DIY Lanthanum Dosing

[David S]

Correction the Phosphorus level was 0.014 mg/l.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Curious that I was considered "deficient" in Phosphorus (0.14 PPM) yet smack dab in the middle of the "optimal" level for Phosphate.

Thanks for the update. It isn't especially inspiring of confidence that the acceptable range for phosphorus and phosphate are identical. Assuming it is just a spread sheet error, you'd think someone would have noticed it and corrected it by now.

 

[jda]

Does your hannah ultra low test out to that level? As I have stated before, I had to wait a few days after dosing LC to use a hannah to get good results. I am wondering if it is just me...

The great thing about ICP is that if you don't like the results, you can send out to a different one and get a whole different set of numbers.

 

[David S]

Does your hannah ultra low test out to that level? As I have stated before, I had to wait a few days after dosing LC to use a hannah to get good results. I am wondering if it is just me...

The great thing about ICP is that if you don't like the results, you can send out to a different one and get a whole different set of numbers.

As a matter of fact, I intend to send another test, in a month or so.
This time to Triton, which I consider the most reliable ICP service.
To me, their only shortcoming - if you could call it that - was they didn't test for Fluoride - which I dose.
However, they will be testing for it, shortly.

 

[areefer01]

Remember that due to binding to rock and sand, and release from that reservoir when you try to lower phosphate, one may see phosphate come back up close to the starting point within a day or two after dosing, and lowering phosphate can be a lengthy process.

I have been making an effort to try and manage my phosphate and see what you described. Bring it down, see it bump 24 hours later.

 

[Nano_Man]

Just taken my phosphate down using L chloride after a lot of thinking about good things I’ve read and bad . I used Randys recipe to the letter for mixing and dosing . There was no ill effect’s to my fish or Anemone and corals with the results I have experienced I have no issue using it and this was in a small volume of water 34L . My phosphate level was 1 and now sat at 0.01

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Just taken my phosphate down using L chloride after a lot of thinking about good things I’ve read and bad . I used Randys recipe to the letter for mixing and dosing . There was no ill effect’s to my fish or Anemone and corals with the results I have experienced I have no issue using it and this was in a small volume of water 34L . My phosphate level was 1 and now sat at 0.01

Glad it worked out . Be sure it doesn't get too low now.

 

[Nano_Man]

Glad it worked out . Be sure it doesn't get too low now.

Yep that’s the only thing with it . It’s that good at removing phosphate if you don’t go slowly you would bottom out . I started half doses at first to gage the drop in phosphate

 

[pixelhustler]

I have been making an effort to try and manage my phosphate and see what you described. Bring it down, see it bump 24 hours later.

It took over a year and a new sandbed to release all the phosphate bound to my live rock.
Which is why I would dilute lanthanum in RODI and use a dosing pump to slowly, evenly dose small amounts. Corals hate that heavy phosphate rebound, and the phosphate drop also comes with a (smaller) alkalinity drop.
I experienced the same with GFO. Thus why I favor lanthanum as it’s much more scalable and easy to control.

 

[Miami Reef]

@Randy Holmes-Farley

Does lanthanum have any reaction with silica? Will it use silica that I dosed instead of phosphate/carbonate to make lanthanum silicate?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

@Randy Holmes-Farley

Does lanthanum have any reaction with silica? Will it use silica that I dosed instead of phosphate/carbonate to make lanthanum silicate?

At the low levels of each in a Reefing situation, I do not think that is a concern.

 

[drbark]

I am also dosing Phosphate-E into my 200 gallon total volume system and have slowly seen a drop from 0.55 ppm (Hanna low) to around 0.20 PPM. My first initial ICP before dosing (this was totally coincidental), had no Lanthanum in the tested parameters. The second ICP test after dosing for two weeks resulted of 8.22 ppb of Lanthanum in my water. I don't know how they have the acceptable level of around 10 ppb as their parameter but this tells me some is leaching out into the main water column of my tank even though I am dosing it straight into my skimmer. My three tangs don't seem to be stressed at all. At least not from my general observation.

I am dosing 8 mls per day using my DOS pump hooked up to my Apex system. If anyone else has dosed it this way please let me know with your experience. Thanks.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I am also dosing Phosphate-E into my 200 gallon total volume system and have slowly seen a drop from 0.55 ppm (Hanna low) to around 0.20 PPM. My first initial ICP before dosing (this was totally coincidental), had no Lanthanum in the tested parameters. The second ICP test after dosing for two weeks resulted of 8.22 ppb of Lanthanum in my water. I don't know how they have the acceptable level of around 10 ppb as their parameter but this tells me some is leaching out into the main water column of my tank even though I am dosing it straight into my skimmer. My three tangs don't seem to be stressed at all. At least not from my general observation.

I am dosing 8 mls per day using my DOS pump hooked up to my Apex system. If anyone else has dosed it this way please let me know with your experience. Thanks.

FWIW, I wouldn't use the word leaching for something that you are adding to the water in a dissolved form. I'd call it "remaining" in the water, if, in fact, it is accurate and is also not just fine particles of lanthanum phosphate or carbonate that got into the ICP.

 

[drbark]

FWIW, I wouldn't use the word leaching for something that you are adding to the water in a dissolved form. I'd call it "remaining" in the water, if, in fact, it is accurate and is also not just fine particles of lanthanum phosphate or carbonate that got into the ICP.

Good point. Yep, I don't know what form of Lanthanum its testing. LOL gotcha on the leaching part. Since the fish are unaffected after 3 weeks of daily dosing now, I'm guessing most of it could just be Lanthanum Phosphate. But obviously it's just a guess on my part. I have not seen a major decline or need to increase my Alk dosing either. Thanks for your input. Appreciate it.

If this matters, I am collecting the water sample from the top of the tank and nowhere near the skimmer.

 

[TokenReefer]

Good point. Yep, I don't know what form of Lanthanum its testing. LOL gotcha on the leaching part. Since the fish are unaffected after 3 weeks of daily dosing now, I'm guessing most of it could just be Lanthanum Phosphate. But obviously it's just a guess on my part. I have not seen a major decline or need to increase my Alk dosing either. Thanks for your input. Appreciate it.

If this matters, I am collecting the water sample from the top of the tank and nowhere near the skimmer.

Can I ask how much lacl you're dosing?

Edit: 8 ml / day I see; sorry missed that at first

 

[drbark]

Can I ask how much lacl you're dosing?

Edit: 8 ml / day I see; sorry missed that at first

No worries. I tested my phosphates every day to make sure I didn't go too low too fast. I'm also watching my tangs a lot more than usual. I have some old live rock from my original system, so I'm guessing I will have to dose for a while until all that phosphate is removed from those rocks.

 

[TokenReefer]

@Dan_P does Phosphate re-bind until Equilibrium?

 

[drbark]

My phosphates have been at around 0.20 ppm for about the last 10 days or so, so I decided to increade my Lanthanum dosing yesterday just to see what happens. My skimmer cup filled up twice and my phosphates were at 0.11 ppm. My tangs were still very active and doing their normal thing.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

@Dan_P does Phosphate re-bind until Equilibrium?

I'm not sure what material you are asking about, but phosphate bound to a surface is in constant flux between bound to the surface and free in the water.

 

[TokenReefer]

I'm not sure what material you are asking about, but phosphate bound to a surface is in constant flux between bound to the surface and free in the water.

This is what I was getting at with my terribly worded post/question. I was under the impression that if Phosphate are present, that which is removed from the rock will be replaced... Idk if I'm wording it correctly