Trident FAQ

[rkpetersen]

So - this is just a question - and will see whether the answer is what I think it will be or not. Is it best to beta test with people who are really active, interested, motivated - or more the average customer? Im not sure how they chose who gets to test the product. But the testing is only as good as the competency of the people doing the testing - and their motivation.

The NSI testing group has people with various levels of experience, both with Apex and with reefing in general. However, since most NSI members got involved by submitting a very detailed application during a small time window, the process inevitably does self-select for people with greater-than-average interest and motivation. All testers are also expected to submit solid feedback on their experience frequently and install new beta software updates right when they come out. Also, NSI members who get selected for a beta test group but don't participate actively are unlikely to be invited back for future NSI projects.

The absence of comments here doesn't reflect on the testing in any way. It's proceeding, we just got a new AOS and Trident firmware update a couple of days ago. But we'd rather not speculate on questions that we can't answer, like when the testing will be completed. :)

 

[wesman42]

"Way better"

Thanks. That's helpful.

No problem! You've certainly contributed, so I'd like to personally thank you for your service.

 

[MnFish1]

The NSI testing group has people with various levels of experience, both with Apex and with reefing in general. However, since most NSI members got involved by submitting a very detailed application during a small time window, the process inevitably does self-select for people with greater-than-average interest and motivation. All testers are also expected to submit solid feedback on their experience frequently and install new beta software updates right when they come out. Also, NSI members who get selected for a beta test group but don't participate actively are unlikely to be invited back for future NSI projects.

The absence of comments here doesn't reflect on the testing in any way. It's proceeding, we just got a new AOS and Trident firmware update a couple of days ago. But we'd rather not speculate on questions that we can't answer, like when the testing will be completed. :)

Thabks that’s what I expected and hoped it was

 

[Terence]

Here’s a bit of insight on NSI that might help. We look for people at all levels. 80% of the people are chosen from having submitted a form with lots of detailed questions. Some of those questions determine cut and dry if someone will be part of the process at all. Others allow us to pick certain kinds of people or make the mix how we might want to see it. Sure, the mere completing of this form itself selects those who will at least invest a little time and give feedback - which is what we want. The other 20% come from picking people I happen to personally know their exact capability when it comes to our products and I know their aquarium system. And that doesn’t mean I think they are advanced. Usually just the opposite. Especially with people whose names you might recognize :)

Some big software updates to the Trident as well as Apex Fusion are coming soon and another round of NSI will be getting theirs very soon. So you will see more people giving their feedback. We are close to public availability.

 

[MnFish1]

Here’s a bit of insight on NSI that might help. We look for people at all levels. 80% of the people are chosen from having submitted a form with lots of detailed questions. Some of those questions determine cut and dry if someone will be part of the process at all. Others allow us to pick certain kinds of people or make the mix how we might want to see it. Sure, the mere completing of this form itself selects those who will at least invest a little time and give feedback - which is what we want. The other 20% come from picking people I happen to personally know their exact capability when it comes to our products and I know their aquarium system. And that doesn’t mean I think they are advanced. Usually just the opposite. Especially with people whose names you might recognize :)

Some big software updates to the Trident as well as Apex Fusion are coming soon and another round of NSI will be getting theirs very soon. So you will see more people giving their feedback. We are close to public availability.

THANSKS - very informative

 

[Reefpuck]

It's a product that is a good alternative, if you are looking for something right now. It burns through reagents at an astonishing rate, will require some tweaking to get going and it will not log in your apex at the moment. To counter this apex logging issue, it does have very good interface for storing all your testing results. It can also send notifications through push and email. And IMO the biggest benefit is that it is not stuck to three tests. Personally, I believe the Trident will be easier to setup, cheaper reagents and have more consistent results out of the box and I will probably end up using it for my big three testing, with the reefbot supplementing any tests that I want to do beyond that.

Good to know...much appreciated!

 

[stacksoner]

Unpopular devil's advocate post du jour: I'm so confused as to why there hasn't been one press release on the Neptune site ever about the Trident? Is there a patent application out there? I couldn't find any record of one. Has there ever been a live demonstration of the Trident actually functioning in real time?

BRS, and every high end LFS known, helped make the market for Neptune products via video promos, hands on instruction, and unwavering support. Is even one of these partners/vendors, letalone BRS, part of the elusive NSI group???

Every LFS that touts Neptune products is completely dumbfounded when it comes to info about the Trident and has no idea what the NSI is aside from what they read here.

I know Neptune's HQ rubs elbows with its neighbors in Silicon Valley, which is infamous for raising capital and generating fortunes through 'fake it till ya make it' hype. Let us not forget in his famous iPhone presentation, Steve Jobs used 3 or 4 different iphone prototypes which he switched behind the podium to showcase the iphone's features as the fully functional unit hadn't even been created or proven.

There's no doubt in my mind that the Trident started out as a legit project with honest intentions, but I'm almost certain that this disruptive device turned out to be a lot more difficult/expensive to create/productize than expected, and there was too much hype behind it to explain that it may never be completed.

Desire is the only thing that makes people abandon rational thought for the promise of fantasy. I'd love to hear what the inventor of the Alkatronic has to say about his device, which looks like it's 2.5x the size of the Trident and can only execute 1 testt which happens to be the simplest of the 3 tests that Trident offers.

 

[stacksoner]

-

 

[NeveSSL]

You've seriously not seen any of the video engagements Neptune has done? Because you're looking at their website? Surely you've heard of "social media" at this point. You should try there.

Brandon

 

[dcmartinpc]

The folks who have them right now have said they are working well. They are bound under an NDA and are limited as to what they can post and share. That’s why we aren’t seeing videos, reviews, or other information.

Once the NDA is lifted, I expect to see a lot of content released.

Don

 

[MyReefRobbedMe]

When you don't have a product line I guess you don't have to worry about it aging. Instead you have to worry if you just bought a product from a "company" that may or may not be around in a year. I mean who would want to deal with a company that's been around for as many years as Neptune, spends 100s of thousands of dollars on R&D bringing multiple products to market and has a lot better chance of being around in 5 or 10 years.

This can be a good thing or a bad thing . Not everything Apex is Great . Which I can vouch for my par meter and Wav in the closet. Don’t knock a company who has something to prove . You might just get something better because they put Their All into it .

 

[TTNuge]

This can be a good thing or a bad thing . Not everything Apex is Great . Which I can vouch for my par meter and Wav in the closet. Don’t knock a company who has something to prove . You might just get something better because they put Their All into it .

Agreed but I would have to say the risk is definitely greater with the new guy on the block in almost all situations. But there is a risk to reward value as well.

 

[MyReefRobbedMe]

Agreed but I would have to say the risk is definitely greater with the new guy on the block in almost all situations. But there is a risk to reward value as well.

Well said. I can agree with that wording for sure . I’ll be getting the Trident so I hope it is the Greatest thing since slice bread

 

[Reefpuck]

Well said. I can agree with that wording for sure . I’ll be getting the Trident so I hope it is the Greatest thing since slice bread

I'd rather slice a loaf of bread than having to test all 3 parameters twice a day!

 

[stacksoner]

So - this is just a question - and will see whether the answer is what I think it will be or not. Is it best to beta test with people who are really active, interested, motivated - or more the average customer? Im not sure how they chose who gets to test the product. But the testing is only as good as the competency of the people doing the testing - and their motivation.

Now this is a great question! Does Apple have its own NSI type of program for new products that they send to a select group of millennials, tech nerds, and aging baby boomers? Or can you think of any company that has done something like this? Google Glass is the only example I can think of, but their beta group wasn't bound by NDAs, and selection was massclusive, and more of a Willy Wonka Golden Ticket marketing tactic.

The first question is: do you believe the trident product is a fully developed, finished product that's in the process of being manufactured?

If you believe that it's complete, then NSI testing would only be for software related improvements. Since it's impossible to have a small group of users discover every bug, companies use their paying customers as an NSI group to get feedback and make updates. For such a small marketplace, this practice makes very little sense.

If you believe it's incomplete, then NSI is a means of testing a prototype and finalizing a list of parts and device specs before going into mass production.

 

[User1]

Unpopular devil's advocate post du jour: I'm so confused as to why there hasn't been one press release on the Neptune site ever about the Trident? Is there a patent application out there? I couldn't find any record of one. Has there ever been a live demonstration of the Trident actually functioning in real time?

BRS, and every high end LFS known, helped make the market for Neptune products via video promos, hands on instruction, and unwavering support. Is even one of these partners/vendors, letalone BRS, part of the elusive NSI group???

Every LFS that touts Neptune products is completely dumbfounded when it comes to info about the Trident and has no idea what the NSI is aside from what they read here.

I know Neptune's HQ rubs elbows with its neighbors in Silicon Valley, which is infamous for raising capital and generating fortunes through 'fake it till ya make it' hype. Let us not forget in his famous iPhone presentation, Steve Jobs used 3 or 4 different iphone prototypes which he switched behind the podium to showcase the iphone's features as the fully functional unit hadn't even been created or proven.

There's no doubt in my mind that the Trident started out as a legit project with honest intentions, but I'm almost certain that this disruptive device turned out to be a lot more difficult/expensive to create/productize than expected, and there was too much hype behind it to explain that it may never be completed.

Desire is the only thing that makes people abandon rational thought for the promise of fantasy. I'd love to hear what the inventor of the Alkatronic has to say about his device, which looks like it's 2.5x the size of the Trident and can only execute 1 testt which happens to be the simplest of the 3 tests that Trident offers.

Absolutely no idea what you are saying but I'd suggest you do a bit more searching and reading because the product is in the hands of test users now not to mention a video posted by the team that went into a bit of detail about it and showed it. There is a lot involved here at the end of the day not only with the device but with the end users and how they are going to use the product. We are talking about measuring something and it needs to be consistent. The regents or process they use has to be consistent just like the results. Then there is the end user who may perform an act based on said measurement.

I'm on outsider but can already see many of the possible things they have run into that maybe made them go hmmm....and rethink something which let to a late design change. I mean think about it:

1. Regent consumption
2. Cost of regent(s)
3. Measurement of regents
4. Tubing, longevity of tubing, clog, left over
5. Math, drop, weight, whatever is used to calculate dose and verify before measurement, etc
6. Programming of wizards / apex code
7. What to allow end users to do based on result
8. First round - report only
9. Second round - do an action based on result

I mean I could go on, and on, and on, on what they have to check before they launch this product. Imagine the amount of crap they will get if they don't. There isn't really much room for a oops here especially if there is a possibility of someone writing code to dose something on an incorrect result. That very well could be catastrophic. Just let it ride its course. Let the test users give feedback. Hopefully the power reefers and casuals will blend in enough feedback that it will be launched later this year. It isn't something I may even buy but I fully respect what they are doing and can see the challenge in developing this.

 

[Scurvy]

Does Apple have its own NSI type of program for new products that they send to a select group of millennials, tech nerds, and aging baby boomers

FWIW - Yes Apple, Samsung, Cisco and Im sure every other leading tech company out there has Beta groups. You generally known nothing about it though as whatever's being released today went through Beta groups years ago.

 

[MnFish1]

My only hope is that before they release the Trident that they have tested it much better than the Apex 2016 - especially if they are going to allot Apex program changes in a tank based upon the sesults. I think the are doing the best they can do and I applaud them in advance (if they are doing so). Me personally I would buy the product as a 'testing' solution - but I would never trust (not just Neptune - but any company) - with a new product to manage dosing, etc without good solid proof that it was foolproof. JMHO

 

[MnFish1]

FWIW - Yes Apple, Samsung, Cisco and Im sure every other leading tech company out there has Beta groups. You generally known nothing about it though as whatever's being released today went through Beta groups years ago.

well - at least apple allows anyone to be a beta tester. Judging from what Neptune said - they have a good cross section - which is awesome.

 

[stacksoner]

FWIW - Yes Apple, Samsung, Cisco and Im sure every other leading tech company out there has Beta groups. You generally known nothing about it though as whatever's being released today went through Beta groups years ago.

Absolutely no idea what you are saying but I'd suggest you do a bit more searching and reading because the product is in the hands of test users now not to mention a video posted by the team that went into a bit of detail about it and showed it. There is a lot involved here at the end of the day not only with the device but with the end users and how they are going to use the product. We are talking about measuring something and it needs to be consistent. The regents or process they use has to be consistent just like the results. Then there is the end user who may perform an act based on said measurement.

I'm on outsider but can already see many of the possible things they have run into that maybe made them go hmmm....and rethink something which let to a late design change. I mean think about it:

1. Regent consumption
2. Cost of regent(s)
3. Measurement of regents
4. Tubing, longevity of tubing, clog, left over
5. Math, drop, weight, whatever is used to calculate dose and verify before measurement, etc
6. Programming of wizards / apex code
7. What to allow end users to do based on result
8. First round - report only
9. Second round - do an action based on result

I mean I could go on, and on, and on, on what they have to check before they launch this product. Imagine the amount of crap they will get if they don't. There isn't really much room for a oops here especially if there is a possibility of someone writing code to dose something on an incorrect result. That very well could be catastrophic. Just let it ride its course. Let the test users give feedback. Hopefully the power reefers and casuals will blend in enough feedback that it will be launched later this year. It isn't something I may even buy but I fully respect what they are doing and can see the challenge in developing this.

The same can be said about the salinity, ph, temp probe test readings, but most importantly--the ATK system and DOS, which if they add/don't add liquid to your system at can result in a system stress. No shortage of people with issues with all of these components, but in the end, everyone likes their products more than they hate them, and has reasonable expectations of what Neptune makes.

I can guarantee there will be issues with readings not taking place, or measuring high/low/and everywhere in between. I'm going to stop now because this hobby is supposed to be something I do for fun, and getting fired up about nonsense defeats the purpose for me.