO2 rises by itself except from some serious household device malfunction. I assume you were not using an unvented indoor propane or other fossil fuel heater this time of year.

Low pH may be associated with low O2 and/or high hydrogen sulfide, both of which seem more likely to me. They could arise from stirring up sediments to a large extent.

Carbon monoxide is another possibility. A malfunctioning hot water heater or furnace could be a cause. Do you have a CO alarm in the home?

No it’s not co2 in the home. Tank
Is by the ac unit and front door.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

No it’s not co2 in the home. Tank
Is by the ac unit and front door.

Most AC units do not bring in fresh air, but a few do. In any case, if the air has normal CO2 and the tank does not, then more aeration will increase the pH, whether that is what’s hurting fish or not.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

Unfortunately have seen many posts on here where folks move the sand to another tank without cleaning it and end up losing livestock. Its the sand IMO, unfortunately its too late. The sand is like a diaper and moving sand stirs up all the poop and nastiness.

I would put the fish into a hospital tank and move a few rocks over to help with bio filtration, add a powerhead and an airstone. Then I would suck out all the sand, clean it properly (it takes hours of very hard work to clean sand!) or add new sand (but even brand new sand should be cleaned), and then rebuild the tank.

 

[ScottJ]

Unfortunately have seen many posts on here where folks move the sand to another tank without cleaning it and end up losing livestock. Its the sand IMO, unfortunately its too late. The sand is like a diaper and moving sand stirs up all the poop and nastiness.

I would put the fish into a hospital tank and move a few rocks over to help with bio filtration, add a powerhead and an airstone. Then I would suck out all the sand, clean it properly (it takes hours of very hard work to clean sand!) or add new sand (but even brand new sand should be cleaned), and then rebuild the tank.

He said the tank move was over a week ago. If the problem is moving the sand and stirring it up, would it take a week for a problem to show up?

I guess it would depend on how much junk was in the sand in the first place.

 

[BeanAnimal]

He said the tank move was over a week ago. If the problem is moving the sand and stirring it up, would it take a week for a problem to show up?

I guess it would depend on how much junk was in the sand in the first place.

Sounds like a possible bacterial bloom and low oxygen as a result. Maybe it took a few days for this thing to kick off after the major disturbance.

 

[ScottJ]

He said the tank move was over a week ago. If the problem is moving the sand and stirring it up, would it take a week for a problem to show up?

I guess it would depend on how much junk was in the sand in the first place.

Sounds like a possible bacterial bloom and low oxygen as a result. Maybe it took a few days for this thing to kick off after the major disturbance.

I agree sounds like low oxygen all of a sudden. Probably from the bacteria. Doesn't sound like a pH problem.