Ratios for Dosing Copper Power

Brien

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What's the suggested ramp up period for Copper Power? I had been using Cuperamine previously and have switched over to Copper Power but so far it's not going so well.

I have a 10-gal. QT with a target dosage of 10ml to get to around 1.75 ppm. I have tried Copper Power twice and both times the fish were dead the next morning. My initial dose was 3ml with an intended 3-day ramp up period. But perhaps this is too much.
 
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There are MANY with more experience than me... we are in the middle of our 2nd round of quarantine. This time with an Atlantic Blue Tang. @HotRocks recommended starting at 1ppm Copper Power and ramping to 1.75ppm over 3 days. We will be 7 days in tomorrow with no ill effects.

On round 1, we tried to use a color comparison copper test and we were less than confident. On this round, we're using the Hanna Copper checker -- MUCH better.
 
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HotRocks

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What's the suggested ramp up period for Copper Power? I had been using Cuperamine previously and have switched over to Copper Power but so far it's not going so well.

I have a 10-gal. QT with a target dosage of 10ml to get to around 1.75 ppm. I have tried Copper Power twice and both times the fish were dead the next morning. My initial dose was 3ml with an intended 3-day ramp up period. But perhaps this is too much.
The use of 3ml copper power in 10 gallons is no where near a toxic level.

I have dropped several fish directly into a QT predosed with 1.75ppm with no issues. So a 3 day ramp starting from zero or 1.0ppm should be enough ramp up time.

How are you acclimating the fish?

Do you have an ammonia badge in your QT?

What kind of oxygenation or surface agitation do you have?
 

Byron malta

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I have recently been getting a few requests for how to adjust dosing with all of my research on the hanna checker and copper power being used together. Figured I would throw this up as a point of reference.

For anyone using Copper Power:

Bottle concentration will bring you to a Cu level of 2.5ppm if dosed as instructed. Although it is not always necessary to dose your QT with a level that high. Copper power is considered therapeutic at a Cu Level of 1.5ppm. 1.5ppm is the MINIMUM. I personally have been using Copper Power at a level of 1.75ppm using the hanna checker to make sure I maintain a level safely above the Minimum.

You can see @Humblefish's communication with Endich, the manufacturer of Copper Power in the thread below, verifying the minimum level of 1.5ppm

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/chelated-copper-is-chelated-copper.373513/

To figure out how to adjust the dosages follow these easy steps;

Total gallons x 1.475ml = Total ml to reach 2.5ppm
Now Take 2.5ppm / Total ml = PPM per ML Dosed
Now take desired target / PPM per ML Dosed = Total ml needed to reach desired target


For Example my QT is a 40b. Subtract displacement Add HOB filter volume. I have exactly 40 gallons of water to treat.

40gal x 1.475ml=59ml
2.5ppm / 59ml= .042ppm per ml dosed
1.75ppm / .042ppm = 41.7ml Total


I called it 42ml total. Ramped up over 7 days (6ml per day split into 2 doses, 3ml in am/3ml in pm)
You can then take the total ml needed for your volume and split it into whatever dosing schedule or "ramp up" you desire.

Edit: I should have mentioned in my original post if you are using the Hanna checker to test you can do so after each dose, or every other dose and figure out exactly how many ppm you should be increasing using the above ^^^ equation. This will also indicate if you are encountering any absorption.

Here are also some simple guidelines if you don't want to do the math above or are using visual test methods.
This is a little less accurate than above (Just trying to keep from going out 10 decimal points), but will get you darn close.
1.48ml per gallon = 2.5ppm
1.33ml per gallon = 2.25ppm
1.18ml per gallon = 2.0ppm
1.04ml per gallon = 1.75ppm
.89ml per gallon = 1.5ppm

No matter which formula you use above, make sure to take the following into consideration.
*This only works if you aren't encountering any absorption.
*You also need to measure the volume of water in QT, for example don't just assume a 20 gallon tank to hold exactly 20 gallons (You have to consider displacement and what level you are filling the tank to, also volume of HOB if you use one.).
*MAKE SURE TO TEST FREQUENTLY
*If you see signs of velvet it is not recommended to use the 5-7 day ramp up period, you would want to reach at least 1.5ppm within 48 hours.


API, Hach, Chemetrics, and Hanna are all suitable test methods for copper power.
Hi humble. If a protein skimmer is used in qt, should it be switched off during copper treatment?
 

Humblefish

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VJV

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One thing mags me on this Hanna Checker thing: all other copper test kits are either good for chelated or ionic copper, never for both. Why is the Checker good for both? Also, with a 0,05 error we are talking about 10% of the therapeutic level of Cupramine which is still relevant...
 
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HotRocks

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One thing mags me on this Hanna Checker thing: all other copper test kits are either good for chelated or ionic copper, never for both. Why is the Checker good for both? Also, with a 0,05 error we are talking about 10% of the therapeutic level of Cupramine which is still relevant...
It works for both, yes there is the tolerance of the tester. I personally believe that is is more accurate than the +/- .05ppm. Based on the fact that I can dose by syringe and yield the exact proposed target using copper power.

@Hanna Instruments can probably explain why the tester works for both. I am no chemist, some kits measure free copper, some measure total copper etc.

For instance the seachem kit will work for either chelated or ionic copper, it just doesn't read high enough to monitor chelated copper since it's supposed to be used with ionic copper. Same with the API kit. It will read ionic copper but since the range is so much wider for the test there is no accuracy at low levels.
 
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sean rand

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T
I have recently been getting a few requests for how to adjust dosing with all of my research on the hanna checker and copper power being used together. Figured I would throw this up as a point of reference.

For anyone using Copper Power:

Bottle concentration will bring you to a Cu level of 2.5ppm if dosed as instructed. Although it is not always necessary to dose your QT with a level that high. Copper power is considered therapeutic at a Cu Level of 1.5ppm. 1.5ppm is the MINIMUM. I personally have been using Copper Power at a level of 1.75ppm using the hanna checker to make sure I maintain a level safely above the Minimum.

You can see @Humblefish's communication with Endich, the manufacturer of Copper Power in the thread below, verifying the minimum level of 1.5ppm

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/chelated-copper-is-chelated-copper.373513/

To figure out how to adjust the dosages follow these easy steps;

Total gallons x 1.475ml = Total ml to reach 2.5ppm
Now Take 2.5ppm / Total ml = PPM per ML Dosed
Now take desired target / PPM per ML Dosed = Total ml needed to reach desired target


For Example my QT is a 40b. Subtract displacement Add HOB filter volume. I have exactly 40 gallons of water to treat.

40gal x 1.475ml=59ml
2.5ppm / 59ml= .042ppm per ml dosed
1.75ppm / .042ppm = 41.7ml Total


I called it 42ml total. Ramped up over 7 days (6ml per day split into 2 doses, 3ml in am/3ml in pm)
You can then take the total ml needed for your volume and split it into whatever dosing schedule or "ramp up" you desire.

Edit: I should have mentioned in my original post if you are using the Hanna checker to test you can do so after each dose, or every other dose and figure out exactly how many ppm you should be increasing using the above ^^^ equation. This will also indicate if you are encountering any absorption.

Here are also some simple guidelines if you don't want to do the math above or are using visual test methods.
This is a little less accurate than above (Just trying to keep from going out 10 decimal points), but will get you darn close.
1.48ml per gallon = 2.5ppm
1.33ml per gallon = 2.25ppm
1.18ml per gallon = 2.0ppm
1.04ml per gallon = 1.75ppm
.89ml per gallon = 1.5ppm

No matter which formula you use above, make sure to take the following into consideration.
*This only works if you aren't encountering any absorption.
*You also need to measure the volume of water in QT, for example don't just assume a 20 gallon tank to hold exactly 20 gallons (You have to consider displacement and what level you are filling the tank to, also volume of HOB if you use one.).
*MAKE SURE TO TEST FREQUENTLY
*If you see signs of velvet it is not recommended to use the 5-7 day ramp up period, you would want to reach at least 1.5ppm within 48 hours.


API, Hach, Chemetrics, and Hanna are all suitable test methods for copper power.
Hanks. huge help
 

Brien

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What’s the recommended duration to treat your fish? I’m at 1.75 ppm.
 
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HotRocks

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What’s the recommended duration to treat your fish? I’m at 1.75 ppm.
Once 1.75ppm is reached you have two options:

Treat for 30 days and then start removing copper via water change or cuprisorb etc.

Treat for 14 days and then transfer the fish to a second sterile QT.

It's important to monitor/maintain the therapuetic Cu level throughout whichever route you take.
 

VJV

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Then I wouldn't mix. I would do the treatments separately.

Also a powerhead aimed upward breaking the surface is going to give you the most efficient form of oxygenation of the water.
Hey HotRocks, powerhead aimed at surface vs airstone. Which do you believe provides better aeration?
 
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HotRocks

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Hey HotRocks, powerhead aimed at surface vs airstone. Which do you believe provides better aeration?
Powerhead will generate more oxygen than an airstone. However I do run both just to be safe.
 
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VJV

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My QT is a Innovative Marine Nuvo 24 and I can use the nozzles to break up the surface but also use either a skimmer (when not medicating) or an airstone, for aeration. But I hate the mess it does with salt creep.
 

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So I have a Linespot flasher wrasse and a melanurus wrasse in QT for a few days now waiting for the Hanna checker to arrive. I dosed exactly 1ml of Copper Power to my 10 gallon and now the Hanna if giving me .42 seems high compared to the amounts you guys are dosing. I’m familiar with the Hannas, I have several so I believe I’m doing it right. Figure the 10 gallon is probably only holding 8 gallons or so since it’s not filled to very very top. However still seems a little high no?
 

Daniel225

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Good morning
I was hoping you can help me out
I purchased a hanna copper tester
And copper power

I dosed my qt about 2 weeks ago
I did a water 60 percent water change on a 55 gallon yesterday during the day

Last night I got 2 lennadi wrasses.

This morning I noticed them swimming weird.

Tester showing 0.69

I threw in a bag of carbon cause I didn't know what to do?
 
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Daniel225

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Good morning
I was hoping you can help me out
I purchased a hanna copper tester
And copper power

I dosed my qt about 2 weeks ago
I did a water 60 percent water change on a 55 gallon yesterday during the day

Last night I got 2 lennadi wrasses.

This morning I noticed them swimming weird.

Tester showing 0.69

I threw in a bag of carbon cause I didn't know what to do?

20190315_052413.jpg
 

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