Removing refugium...maybe

[Njdevils1220]

Good evening all, I have a 120g barebottom system that is about a year and a half old now. I have been battling Po4 getting high and low No3 for some time. I have a 20g refugium on my system with a Kessil H380 light that runs 16hrs. Also note I use 0 mechanical filtration such as socks, fleece rolls, or anything of that sort.

The chaeto growth has been slow and I feel it does not help much with nutrient export based on how high the Po4 tends to climb. I have tried everything to eliminate sources of high Po4 such as using cleaner frozen mysis, eliminating all dead spots, upgrading to a more efficient skimmer. I find the refugium tends to be a massive deadspot in its own as well as having a tendency to clog the weirs of the sump baffles. It's really just becoming more of a headache than it seems worth. When I say high Po4 it seems to climb to .60+, I would really like to keep it stable around .04-.08 as its a SPS system.

With all of that said I am considering removing the refugium. What methods would be suggested in replacement that are effective in managing Po4?

Here are a list of things I have considered switching to..
- Algae Turf Scrubber
- Chaeto Reactor
- Fleece roller to eliminate waste before it breaks down
- Lanthanum chloride dosed into my bubble kings neck *I am weary of this as ive heard it can have negative effects on fish*
- Bio-Pellet reactor *never used one*

 

[Skynyrd Fish]

Have you tried a little bit of Iron? Seems to help my cheato. How does the tank and corals look?

 

[Njdevils1220]

Have you tried a little bit of Iron? Seems to help my cheato. How does the tank and corals look?

Everything looks good as long as the Po4 stays under control.

 

[bar|none]

brightwell chaetogrow. Totally changed my results with macro.

 

[X-37B]

Any pics?
Whats your no3?
How many fish?
I do not run a fuge on my 120.
I do run a 7" filer sock and change once a week.
My tank is bare bottom with a 40 breeder sump and tunze 9410 dc skimmer and no baffles.
I change the sock once a week and its plenty brown by then.
I feed 4 times a day with 11 fish in my system.
My no3 and po4 are barely measurable.
I know I have enough in my system as I get film algae on the glass every couple of days.
Tank is only 4 months old but all corals are growing and the tank is very stable.
I would remove the fuge and run some gfo or phosgaurd which I prefer to get the po4 down.
Just put it a mesh bag in your sump that has flow.
With phosgaurd I would start with 1/3 of a cup which is less than half of what is recommended. It will remove the po4 rather quickly so start low and monitor the po4. Once its at your desired levels take it out and monitor the po4 with daily testing. If it rises you can add it back just dont over dose it.
No3 is another story depending on the level.
Here is a pic I just took of my 120.

 

[Njdevils1220]

I have close to 20 fish. I feed once a day a little over a quarter size chunk of Hikari mysis. No3 is around 3.

 

[X-37B]

No3 is fine.
I would remove the fuge add a filter sock and run some phosgaurd and you should be able to get your po4 down. I would shoot for a stable po4 of .03 to .06 and keep the no3 where it is.
I would feed smaller amounts of food several times a day. Your fish will like it.

 

[hart24601]

brightwell chaetogrow. Totally changed my results with macro.

Same here. I don’t t know what I was missing but I had a hard time getting any macro to live before putting this on a doser.

I think whatever is limiting the chaeto will also limit any other algae based export. Sounds like nitrate deficiency as well. My phosphate does climb faster so I run gfo from time to time When my phosphate gets above 0.03 but it’s not often. I would personally probably dose some nitrate of amino acids and see how the system reacts.

Edit: I see you posted no3 of 3ppm so it would seem an element like iron is missing which will be an issue with any algae export. I would try something similar to chaetogrow for a week or two be be aware with phosphate that high you will have to slowly drop it with gfo/lanthium and get balanced with no3 long term.

 

[X-37B]

His nitrates are 3 so no need to dose imo.
No3 at 3 and po4 of .03 sounds like a plan.
Remember in this hobby
"Stabilty is #1"

 

[lapin]

Keep it simple. Go with some GFO to keep Po4 in check.
You are not growing chaeto. You are growing corals.

 

[hart24601]

The thing I like about my fuge is that when you get the issue sorted it gives you a buffer of sorts, rarely if even will drop nutrients too low and if they exceeded what the macro can use it’s quite slowly. My previously fuge less systems have been a bit more work. Than my current tank side shot below

 

[Njdevils1220]

Keep it simple. Go with some GFO to keep Po4 in check.
You are not growing chaeto. You are growing corals.

GFO nukes Po4 too quickly and is a bandaid. Looking for long term solutions.

 

[bar|none]

GFO nukes Po4 too quickly and is a bandaid. Looking for long term solutions.

I actually like growing chaeto and all the diversity and critters. Got feeder shrimp, mysis and pods in my tiny fuge and they get sucked into the display on a reg basis, and my fish hunt all day.

What does your fuge look like right now?

 

[lapin]

GFO nukes Po4 too quickly and is a bandaid. Looking for long term solutions.

ok
Then i would stay away from LC

 

[Terry Mattson]

Have you tried a little bit of Iron? Seems to help my cheato. How does the tank and corals look?

I have an h380 and dose one capful of iron a week. Cheto grows like crazy. I do run a reactor with a little gfo. P04 runs .03 to .06. Nitrates are low <5ppm.

 

[X-37B]

A small amount of phosgaurd or gfo works well to get your levels in place. I used it on my nano.
Once in place I dosed vinegar and it kept the levels in check for over 2 years. Like I said a little goes along way. Using a small amount will not bring it down real fast.
Just a thought and very easy to implement.
I do believe running it all the time is a banaid and not the way to proceed.
Either way good luck.

 

[krash7172]

I switched from chaeto refuguim to manufactured algae turf scrubber and good results. Got tired of playing with lights.