Prolonged uronema?

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Jay Hemdal

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Dosing of metro is probably ten times what is stated on the bottle.... the fish are eating too.
Are you dosing 10x the concentration or 10x as long? The highest dose I have in my formulary is 25 mg/l very other day for three treatments.

Jay
 
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Mywifeisgunnakillme

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It says one scoop of metro for every 10 gallons. Ive done one scoop for every one gallon in the hospice tank (24/7; everyday i change all water and add a new scoop to new water). They do not seem mind, eat well, and are looking better it seems.
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It also seems the (2 hour) baths with meth blue and antibiotics cause the red spots to flame up a bit, but the next morning the red spots look marketedly better... see above...
 
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One of the chromis, most heavily infected, is showing red spots still. They look better than a few days ago.

Doubling the metro dose again. Now two scoops per gallon, or twenty times recommended dosage.

It does say hard to overdose, and these are chromis (i.e., pretty hard to kill usually), so i figure worth a try.

My thought is these guys have a couple more weeks to show no signs or the hospice tank will get a chunk of live rock and become "pico bathroom edition" to the family. Actually, for a pico, not bad looking tank... lol. It's basically a tiny, acrylic nano with cheap LED hood.
 
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Mywifeisgunnakillme

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**tiny, acrylic, cheap nuvo (all-in-one design and function)***

I kind of like the tank, actually. lol!!

I may put up a build thread :)

Tank: $33
25 watt digital heater: $19
timer for lights: $15.00
USB wall charger: $10
Upgraded return pump (original stops working pretty easy): $18
Additional blue spectrum LED: $11

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Lol, blue and day light... once treatment stops, ill add zoes and/or mushrooms and/or xenia and/or something and clean up the wires.
 
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Jay Hemdal

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That one chromis has an odd sunken belly, not sure what that’s about, when this species gets thin, it is side to side, not top to bottom.
Jay
 

Jay Hemdal

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I am not sure about him either. He has been like that for many weeks though. And does eat. So, maybe like a birth defect?
That’s what I’m thinking, or a developmental issue.
Jay
 
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Mywifeisgunnakillme

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That’s what I’m thinking, or a developmental issue.
Jay

It is a tank for "special" fish, so... Seems fitting! lol.

I hope the symptoms pass with the mega dosing of metro. I'll give them another week of this treatment...

If no change, i'll change the water and run carbon, and they can live out there days in this bathroom :)

I think a couple zoo rocks and mushrooms and xenia and weekly water changes might survive with three chromis in there. Maybe... I filled the back middle compartment with Matrix in a bag from another tank (been in other tank for months)--so I think the bacterial load should keep up.

I mean if i was these special fellers, i'd rather live there than be flushed... Because unless the they show no symptoms for a very long time, they basically have no chance of going into a proper display tank... And if no display tank--it's this tank, or well, down the drain...
 

Jay Hemdal

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Don’t forget, Uronema is not an obligate parasite, and can be isolated from virtually every mature aquarium...so while it kills new green chromis, anthias and some wrasse, you never see it become a disease issue in established tanks with long term captives. Also, there are issues that mimic Uronema, without a tissue biopsy under a microscope, you can never be positive a given lesion is Uronema or not.
Jay
 
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Mywifeisgunnakillme

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Don’t forget, Uronema is not an obligate parasite, and can be isolated from virtually every mature aquarium...so while it kills new green chromis, anthias and some wrasse, you never see it become a disease issue in established tanks with long term captives. Also, there are issues that mimic Uronema, without a tissue biopsy under a microscope, you can never be positive a given lesion is Uronema or not.
Jay

That takes a second to unwind. So what is your practice advice?

Specifically, are you saying these fish could go in display tank? Or best keep them isolated?
 

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No, The fish shouldn't go into the DT if they have lesions of unconfirmed source. I generally wait 14 and more usually 30 days prior to the resolution of any symptoms before moving a fish to the DT.

Your title of the thread kind of says a lot: prolonged uronema. That is kind of an oxymoron, Uronema kills quickly once you see symptoms. Since this isn't doing that, I suspect it isn't Uronema.

Jay
 
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No, The fish shouldn't go into the DT if they have lesions of unconfirmed source. I generally wait 14 and more usually 30 days prior to the resolution of any symptoms before moving a fish to the DT.

Your title of the thread kind of says a lot: prolonged uronema. That is kind of an oxymoron, Uronema kills quickly once you see symptoms. Since this isn't doing that, I suspect it isn't Uronema.

Jay

All of these fish got copper, prazi, metro, and antibiotics.

what the heck is it is then???

Some weird gram positive bacteria that wont die?
 

Jay Hemdal

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Have you tried Erythromycin (Maracyn1)? It has been shown effective against popeye and my understanding is that it is effective against gram positive bacteria (although 90+% of bacterial issues in marine fish are gram negative).

Jay
 
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Mywifeisgunnakillme

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Okay, I have ordered a pretty good list of medications to try.

I will say, after reading about all the things this could be.... woh. I mean, definitely cemented the notion of quarantining is very necessary practice or you're just rolling the dice!

My thought is that this could be "hemorrhagic septicemia". Red ulcers on side of fish and popeye are included symptoms.

Ordered API melafix, fin and body cure, furan 2, mardel maracyn, as well as seachem kanoflex.

Out those medications, what do you recommend for treatment? In what order? Combine any?

Edit: looks furan 2 and kanoplex can combined:

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Edit: all of the above meds say they treat it... then i read this:
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Have you tried Erythromycin (Maracyn1)? It has been shown effective against popeye and my understanding is that it is effective against gram positive bacteria (although 90+% of bacterial issues in marine fish are gram negative).

Jay


The erthomycin proper i found was $150. So went with alternatives above... (mardel maracyn says erthomycin)

Probably try:

1. Combo of mardel maracyn, furan 2, and kanoplex together? All antibiotics it seems... thats whst they did when my dad was sick... just throw every dang one at him... cause it was bad..
.


2. Melafix is some sort of extract. Wonder if can use at same time?

3. No idea what fin and body cure is???


Noteworthy was that humblefish says that antibiotics can show improvement at first or show worsening at first... but ultimately work.... so always finish dose.... guess ill follow that advice...
 
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Jay Hemdal

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Yes, Maracyn 1 is the most economical version of Erythromycin.

1) I do not like indiscriminately mixing antibiotics - cross reactions can occur. You can probably dose Kanaplex and Maracyn 1 together.
2) Melafix is an herbal tonic, I do not feel that it has any real use as an antibiotic for active infections.
3) Me either?

Jay
 
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Little update. No new meds in the mail. Last day of metro dosing. One scoop tonight, 10 times dosage, then done with it.

Been maybe five days of ciprofloxacin. I'll do one or two more days of that until other antibiotics arrive. Just dosing in tank one pill instead of bath last couple-three days. Fish dont seem to care.

Two fish alright. All still eat. Last fish's red sores look better. He overall looks better except his eyeball bulging out of his face.... and he likes to swim vertical, head up... lol

Ill try other antibiotics when they arrive in combo that i read is okay. Hopefully works. If not, i just discontinue meds. If fish live, ill add some corals.

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I did clean up the install:

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Full fledge bathroom pico tank! Haha

New nicknames for these outcasts are:

Bulgeye, Gutless, and KindaNormal....
 
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Update:

All the new antibotics came. Dosing mericyl, furan 2, and kanaplex. Off other stuff. Fish, Gutless and KindaNormal, are the most active chasing each other now.

All except Bulgeeye.

Bulgeeye bit the dust, did his last swim down the porcelain throne conveniently located next to the Samsung Hospice Center for these special fish...

I have high hopes for Gutless and KindaNormal though! Few mpre days of antibiotics and then ill spruce up their under water abode.

I mean they aint moving, but maybe a coral or two and some sand :)

They did get macro algae today, lol...

 
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